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July 20, 2019 09:22 AM UTC

Weekend Open Thread

  • by: Colorado Pols

Don’t think the sun can’t get you inside.


73 thoughts on “Weekend Open Thread

  1. I understand something and other people have opinions. I have understanding.
    My opinion is expert and I can tolerate to various degrees the uninformed having their opinions. Sometimes it's even cute or amusing.  But I have progressed beyond their opinion and I have understanding.
    But none of us is really relevant to the subject. But we want to be. Or how can we even matter or count.

    If it's brain surgery, or accounting, or rebuilding the transmission or flying, most of us will defer to those who know.

    But Allstate tells us that 94% of American drivers self describe as "good" drivers. And it's possible.  Dennis Haysbert has such a great voice the obvious Dunning Kruger inference is not so offensive as it might otherwise be.  I mean Dennis says it in general, that's ok. But spouse A to spouse B when Spouse B is driving, it's fraught.

    Opinions. Knowledge. Expertise.

    No information, low information, more information.
    Yet Drew Westen told us they all vote some way, and usually for the same kind of f'd up reasons.

    And Woodard showed us that the reasons derive from mental, social, cultural patterns that are regional and run deep. Really deep.

    Both Kentucky Senators make me crazy.
    But Kentucky voters seem to like them well enough. Sure KY has only 8 electoral votes. They are way over represented. In the Senate.

    And now SCOTUS has said partisan gerrymandering, no matter how extreme, is irrelevant and allowed under current law. Good luck getting new law to change that.

    But the low information hacks should shut up – they are a distracting bother.
    You know who you are.

    1. Even worse, according to the minority opinion in the Supreme Court's partisan gerrymandering case.  As SCOTUSBLOG put it:

      Justice Elena Kagan dissented, in an opinion that was joined by Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Stephen Breyer and Sonia Sotomayor. Reading her dissent from the bench, Kagan emphasized that the Supreme Court had refused for “the first time ever” to “remedy a constitutional violation because it thinks the task beyond judicial capabilities.” Kagan lamented that the “partisan gerrymanders in these cases deprived citizens of the most fundamental of their constitutional rights.” The gerrymanders “debased and dishonored our democracy, turning upside-down the core American idea that all governmental power derives from the people. If left unchecked,” Kagan cautioned, “gerrymanders like the ones here may irreparably damage our system of government.”  [my emphasis]


  2. Sorry that I'm not seeing a freely-available article up for this PPP poll, but here's their Colorado latest.

    The key takeaways…

    If the Democratic candidates for US Senate were [see below] and the Democratic primary election was today, who would you vote for?

    Dan Baer: 1%
    Mike Johnston: 3%
    Andrew Romanoff: 12%
    John Walsh: 4%
    Alice Madden: 1%
    Angela Williams: 3%
    Jena Griswold: 4%
    John Hickenlooper: 44%
    Not sure: 29%

    If the Democratic candidates for President were [see below] and the Democratic primary election was today, who would you vote for?

    Bernie Sanders: 15%
    Joe Biden:  22%
    Kamala Harris: 9%
    Elizabeth Warren: 19%
    Pete Buttigieg: 7%
    Beto O'Rourke: 1%
    Michael Bennet: 5%
    John Hickenlooper: 7%
    Not sure: 14%

    1. It is kind of sad when the former governor is only polling at 7%, tying him for fifth place with the mayor of South Bend, Indiana. At least Hick holds a two-point edge over Thurston.

      What happened to the old days when the state's governor or senator could at least count on Favorite Son or Favorite Daughter status….

      1. Oh, hell, that ended just about the same time that the voters could no longer count on their Senators and Governors to at least pretend to sometimes represent their interests . . . 

        . . . thank you oligarchs, thank you billionaires, thank you unlimited dark money contributions, thank you corporations, thank you Citizens United . . . 

    2. Hick has two planks in his platform: 

      1. I am not a socialist.

      2, Fracking is awesome. 

      These, with his “cool dad” informal demeanor, were enough to get him 1% in Presidential polls. What makes anyone think he’ll have more for the Senate campaign? Plus, he really doesn’t want it,. 

      Those of you dreaming of Hick for Senate need to accept that he’s just not that into you. Let the man go follow his dream of being an oil and gas lobbyist or a new brewpub owner.

          1. He is a moderate D with executive and business leadership experience. Historically, exactly what D"s said they wanted.

            But now we have Inslee, Bullock and Hick and no one cares.
            Mayor Pete and Senator Booker has mayoral experience, and another moderate D was Superintendent of a large, urban school district.

            I can't do the rest- like everyone else I don't care.

            I believe Harris will be the nominee – and I am fine with that.
            She can learn the DOD by appointing a great Sec Def and CJC.

            Hick is a moderate D – and so the left left hates him.
            He's a D so he doesn't put enough Trump states in play.
            So no nomination for him.

            IMO, people want magic beans.
            I'll balance the budget by growing our way out of this deficit (and the middle class will pay for it with $ and the poor will pay in blood and tears)
            I'll line item veto Fraud Waste and Abuse (which doesn't work like that)

            Hick is weak int he magic bean rhetoric – so of course his interviews are boring. 

            Biden is "frontrunning" even though his interviews are worse than boring – they're embarrassing. 
            Closer to Christmas he's gonna fade fast. Which is good.

          1. You are aware that there a slew of self identified, long-time, Colorado D's who know everything about great candidates and campaigning and how to be a D who have an equally long track record of losing, right?

            Udall, Campbell, Wrth, Hart, Haskell, Carroll, Costigan, Walker

            Lame one termers – and I'm not even referencing the never-win losers. Losers.

            Yeah- but they were GREAT candidates, real and true D's.
            Uh-huh. Losers.

            Michael Bennet and Edwin Johnson (also a Governor).
            Multi term D Senators.

            Ken Salazar is a special case- he would have been reelected, but he went to Interior.  I would love to see him come back and run.

            I will remember the 2004 Colorado D Senate primary all my life. Mike Miles was announced, loved, funded, organized and energized long before Salazar said anything about the Senate. I was so not excited about engaging on D partisan bull that I remained unaffiliated until the deadline for the primary.
            All I heard was about real democrats and real campaign practices and real this and real that.

            But it was from the losers, those self identified, long-time, Colorado D experts who needed a Presidential assassination and a lunatic R candidate to win Arapahoe county even one time.

            These guys should not be mentioned in serious discussion or analysis about how D candidates can or should win elections in Colorado.
            Their primary analysis is equally flawed because history shows that they would rather have the best, purest, truest D candidate and lose the general than a less ‘perfect’ candidate and win.

            It's been ending differently since 2007. But not because the losers were seeing it and adjusting accordingly.

            1. Wow, Madco. You go way back. You lost me when you got back before Floyd Haskell. I've heard stories about Big Ed Johnson, but who were those other guys?

              1. D Colorado Senators.
                One term D senators.
                There are a bunch of other D candidates who never won. And a bunch of national D potential candidates or nominees that were popular in Colorado but never won.

                The point is that these long term Colorado D's who are proud of their longevity and 'experience ' and want to use them to push others around or claim credibility should be ignored because they mostly lost.

            2. Colorado has a long term history of one term Senators — from both major parties.  Since 1970, the exceptions are Bennet and Hart as Democrats, Armstrong and Allard as Republicans,  and Campbell as both.  And they only won re-election once. Only Haskell and Udall were beaten — everyone else retired from the Senate to go on to other things.


      1. Had Hickenlooper gone all in on a Senatorial campaign, he would have wiped the floor with the Democratic opposition and Coreless Gardner. The guy wins elections in this state and lives a charmed life. He was, after all, the beneficiary of a series of events that still makes me laugh out loud every time I think of it–the epic meltdown that resulted in a GOP gubernatorial candidate finishing a distant third, behind the American Constitution Party candidate. 

        Hickenlooper has certainly diminished himself via that preposterous clown show of a presidential campaign, but probably not enough that he couldn't still have that Senate seat. Thing is, as you pointed out, he simply doesn't want the job. Legislating isn't in his makeup. Hickenlooper's ego won't allow him to be anything other than "The Man." Being one of 100 holds no interest for him at all.

        Say what ya will about Hick–and I've spewed plenty of negative shit his way over the years–but he most certainly would not vote to put more rapey alcoholic manbabies on the Supreme Court. Neither would Madden or Romanoff, who are terrific legislators and really want the job. Trouble is, they're not very good at elections. 

        1. Hick was pining for the Senate appointment that went to Bennet about 10 years ago.  Did the drinkin freakin frackin fluid affect his desire to be a senator? 

          1. I dunno … Hick was mentioned for appointment to the Senate seat and I think some of his friends probably pushed the idea.  Denver Post back then said

            “There is a different perspective that I would bring to the Senate if I were the person the governor would select,” he said. “This is the governor’s choice, and I’m not actively seeking it, and I haven’t requested people to lobby for me.”

            Sounds like back then, just as now, some people thought he ought to be a Senator — and Hick was willing to listen.

      2. What makes anyone think he’ll have more for the Senate campaign?

        Well, as a senate candidate, he is polling at 44% among Democrats in Colorado which is a good place to start. (Closest competition is Andrew "Let's Balance the Budget" Romanoff polling at 12%. BTW, I like Andrew, have voted for him in the past, and probably will again next year.)

        So Hick would start with 44% of Dems. Once word gets out that he is not a socialist, he will pick off suburban independents and anti-Trump Republicans who cannot stomach Gardner. (I am looking at you, CHB, and your friends.)

        Could Hick win? Yes, easily.

        Will he run? No. I agree with you, MJ, he doesn't want it.

        1. Hick would become the Joe Biden of the Senate race.  He is familiar and people back him … until he gets in the race. 

          And I agree … I don't think he wants to be in the race.  Maybe he can endorse someone else and make it REALLY clear he isn't running for Senate.

    3. I think I recall there was a DNC rule this year that said delegates would be awarded to those getting past a 15% threshold in a caucus or primary.  So the poll suggests Colorado's 67 pledged delegates would be Sanders 18, Biden 26, Warren 23 — everyone else's primary result would be "spoiled" votes.

  3. Unlike a few of the presidential candidates (e.g. Hick, Bennet, de Blasio), California loves Harris, as she gains strength in her home state.

    A new Quinnipiac University Poll released this week has Ms. Harris leading the field in California with the backing of 23 percent of Democrats and Democratic-leaning voters in her delegate-rich home state.

    Like several other surveys conducted after the June Democratic debates, the poll shows that a clear top tier has emerged. Mr. Biden registered 21 percent support, followed by Mr. Sanders at 18 percent and Ms. Warren at 16 percent. No other candidate garnered more than 3 percent support in the California poll.

    The survey also shows how much the race has tightened and changed since April when Quinnipiac last conducted a poll of California Democrats. At that time, Ms. Harris trailed both Mr. Biden — who had yet to formally enter the race — and Mr. Sanders, having earned 17 percent support. And at the time, only 7 percent of voters said they would vote for Ms. Warren.

    1. That is definitely sobering to think that in this upside down world, such an unpopular, incompetent, megalomaniacal narcissist ready to bumble us into war at the slightest provocation could get re-elected with 5 million fewer popular votes!

      Paul Krugman's economic take is only slightly more comforting.

      Deficit Man and the 2020 Election

      The Trump bump probably peaked too early.

      The first thing you need to know is that the Trump tax cut caused a huge rise in the budget deficit, which the administration expects to hit $1 trillion this year, up from less than $600 billion in 2016. This tidal wave of red ink is even more extraordinary than it looks, because it has taken place despite falling unemployment, which usually leads to a falling deficit.

      Strange to say, none of the Republicans who warned of a debt apocalypse under President Barack Obama have protested the Trump deficits. (Should we put Paul Ryan’s face on milk cartons?) For that matter, even the centrists who obsessed over federal debt during the Obama years have been pretty quiet. Clearly, deficits only matter when there’s a Democrat in the White House.


    2. R&r: does Elizabeth Warren have a plan to fix {partisan gerrymandering }

      Probably not,  but Eric Holder does.  For two years now, Holder, with Obama’s backing, has operated the National Democratic Redistricting Committee, which fights gerrymandering by focusing on electing candidates at the state and local levels. It’s a long term plan, and it won’t necessarily save the day in 2020. Maybe 2021, though. 

      Good to see that you are finally taking voter suppression seriously.

  4. Mad magazine, 1968. Anyone know who the caricatured politician is.? Looks like Teddy Kennedy, but that doesn’t make sense with the caption. Are those hawk feathers coming out of the sleeves?

    From Noel MacFetrichs post on Wendy’s Libtard Comix on FB.


    What prompted this post? $rump’s claim that the 4 congresswomen he vilified “hate their country.”

    1. The date, too, suggests it isn't Ted. He was still young then…so was I, for that matter. 

      I am thinking…Martin Van Buren. I know Mad used that face elsewhere…pretty sure, anyway.

  5. After a day of political news shows on TeeVee, internet politics, and much discussion with my Cat, I have a question for all my Pols friends….both of you.

    Who better exemplifies the old fashioned brand of fascism perfected by the Nazi party in the 1930s?

    T***ps'  Chief Hatred and Xenophobia Advisor, Steven "we will not be questioned!" Miller or famous war criminal acolyte and offspring, Liz Cheney?

    They were both interviewed today…

    We have our work cut out for us.

    1. I gotta go with Cheney — who, like Hitler’s number two, Goering — at least had some achievements on her own before sucking up to Der Fuehrer.  

      Miller is more like Himmler, a total toady who was absolutely nothing on his own and whose power came solely from kissing the behinds of the great.

      To quarrel with one point– you have many friends on this board.  I'd say our most popular members are you, notaskinnycook, gertie and michael bowman.  You all have many admirers and no obvious enemies.   Even the trolls like Poddy and Curmudgeon dare not attack you.  

      Pax vobiscum.

        1. Oh, go to those six dominatrixes you brag about hiring for your jollies, pervy boy, and leave real people alone.  No one wants to engage a troll, especially an uneducated one.

          1. I've never interacted with those people on a professional level, Bob.  I said I knew a few. They're friends. They're people, more than just figures in your repressed, sweaty fantasies.  

            People are more than just tools for your hilariously repressed sexuality, Bob.  They go to barbecues. They go to pool parties.  They go to friend's houses for game nights or HBO watch parties.  I could go into more details to try and humanize them, but, as I've said, having your gross, sticky, sweaty thoughts crawling all over them, like a slug winding through a patch of wildflowers, is just too much to bear.

            Maybe you should go watch some old Charlie's Angels reruns, or something, to feel like a real naughty boy.

            Ooh La La.

              1. Hey La Pomposa.  Does this mean you will confine your 43 daily attacks on R&R and your 38 daily scoldings of CHB to the insult room?  Or will we have to go on enduring your tirades?

              2. Thanks, Teach – but I don't follow the "ignore bullies and they'll go away" tactic.  Bullies like Bob need to be confronted.  You can be "above it all" , that's fine, and I'm not disparaging it.  I just have a different style. 

                1. Yeah, if you thinking lying and breaking the rules is a different style.  Paying six dominatrixes is certainly a different style.  And here, being an uneducated dullard also makes you different.



                1. Uhh, lying again, Curmy.  You were the one who brought up your six dommes.   How else would we even known of them?  

                  Try to make your lies a little more believable.

                  Your wife must be so proud.

                  1. Really, Bob? Do I have to post another link to prove you're a liar, like when you were confronted about your "secret identity" online?  Fine. 

                    1. One trick pony

                      one trick is all that perv can do.

                      his high school learning

                      ain't enough to see him through.


                    2. It's managed to help me keep a job, instead of losing it over being a naughty boy online. 

                    3. Curmy, my buyout was twice what you make at the car wash.  tee hee.

                      six dominatrix

                      hired by a freak

                      Whaling on Curmy 

                      each day of the week.

                      they must be breaking a few of the laws

                      but at least he gets Sunday off for a pause.

                      ta ta, creep.  I'm done with you today.



                    4. Sure you wanna keep bragging about your buyout, Bob?  There's no NDA in place?

                      And, I can imagine people paying a large sum of money just to get rid of you. It’d save a lot of HR issues in the long run.

        1. She excels at picking influential parents, daft one.  She had a couple tours at State that were pretty controversial.  She is the third ranked House Republican.   I'm no fan, but the question was her or Miller.  In that context, she stinks, but unlike Miller, it's not just Trumpstink.  Yeah, he's worse.

  6. This is why Polis is right to bring us to 100% renewable energy, why coal is dead, why we'll never need another nuclear plant and how we win the future:

    New Solar + Battery Price Crushes Fossil Fuels, Buries Nuclear

    Mark Z. Jacobson, the Stanford professor who developed roadmaps for transitioning 139 countries to 100 percent renewables, hailed the development on Twitter Friday, saying, "Goodnight #naturalgas, goodnight #coal, goodnight #nuclear."

    1. ….and in other news it appear the Fossilonians may not have been completely candid with the CO PUC.  

      Colorado Public Utilities Commissioner questions “whether or not Tri-State has been candid with us”

      At a Colorado Public Utilities Commission hearing this week, Commissioner Frances Koncilja said she has “some serious questions about whether or not Tri-State has been candid with us,” and reminded the attorneys for electric utilities that “everyone who appears before a tribunal has an obligation of candor to the tribunal.”

      They've been pulling the wool over the eyes of their memberships for years on the real costs of their coal endeavors.  They help funded the anti-Amendment 37 campaign in 2004; launched the preposterous and fake War on Rural Colorado campaign after the signing of SB-252.  If the PUC ever really peeled their onion and looked at their books they'd discover their income from 'unanticipated sales to non-members' actually constitutes the bulk of their net income.  They are by definition more a merchant power provider (thus should have oversight by the PUC) than a traditional G&T (that would give it the freedoms to operate outside of a regulated utility).  They did everything in their power to wrap a multi-billion Kansas coal plant around our necks.  They were defeated because of the work of a lot of interests that wanted a different future, not the least of which was the visionaries who occupy the board of the Delta-Montrose Rural Electric.  

      Let's hope that after this long journey by DMEA to open their services network to a new energy future they can continue to have the full support of the CO PUC.  



    2. Excellent article. A must read.

      Thanks for the linky…

      PS…Your use of the word “visionaries” is appropriate. I got to know Ed Marston back in the day. They, the DMEA, have been out front for a long time.

      1. If Neil Diamond ever re-does his song "Done Too Soon," about people who passed on before their time, Ed Marston would be on Neil's list. Was privileged to meet Ed a couple of times, back then. He was a real gem.

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