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June 13, 2016 11:49 AM UTC

Terror, hate, and guns

  • 21 Comments
  • by: ProgressNow Colorado

(Promoted by Colorado Pols)

The shocking violence committed against LGBT Americans in Orlando this weekend has horrified us all. This weekend’s attack on the Pulse nightclub brought together the combined threats of terrorism, gun violence, and bigotry our nation faces today.

Is it time for the nation to follow Colorado’s model on gun safety? Click here to say yes.

Here in Colorado, we took action after the Aurora theater shootings to reduce the threat of gun violence. In 2013 we tightened background checks, limited gun magazine capacity, and made it harder for dangerous domestic violence offenders to have guns. Our state’s painful history of mass murder has forced us to take the lead in finding solutions to gun violence.

No law has perfect compliance. Criminals by definition are lawbreakers. But in Colorado, we know that our gun laws have saved lives. In 2015 alone, over 7,700 criminals attempting to buy guns in Colorado were stopped by universal background checks–including 22 arrested or convicted of homicide, 17 for kidnapping, and 130 for sexual assault. In addition, 251 fugitives attempting to buy a gun were arrested on site. [1] We know that a pause to reload a semiautomatic weapon saves lives in mass shootings. And we know that protecting victims of violence from more violence is the right thing to do.

Sign our petition now: it’s time for the nation to follow Colorado’s lead. It’s time for America to get serious about stopping gun violence. And hatred of LGBT Americans. And terrorism that threatens us all.

Comments

21 thoughts on “Terror, hate, and guns

  1. Lies! None of the Colorado laws would have stopped the Orlando shooting. The shooter passed background checks to buy his guns.

    It makes me sick that you can't even wait until the bodies are buried before going right back to lies and gun control. Sick and sad.

    1. Actually, the SB197 domestic violence gun bill (I thank Evie Hudak every time – and it is her birthday!) would have prevented the shooter from buying and possessing a gun, if there was a restraining order in effect.

      It's been widely reported that the shooter abused his wife – but it doesn't say if he was convicted, or had a restraining order in effect. She  left the state to get away from him. Ex-father in law said that "cops were called", but not what the resolution was.

      1. I saw a report on CNN this evening saying that his ex-wife never pursued charges against him for fear of damaging his career and his ability to support his family

    2. Pretty sure that AR-15 was using high-capacity mags. Maybe they were Magpul?

      Like Pols says, a pause to reload can be measured in lives saved. So you're wrong and STFU.

    3. And where, Modster is your outrage that, before the bodies are buried, Trump is gleefully thanking his supporters for all their congrats to him about being right? About what I'm not sure. He just keeps repeating that we have to keep Muslims who aren't vetted out of the country (They're now vetted, many going through up to 2 years of vetting) in response to a shooting by one who was born here 29 years ago.

      So… the man didn't wait a second before expressing his personal, all about himself happiness that his fans think he's right(?) in the face of this tragedy and proposes a solution that bears no relation to what happened, proving once again that he's not only a sociopathic narcissist but a sociopathic narcissist who doesn't know WTF he's talking about.

      But I don't see you complaining about him…… anymore. You used to when you were following the lemmings in your party over the cliff. I don't see you saying it's a lie that banning Muslims from entering this country would have prevented  a shooting by a natural born citizen. I don't see you saying "lie" when he claims the problem can be solved by blanket bombing.  And I know you don't have the guts to explain yourself.  

        1. Banning Muslims from entering the country is a military action? You make fake sense. I'd ask again but I'm pretty sure you don't want any part of explaining to me how banning Muslims from entering the country would prevent 29 year old American citizens from committing acts of terror.

  2. Reducing high capacity mags is a small step but the ban is on new sales only and there are many high capacity mags out there for black market sale.  

    1. There's lots of everything available on the  black market and that would include any banned weapons. But the fact is lots of the kinds of people who commit  mass murder shootings aren't criminals with underworld connections and it wouldn't be nearly as easy for those types as it is now with such easy legal access.

      Even more sadly while these types of killings, often by a deranged individual though sometimes with terrorist intent, get all the coverage, most casualties of gun violence are of the garden variety involving quite ordinary, common as dirt weapons or cheap Saturday night specials and the like in domestic violence, suicides, robberies, drug dealing disputes, turf disputes and the like, not mass shootings. It's a very tough cultural problem.  

      Cutting down on mass murders by terrorists and nut cases is a more doable, though much smaller segment of the solution and we have to start somewhere. That seems a good place to start.

       

      1. Well said. I wonder if the gun was illegally obtained  if it would change the perception. If AR15s and high cap mags were banned nationwide, and this nutcase got a hold of one and did the same atrocity, what is the argument?

        What a horrible, horrible thing this guy did. Even as a gun nut it is hard to see past the devastating effects of guns in the wrong hands.  

        1. We don't know if this guy would have known how to obtain it illegally. He didn't have to. Easy as pie. And BTW, Negev, nice to see you here again, though I wish it could be under happier circumstances.

          1. Thanks BC, I do wish the circumstances were better. I still wonder what the narrative would be had this guy, or even the next, is in illegal possession of a banned weapon/magazine with the same results. Whats next? I see from the "other" side innovations that will make it difficult to eliminate the AR platform from proliferation through legislation. Since Sandy Hook the gun community has provided manufacturing processes that lead me to believe obtaining a functioning AR, legal or not, will be easier than ever. Recent releases such as the AR15mold and the ghost gunner allow anyone to produce the "gun" part of an AR at home with absolutely no skill whatsoever – look at these links please:

            http://ar15mold.com/freedom-15-5-kit/

            https://ghostgunner.net/

            This systematically eliminates the need for skill, tools or legal supply of previously required serialized part of the weapon. No background check, no dealer, no ability to trace. Its scary to even me to think of the possibilities in the wrong hands.

            So while I understand, respect, and at this point have little reason to argue the points made in this thread, the illegal acquisition of the same items used in this tragedy are readily available the moment the legal source is removed. 

            So I humbly ask, with tears in my eyes from watching happy, loving people mowed down by a psycho-killer:

            What are you going to do when the guns are illegal and the killing continues? 

             

              1. At this point its relatively clear that unless there is a wholesale removal of these weapons, they will always be there. By that I mean ban, no grandfather, full confiscation, door to door removal with force to those who do not comply. Anything less does not pose a solution. 

                So when I hear time and again "We are not coming for your guns", you should be. And Bubba toothless in backwoods 'bama cannot be fooled anymore into thinking this is not the end game. The unfortunate reality is now it just won't matter. 

                My only suggestion for a solution is to study these tragedies and learn from them. Its become very clear the manner in which to stop this once its started, however less clear how to prevent them from starting. 

                 

                1. Confiscating the guns is completely impractical (and probably unconstitutional).  But making ammo harder/more expensive to acquire isn't.  An excise tax for all ammo sales (particularly for the deadliest and most popular types for assault type weapons) would take a lot of effort and courage to pass, but it would be legal and an effective start.

                2. Just license guns, require carrying of insurance. Each individual gun wouldn't necessarily require a new license, but there should be limits on how many weapons each license covers.

                  The responsible gun owner who shows her/his kids gun safety, stores them in a gun safe, uses only for target practice and hunting should not be charged at the same rate as the irresponsible owner who keeps loaded guns around the house in the reach of kids, poses naked with them (no thanks, guys, really don't need to see ammosexual guy again), and insists on carrying them publicly wherever he/she goes.

                  The person who owns a machine gun or AR15 should be charged liability insurance like the guy who owns a Ferrari. Much more money.

                  And people should be able to lose their gun licenses. No "three strikes you're out", but a "one strike you're out" rule. That is, one incident of a weapon being fired outside of a shooting range or hunting environment, one child or dangerous person getting access, one domestic violence incident, one violent crime of any kind, and no guns for you.

                  No, this wouldn't be a comprehensive solution – you'd still need background checks and denials, and in some cases confiscation, but it would be a piece of the solution.

  3. That seems a good place to start.

    Yes it is.    And we say that after every one of these atrocities.  And that start never happens.  Will this time really be different?  Or will the gun makers flip another million to the NRA from their profits from the latest round of panic sales and laugh  their heads off as yet another "good start" fizzles out?

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