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January 23, 2009 11:24 AM UTC

"Surprise Surprise" Udall Voted YES on EFCA because of Bush

  • by: Libertad

With Senator Udall supporting the secret ballot, Union Bosses face an up hill battle getting this bill to the Presidents desk.

Boy may I have been wrong on Union Udall. With the departure of President Bush and arrival of Obama the basis of his YES vote has eroded. President Obama just delivered an escape route for Senator Udall.

“The employees get to decide…” he sounds like a Right-to-Work supporter … but then he diverges into the same tired old excuses fronted by the Union Bosses.

After all isn’t this what RTW is all about. Allowing workers to choose to join or not join and avoid forced membership and forced dues?


25 thoughts on ““Surprise Surprise” Udall Voted YES on EFCA because of Bush

  1. Because EFCA actually DOES give workers more of a choice. THEY get to choose whether to hold a second election or not; right now the employers get that choice.

    1. Workers should have a choice, to join or not join the union. That is right to work.

      Here though you pose the dilemma, what would happen in Colorado under EFCA? We’ll all have to see just how amended this bastard gets as it goes through the Senate.

      1. The Employee Free Choice Act would level the playing for everybody, but I know that is a big concern to some people. Majority rule is a basic democratic concept that union haters would choose to ignore when it comes to employee rights because giving employees the right to collectively bargain is just not something they believe in.  The open shop argument to advocate for employee rights is a joke.  If people do not want to join unions, that is fine, but then we should not have to represent them. In the private sector where they bargain on wages and benefits, that is not a workable solution.  The Employee Free Choice is long overdue. The economy needs to work for everybody.  

        1. Here is how the moderate Dems will get out of EFCA:

          Card check in, card check out.

          If it’s “fair” to eliminate a secret ballot to form a union, then it’s equally as fair if management feels as though the union isn’t working in good faith to be able to do a card check to de-certify.

          I honestly laugh in the face of anyone who tells me with a straight face that a secret ballot is a bad idea.

          1. Again, this does NOT eliminate a secret ballot.  How many times does that fact have to be stated?  The Employee Free Choice Act just gives that option to the employees for them to decide as opposed to a tool for management to delay the process and break the will of the voters. I honestly laugh in the face of anybody who tells me union busting helps line staff employees and working people, because the evidence clearly refutes that. Business owners and management collectively bargain as a matter of routine and the people who do the work should have the same right, which they are supposed now under federal law, but that law is not being enforced.  Be honest about the facts and objectives here.  

            1. Again, this does NOT eliminate a secret ballot.  How many times does that fact have to be stated?

              It gives that choice to the organizers. Therefore…

              It effectively eliminates a prime tenet of Democracy, so stop lying about it and acting like nobody’s going to notice.

              I don’t want to bust unions.  Just make the unions valuable enough to workers that in an election they’d vote to unionize.  Pretty simple.

              1. Keeping people from forming and joining union is what eliminates democracy and that is precisely what most opponents of the Employee Free Act Choice are trying to do. Why don’t you just tell the truth?  You do not want to see employees have power in the workplace or any formal power at all for that matter.  Like most regressives (conservatives) you like “at will” workplaces where employees are just “lucky to have a job”. I bet The Chinese government would be proud of you! 🙂  

                The argument that the secret ballot is some kind of holy grail for voting is also a big sham argument. Most votes are done in the open in Congress and throughout society. Secret ballots are generally used when people are running against people and NOT when choosing to join a group or organization. Think about it and give me some examples of where secret ballots are used when joining organizations?  You will be hard pressed to find one.  How did you join the Republican party?  Tell the truth there laughing boy.  Again, I maintain that most opponents of the Employee Free Choice Act have one goal in mind –  keep unions from gaining more members, stop people from the exercise of free will and the democratic principle of majority rule; because it would upset the trickle down economics so cherished by the failing Republican party.  You know it and any objective observer knows it.  

                  1. Guess you could not come up with any other secret ballots to join organizations,  As for your question, I think union security clauses are a negotiable item. Your idea is too simplistic to make a judgement on, but I am certainly not opposed to giving members appeal rights against unions.  They have them now. In most cases, elections solve the problems you may be referring to, but again, you have not explained your idea and frankly we may have to agree to disagree, so to speak. Your comments that I am a “disaster” and stating that I am “lying” seem pretty extreme even if you disagree with me.  Maybe you have been taking examples from Libertad. Take care.        

                    1. Saying the Chinese would be proud of me.  We are watching the demise of the US auto industry (among others) almost solely because of greedy union involvement and manipulation.

                      What we are seeing is the beginning of a series of bailouts that will turn autoworkers into government workers.

                      That sounds a lot more like China than anything else I talk about…

                      There is a good reason that unions are getting their asses kicked in secret ballots.

                    2. The Business elites are running smear campaigns against them you jackass. They’re not honest in any aspect.

                      In this age of corporate corruption, which has largely contributed to crumbling of our economy you’re fucking giggling over the strangling of workers who organize for health care and fair wages? What a prick you can be.  

                    3. No giggling. I want you union types to enter a discussion about how you think somehow not voting in secret enhances fairness in any way.

                      What do you think about adding a provision to efca that allows unions to be decertified with a card check?

                    4. it’s a smoke screen. Your premise is false and your following up with hypotheticals to it; which is completely ridiculous.

                      Why is it Republicans always want to make voting harder, less accessible, less open to the masses?  

                    5. to be voting, GB – not two union guys coming to your house and asking you to sign a card.

                    6. EFCA DOES NOT ELIMINATE THE SECRET BALLOT. That’s not an opinion – it doesn’t do what you’re saying.

                    7. EFCA DOES NOT ELIMINATE THE SECRET BALLOT. That’s not an opinion – it doesn’t do what you’re saying.

                      When will the chamber, colorado concern, etc… and rest of the business labor coalition get this through their thick skulls and stop opposing EFCA?

                      I call for a chamber and concern coalition meeting to be hosted by Bane and Blake.

                    8. You know that it for all intents and purposes absolutely eliminates the secret ballot.

                      I ask again.  Are you opposed to card check for de-certification if it’s in there for certification?

                    9. At the end of the day this great movement will implode. Tyrone was kickin’ it with a $200k+ salary.

                      Andy Stern decides your leadership, dues, programs, spending, issues, etc…

                    10. Prospective Union members are being denied lawful representation because of sleazy authoritarians with dictator mind sets like you. Attacking “Governments workers” is a typical right wing tactic without cause or  reason than 80’s Reaganism which led right to what we have had the last eight years.  The myth that the private sector is more deficient is exactly that, political carping.  Take a hike Whining Boy.      

                    11. You want to take away a secret ballot and I’m a dictator?

                      The myth that the private sector is more deficient is exactly that, political carping.

                      Haha! I agree completely.  You should stop carping.

                    12. I made a typo as I think  you know,  I meant to write “efficient”, not deficient, and again, nothing the Employee Free Choice Act Bill, “takes away a secret ballot” as I already explained. But keep your talking points and misrepresent the facts.  

                    13. It’s ok.  Subconsciously you’ve seen the light, apparently.

                      Do you disagree that EFCA will effectively remove the secret ballot from the process?  Are you telling me with a straight face that union organizers would in any circumstance choose a secret ballot?

                      You can keep pissing on your friends’ backs and tell them it’s raining, but it just isn’t.

                      A secret ballot shouldn’t be a threat to anyone.  What does that tell you that it’s even a consideration for the unions?

                    14. Again, the membership could call for the ballot if they wished, but you are ignoring the real issue.  The issue is the application of Federal law, which states in part;  

                      Sec. 7. [Sec. 157.] Employees shall have the right to self- organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection, and shall also have the right to refrain from any or all such activities except to the extent that such right may be affected by an agreement requiring membership in a labor organization as a condition of employment as authorized in section 8(a)(3) [section 158(a)(3) of this title].

                      This is nothing in the law that says it is ok for employers manipulate the clear intent of the law and use the process, any process to get around what the law actually says. Joining a union is right, period. But that is not the case in this country and no amount of political maneuvering is going to change the fact that millions more Americans would join unions if they could.  It is a sham argument when our opponents try to make the case that they are protecting worker rights. They are trying to maintain the status quo to deny workers rights. Let’s be honest about it. This is about the application of federal law. You know it, I know it and any objective observer knows it.  I have been elected and defeated on secret ballots in union elections many times, but never on the question of membership. If management had wanted to get in the way of election, they certainly could have and that is what is happening.

                      The process to form and join unions is broken and the Employee Free Choice Act would help reform the law. It is needed and would go a long way to help the middle class.  

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