(No matter how you feel about Scott Gessler’s quest to purge the voter rolls of a comparatively tiny number of “problem” registrations, it’s not worth the disproportionate damage he’s doing to the GOP brand. This fool’s errand will have electoral consequences, and not the way Gessler had hoped. – promoted by Colorado Pols)
POLS UPDATE: AP’s Ivan Moreno:
State officials were able to run 1,400 of those names through a federal immigration database and found that more than 1,200 were U.S. citizens. So far, they’ve found none who are non-citizens and registered to vote.
Martha Tierney, an attorney for the Colorado Democratic Party, told election officials during a meeting Wednesday that they were wasting their time on a small group of voters instead of focusing on ensuring a fair and accurate fall election. [Pols emphasis]
“This is a witch hunt and you should be embarrassed that you’re going down this road,” she said.
The Denver paper is reporting that SOS Gessler ran 1,400 of 3,900 people he sent lettters to demanding they prove their citizenship through the Homeland Security database and guess what: All but 168 of the individuals turned out to be United States citizens and the SOS staff admitted many of the remaining 168 may very well be citizens.
The first question is why didn’t he run their names through the Homeland Security database before he sent the letters? He could have saved the taxpayers $570.60 in postage. You’d think a good penny pinching conservative Republican would think of that.
The second question and far more important is could it be the remaining 2,500 people who received letters and couldn’t be run through the Homeland Security database because they don’t have alien registration numbers are United States citizens?
Mr. Gessler’s investigation is a farce, at least for the 1,400 people he has investigated so far. This investigation, including checking the Homeland Security database, should have been conducted before any letters were sent to registered voters. His investigation is akin to a prosecutor claiming a murder has been committed but there isn’t a dead body, there aren’t any missing citizens, but he or she goes forward and sends letters to 3,900 people accussing each one of having something to do with the phantom homicide.
If the remaining 2,500 people turn out to be citizens and he didn’t have any evidence before he sent the letter, then we can only conclude that Mr. Gessler is a threat to our consitutional rights.
Every illegally cast vote dilutes every legally cast vote. Voters understand that. Voters will call Gessler a hero for protecting them. The only people making fools of themselves are Democrats who defend a flawed system.
You are wrong wrong WRONG about this. We’ll see what the “electoral impacts” are. If you go out of your way to alienate white middle class voters just to protect marginal dependent groups of Democrats, you will get what you deserve at the polls.
I am so sick of your stupidity. There is absolutely no proof that any of those 3900 ever cast illegal votes. This is a complete witch hunt for minority voters, who tend to vote Democratic, and nothing else.
I used to assume there was a human behind your rants but now I am pretty sure you are a computer program, designed to call everything on this site “Bullshit”.
Someone please unplug this program so we can get honest discussions about the issues that we are facing.
The known voter fraud involves only Republican operatives.
The trouble with ArapGOP is that he is poorly programmed.
A good Turing Machine is hard to tell from a human when the responses are designed to be reasonable.
Here’s the bullshit – Republican’ts have been hooting for years about “vote fraud” but have YET to produce a single case that’s been prosecuted.
Of which he has found precious few that are even suspicious.
I follow the news every day, and have yet to see where Gessler has identified any illegally cast votes.
ArapaGOP — you might want to think about your comments before spouting off. Your dog whistle is blowing within human hearing range.
How many “illegally cast votes” are KNOWN to have occurred in Colorado in recent elections?
We’re not talking about mistakes or clerical errors. How many people who were not legally registered to vote cast a ballot that may have been counted?
Even Republican county clerks have publicly said, repeatedly, that they are not aware of ANY illegally registered voters who have cast a ballot.
to demand a number….
has been given the number of people, of that 4,000, that are in their county. More than 9% alleged to be in Boulder county
Still waiting for a response to my family’s use of entitlements.
And more than likely, your own family’s use.
I’m not trying to be confrontational, I just want you to either admit that “entitlements” smooth out bumps in life that as individuals we can’t surmount on our own, or tell me that we are leaches.
Which if that is your opinion, and your family has never used “entitlements,” I’d give you credit for being consistent.
you mean you’ve been getting “No bid” defense contracts and “non-conventional fuel” development subsidies, and perpetual dirt cheap mineral leases…and you didn’t tell us? Or I guess I should be thinking a somewhat smaller entitlement probably… like… survival.
…Jumping Mullet LLC. Then go after some of those corporate entitlements. Er, I mean government teat sucking. No, wait….
If Gessler had removed only those 1400 that were checked against the DHS database, he would have deprived at minimum 1232 voters of their legal right to vote. At absolute best, he would have prevented 168 illegal votes.
Where is the balance of the law for you, AGOP? Is it better to execute 100 innocents than to allow one criminal to go free? Is it better to suppress the votes of 100 citizens than to allow 10 non-citizens to vote?
For the remaining 2,500 people who received letters from Mr. Gessler but he didn’t have an alien registration number for, what evidence (probable cause) did he have in his possession, before he sent the letters, that would lead a reasonable person to believe those 2,500 people could be illegally registered voters? Mr. Gessler doesn’t have to reveal their identities. All he need do is give us an explanation of the kinds of evidence he had, before sending the letters, without connecting it to the identity of any of the individuals.
And while were at it, don’t you think its time Mr. Gessler produced a list of the surnames of the 3,900 voters he mailed letters to? Again, he doesn’t have to specifically identify any of the voters.
And finally, don’t you think Mr. Gessler should publicly reveal the methodology and criteria he utilized to gather the 3,900 names of voters he sent the letters to?
He’s our secretary of state and we as his constituents have the right to know how and why he does what he does. We need to know these facts to judge whether this is good public service, incompetence or someone who, tasked with insuring as many people can vote as possible, is using his position to suppress voting by people he believes will harm Republican chances of victory in November. If its either the second or third reason, especially the third, then we should ask that he resign or be impeached.
A-GOP is a coward, whether you’re respectful (and you were) or not.
Really, that’s your talking point? Or this bit of theory casting about for fact?
Here’s some rhetoric for you:
Gessler should be ashamed of himself–the face of male white privilege, and how many of the disenfranchised will look like him?
One need only look at what is happening nationally and who, specifically, is being affected. It is blatant and it is consistent re: which AMERICAN CITIZENS are being discouraged from exercising what–according to Republican talking points–are their ‘God-given’ rights to institute their own government, to elect their ‘representatives’ in this–we are always reminded by your side–Republic.
I find what Gessler and his ilk are attempting to be traitorous, personally.
to all those verified as US citizens to apologize and assure them that they remain on the rolls and will be able to exercise their right to vote? He also needs to initiate a huge public service announcement plan to alert everyone who might have been affected to the huge mistake that has been made and to let us all know that it will be rectified. He needs to apologize to all the county clerks for not listening to them and putting them all through this dog and pony show when they had more important things to do, such as getting ready to run a presidential election. Then he needs to step down or be recalled at the nearest opportunity.
as opposed to “honest white middle class”? Aren’t these people who have gone through all the required procedures to become citizens of this country? And where is the tiniest shred of evidence that, out of this entire group, even one illegal vote has been cast or contemplated to be cast in the coming election?
We can all stop arguing about the fairness of alleging a racist element on the GOP voter suppression efforts now. Please note this is an observation on, not a response to, a clearly worthless jaw dropping piece of troll crap that neither deserves nor requires serious consideration.
I think this obvious (marginal v white makes it pretty damn clear) racist ought to be banned.
Because there was never an honest, white middle class immigrant on these shores, ever. Not since John Thune’s ancestors arrived, at least.
any, if not most, county clerks have incurred county expenses if for no other reason than to consult with their county attorney. and, of course any illegal vote does not dilute ALL votes. At the most one illegal vote would dilute one legal vote. of course that is arithmetic and Gessler and his jack booted punks are ignoring that
He’s a CBI Special Agent. He was telling me he was at Gesslers house today calming the wife and kids because of death threats Gessler’s getting.
Death threats are never acceptable. Some people.
I can hardly wait!
As the TV tourism ads proclaim.
Of all the places I’ve lived and visited, Texas is definitely the most different. They are so in love with themselves and their ways. They think their turds smell like rosewater.
My family excepted, of course! Which was just added to yesterday, a new granddaughter.
When my first grandchild arrived in a Texas hospital my daughter proclaimed, “She is NOT Texan, she’s Coloradan!” Fifteen years and two more kids later, I think she’s given up.
and to the parents and family as well. always cool news.
Note to anyone out there stupid enough to even tread near to a death threat – you are a fucking asshat. And that’s me being polite about it.
Calls for resignation entirely appropriate, though. He’s a terrible, partisan SOS trying to use his position to stop Dems from voting when he is supposed to be serving all of us in his role as a state official without regard to any voter’s party affiliation. His behaviour has been reprehensible but hardly a death penalty offense and threats of this nature are always beyond the pale. If any can be traced, those responsible ought to be prosecuted.
He ought to resign because he can’t possibly be trusted to fulfill his duties in an even handed manner, not because he’s being threatened.
1) Did Gessler have access to the Homeland Security database BEFORE he sent out the letters? I thought that access to the Homeland Security base for state’s had just been allowed, recently.
2) The Democrats or the ACLU (of which I am a proud card carrying member) must file suit to determine how Gessler choose the names to send letters to and if his procedure was unconstitutional. Has anyone done so?
3) How does a person born in the US prove he/she is a US citizen. If the President of the United States has had difficulty proving that to the satisfaction of some state officials (READ: Arizona) than what is the standard? Who decides? Is that the real goal behind the birther movement?
Then that strengthens the case for a law suit.
At least no good way as envisioned when Social Security was enacted, as the SSID was only supposed to be used for Social Security.
There are still citizens without Social Security numbers in this country, and others without ID who’ve lost their cards and have a very hard time replacing them.
Aside from that, and the supposed ban of using SSID outside of limited situations… If SSID were used to prove citizenship, the system would quickly fall victim to fraud. Between predictability in the ID sequence and the fact that more than 1/3 of the numbers are in active use, it’s easy to hit on an active number and even possibly guess that card’s owner.
Passports should be sufficient, but many people don’t have those, and they cost money (no poll taxing!). Besides, I think at least one state’s laws don’t accept passports as valid proof of citizenship!
Birth certificates do not have photos. So one problem is what ID do you have use to get the State issued photo ID for voting. Plus, as one lawyer found out, the name she used to get her SS card was slightly different from the name on her birth certificate, so PA would not issue her a photo ID. Of course, she was African-American.
And, of course then there is the whole issue of maiden names etc, and money and time to get anything…
So, SS numbers are not any kind of proof of citizenship.
that you have a state issued photo ID to get a state issued photo ID
I have my original paper ca. 1964, typed upon SS card. It is burned all along one edge because of a car fire. I’ve had officials look at it and ask if it was real.
Gessler’s rabid efforts to find non-citizen registered voters can leave no doubt in the eyes of xenophobes that his is making every possible effort to root out non-citizen voters in a way that a Democratic SOS could never do credibily in their eyes.
Yet, when the dust settles, he will probably find fewer than a hundred non-citizen registered voters. Further investigation will reveal that almost none of them will have ever actually cast ballots and instead they were registered by mistake when they got driver’s licenses or were presented with forms that they didn’t understand while going into a mall or something like that.
Probably something like half a dozen or so will have actually voted before they were granted citizenship and almost all of those cases will involve people who are applying for citizenship.
in a statement made by Gessler’s office to a certain newspaper:
“Coolidge said Gessler’s office had identified a total of 430 non-citizens who had been registered voters who have voluntarily taken themselves off the rolls. How many of those had actually voted?
Coolidge said he didn’t have a precise number but estimated there were as many as two dozen such voters since 2006. The office has not released a list of the 430 non-citizen voters.”
There you have it, about 5% of non-citizens registered to vote actually do vote, and the number of known non-citizens voters over the course of six November elections is about four per year in a state with more than four million residents. It doesn’t sound like an evil plot that impairs the integrity our elections to me.
those 2 dozen sullied and diluted the votes of every legitimate voter. Every one
I feel so violated I may never vote again. What with a sullied vote and all. 🙂