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July 11, 2011 03:49 PM UTC

Monday Open Thread

  • by: Colorado Pols

“We have to distrust each other. It is our only defense against betrayal.”

–Tennessee Williams, from Camino Real


35 thoughts on “Monday Open Thread

    1. It’s a start. In Colorado there may be only a handful of people you might want to meet and talk with but they are out there still hoping for a better day.  Then there are the rest of us who said enough is enough and changed to U.

    2. am hoping to have some time either tonight or tomorrow night to finish it.

      Damn that job thing… I typed this out an hour ago and never posted it

      1. …oh, right, the roof over head thing.

        I’m gonna bug you until you finish it, though. The two windmills I’m jousting at this year are bringing back the true Western Republican in whatever small way I can and encouraging discussion of concepts BEFORE they’re hot-button issues that everyone is too angry about to listen to each other.

  1. Your husband lost his job and youve taken a 10% cut in pay, now that bastard wants you to head to the bank for a loan so he can go hunting and forego materials for your three home schooled yet nationally recognized student athletes. Whiat do you do?

    John Boehner says he’ll support a smaller deficit reduction package if it doesn’t include any tax increases. President Obama says he wants a larger reduction deal with tax hikes. Who’s right? Boehner, who’s willing to accept smaller deficit reductions if there aren’t any increases in tax burden, or Obama, who wants a larger package that includes tax increases? Talk about it!

    1. Even for you ‘tad, this is beyond your normal incomprehensible drivel.

      It’s pretty simple – the RepubliCAN’T party has whiffed again when given a critical moment in National public policy.

      Given a choice of making a bunch of spending cuts that would make nice fodder for campaign slogans and actually making a significant reduction in spending, the Repubs candyassed out and decided to keep living in Teabagger Land.

      Why? Because the Republican’t party continues to cling to their deluded views of Reagan:

      Reagan mythology is leading US off a cliff

      As things stand today, the US is hurtling toward a budget showdown in less than a month. Either President Obama will once again capitulate to extreme Republican budget-slashing demands, making Democrats seem as much of a threat to Medicare as Republicans, and virtually ensuring a GOP electoral sweep in 2012, or the US will default on its debt for the first time in its history, most likely plunging the world economy back into another five-continent recession, also costing Democrats the 2012 elections. These are the options left for a president and a political class completely divorced both from reality, and its own history of how one of the three greatest US presidents of all time steered the country from the brink of collapse eight decades ago

      Entirely forgetting the real history of how Franklin D Roosevelt used activist government to save American capitalism from itself, the entire US political establishment is instead hypnotised by the false history woven around its most over-hyped president of all time: Ronald Reagan. Idolatry of Reagan’s supposed tax-cutting wonders propels the now widespread economic belief that up is down, that cutting government spending is the way out of – rather than into – a severe recession. At the same time, idolatry of Reagan’s supposed political wonders propels GOP extremists to ignore all other considerations.

      I’ll keep reminding the sane people here that Saint Ronnie reversed course on his orgy of tax cuts in 1981 with some very smart tax raises in 1982. But since history fails to register with simpering dumbasses, I’ll go for the family analogy that repubs seems to cherish.

      When your kid runs up $1000 in cell phone bills and you’ve got a bunch of other obligations due, yes, you try and cut expenses to meet those payments.

      But sometimes the obligations are so steep that there’s NO WAY you can cut your way to solvency. Most of us working-class folk hold our noses and go out and get a crappy second job to pay those bills.

      It’s time for this country to go out and get a second job and raise revenues.

      1. Didn’t we save and create 2-3 million jobs with that bloated stimulus Obama and the Democrats passed last year?

        Oh yeah, $278,000 per job saved or created.

        Thats not to mention that our nation needs @125,000-150,000 new jobs per month just to keep up. So how have we been doing for the last 2 years on that little objective …. not to hot.


        1. …so, you really want to go there?

          Let’s talk about all those jobs created with the Millionaire Tax Cut over the last ten years. You know, the ones you gleefully pointed out were NOT being created during the 2008 campaign? Remember you posting those stats EVERY DAMN MORNING? So why would tax cuts work now when they haven’t worked for TEN YEARS? Why hasn’t the budget magically balanced itself, like Dubya promised when he signed the tax cuts into law?

          Secondly, every time you post that $278K per job stat all you do is display the depth of your (well-established) ignorance. That number has been so thoroughly debunked it’s now laughable when you post it…but since you  must have been on an extended dungeon run, here’s where that goes away:

          Yes, ‘tad, I realize that if you do the hamburger joint napkin math and divide the low end of the jobs created (2.6 mil) by the total amount spent on the stimulus ($666Billion) you get that fantastic number.

          But take off the tax cuts (1/3) and actual spending on STUFF (less than a third)  and use the mean of jobs created (3mil)then you end up with a number somewhere in the area of $80K.

          And lastly, the Stimulus worked…period. Because we are not in the Bush II Depresssion. You claim to read the Economist…shall I link to all the articles that say the same thing?

          thought so….DUMBASS

  2. I have found it very interesting to watch Obama turn the tables on the Republicans in this debate. So the Republicans demand a 4 trillion package.  Republicans now come out and say they can not get a 4 trillion package because the only way to reach an agreement with the Dems is to have at least some revenue increases.  Now Obama turns the table on them by demanding that they stick to 4 trillion package and thus makes the Republicans look like the irresponsible ones.   Obama takes a lot of heat for straddling the middle but I believe often proves to be way more effective than he often gets credit for. That is if he does cave at this point. 🙂

    Finally it so ridiculous we are even having this conversation. We are arguablly in the worst recession since the great depression and as PRS so effectively points out tax increases and spending cuts are  both anti stimulative. It is fricken economics 101. Your really could not get it more wrong on both sides.

    By the way DJIA down 150 at 10:00 AM today. The rest of the developed World think we are complete idiots.   Wonderful job handling this one so far to both sides.

    1. if you repeat it often enough, it must be true.

      The aide said that guys like me were “in what we call the reality-based community,” which he defined as people who “believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality.” … “That’s not the way the world really works anymore,” he continued. “We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality-judiciously, as you will-we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors…and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.” Ron Suskind, paraphrasing a discussion with Karl Rove

    2. If you want to focus on numbers, here’s one – $60:

      World of Warcraft 180-Day Prepaid Cards

      Best Buy offers the World of Warcraft 60-Day Prepaid Game Cards for Windows or Mac for $29.99. Add three to your cart and they fall to $59.98. Shipping adds $8.97, or opt for free in-store pickup. Even with shipping, that’s $11.49 per month and the lowest total price we could find for this quantity by $21. Sales tax is added where applicable. These cards provide a total of 180 days of play time.

        1. ‘tad, you have been punked SO MANY TIMES on this website on your deliberate twisting of facts and statistics that ANYTHING you post has a stench of deliberate stupidity.

          If you’ll go up a few posts, I rammed three different web sites up your ass debunking your fake number you keep reposting. I noticed you slunk off butt-hurt from that thread, so you could post your nonsensical frogwash anew further down the page.

          Give it up – maybe you should start posting more incomprehensible rants about “union bosses” and “DPS Graduation Rates.”

          1. The complex formula goes like this amount spent divided by jobs saved or created. Or in this case $278,000 per Obama job.

            What’s not funny is you could have saved $400 billion by cutting a $100,000 check to the human of each saved or created job. You know putting all back into the private sector and letting that capitalist magic happen.

            Now what’s not funny is The Jobless Summer for American teens.


            Back on planet Earth, the minimum wage increase has coincided with the plunge in the percentage of working teens. Before the most recent wage hikes, roughly seven million teens were working. Now there are closer to five million with a job and paycheck.

            Black teens have had the worst of it, with their unemployment rate rising to 41.6% in April from 29% in 2007, faster than almost any other group. A 2010 study by economists William Even of Miami University of Ohio and David Macpherson of Trinity University found that as a result of the $2.10 increase in minimum wage, “teen employment dropped by 6.9 percent. . . . For the teen population with less than 12 years of education completed, teen employment dropped by 12.4 percent.” For teens priced out of the labor market, their wage fell to zero.

            The great tragedy is that even discussing the role of the minimum wage in teen unemployment seems to be a political taboo. The other day we saw ABC’s George Stephanopoulos baiting Michele Bachmann on the minimum wage, as if refusing to raise it would be some epic political gaffe. Ms. Bachmann didn’t back down from saying that the minimum wage has contributed to unemployment, though she didn’t explain why.

            View Full Image

            Associated Press

            The great tragedy is that even discussing the role of the minimum wage in teen unemployment seems to be a political taboo.

            What she or another candidate should do is stop playing defense and ask why Mr. Stephanopoulos doesn’t seem to mind a black teen jobless rate of 41.6%. Someone truly brave would come out for a teenage sub-minimum wage of, say, $4 an hour. In certain circumstances employers can now pay teens a minimum of $4.25, but only for 90 days. This makes employers reluctant to hire at all. Make the case on moral grounds that a mandated wage that is too high blocks the young and unskilled from grabbing a place on the economic ladder.

            1. Never mind….

              So I’ll say it again – the $287K number pulled out of Grover Norquist’s ass and hooted everywhere by simpletons like you is the low end of jobs created (2.4million) divided into the entire value of the stimulus package.

              A third was tax cuts, slightly less than a third was spending on actual STUFF (like the new Colorado National Guard Armory in Boulder) and the rest went toward job creation.

              The real number is about $80K. Please consult web pages cited at the top of this webpage.

              Please call again when your bullshit is no longer being spouted.

              1. …. and I took into account all the subversion and special accounting treatments you used to justify your crappy analysis..

                Last, i guess what your saying is you would have supported the tax reductions on their face as a single issue. Yet here today you are probably pulling our your blogging hair screaming about Boehner’s actions on the debt ceiling-cut in government spending problem.

                You know the one Obama is getting zero traction at the bully pulpit on.

                1. I’m doing a hoard of paperwork for the SBA today, so a quick trip to the interwebz to debunk your pointless bullshit is a nice diversion.

                  I can keep this up all day!

                  …. and I took into account all the subversion and special accounting treatments you used to justify your crappy analysis..

                  It’s call Arithmetic, ‘tad. That’s where you perform functions like “Subtraction” and “Division” to achieve a provable value.

                  So, let’s go to the web, and try and show you again what the Recovery Act is made up of:

                  -Providing $288 billion in tax cuts and benefits for millions of working families and businesses

                  -Increasing federal funds for education and health care as well as entitlement programs (such as extending unemployment benefits) by $224 billion

                  -Making $275 billion available for federal contracts, grants and loans.


                  So, if we use that calculator on your PC (y’know, the one you use to split up all the treasure you find with your fellow orcs in WoW) we find that this total adds up to $787 Billion. The jobs created by the Recovery Act total between 2.4 and 3.6 million, so we’ll take the Mean (another “mathy” term) and use a nice even 3.0 Million jobs created.

                  So, taking away those Republican-friendly tax cuts (- 288 billion) and the stuff we bought (-275) we are left with $224 Billion, divided by 3 million, equals (roughly) $74,667. I rounded up to include some stuff covered by the other two parts.

                  $74,667 is less than $278,000. Now, that may work if your the Repub CEO of Enron, but not for the rest of us.

                  In summary, you are a shrieking dumbass. That is all.

  3. I always sort of just rolled by eyes when David complained about the Department of Revenue and their lack of customer service.  I just assumed that it was typical frustrating government agency stuff, and David was overreacting.

    I was wrong.

    Having now spent four or five hours over the last three days reflexively redialing the Dept. of Revenue, and getting nothing but a recording refusing to even put me on hold and just saying to try again later…. AAAAHHH!  That shouldn’t even be legal.  If hold times are two hours, fine, I know the government is understaffed… but it needs to at least be possible to reach the agency when they make a massive mistake like this.

    1. Thankfully I have a CPA that gets to blow out her brains with DOR on my behalf.

      The staff runs that place and it’s like the prisoners running the jail.

  4. Wowwie,

    Another insightful message about activities in the beltway, this in an email today. Now I expect I’ll get a bunch of comments that I’m a racist, etc…although I’m much more interested in anyone who wants to refute these facts. Was the money tied to ARRA or some other program? Come on Obama policy gurus, what gives?

    La Raza translated per google …. “The Race”

    Obama Sending Your Tax Dollars to La Raza!

    Dear Friend,

    Remember when President Obama promised to give us the most transparent administration in history? And he even issued an executive order restricting lobbyists from working in his administration.

    It was exactly what Americans wanted-but he had no intention of following through. How could he-he needed to take care of his friends. He gave dozens of waivers to lobbyists of his friends-just like he gives thousands of waivers from Obamacare to his Union buddies.

    One lobbyist he hired was Cecilia Munoz, the vice president of the National Council for La Raza. Obama put her in charge doling out public funds and made her his liaison to the Hispanic community.

    Well a recent study shows just how good Cecilia has been to her old boss. La Raza’s government funding under Obama has skyrocketed-from $4.1 million in 2008 to $11 million in 2010. In addition, the La Raza affiliate Chicanos por la Causa got over $18 million from our coffers.

    Sixty percent of La Raza’s take came from the Department of Labor–run by none other than another La Raza pal, pro amnesty advocate Hilda Solis. They lobbied hard for her and honored her with an award. She paid them back-with millions of dollars of our money!

    When this is done in the private sector it’s called a “sweetheart deal” and gets the attention of prosecutors. But in the federal government it’s called business as usual and we pay.

    1. Oh wait, that IS on the Birther Queens website…

      I noticed (as usual) this is another one of your drive-by’s, posting your usual frogwash with no link. I know you could link back to the Birther Queen site, but you’re going to have to come up with a legit website for this one…which you can’t, since this shit has been around sine 2010.

      FAIL –  

      1. I’ve never chipped into his cause ‘cept that Govenor race and previous Congressional races.

        Anyway, this is great material to share here and watch as you do your usual freak out. Sadly in your above post you did not do your usual hateful personal attack of me. I quite enjoy watching the rage you harbor inside posted for all readers to see.

        1. ….I’ve just pointed out your obvious train of bullshit you post, and rather than answer anything I’ve posted directly, you’re the one who’s gone to the darkest, dankest parts of the interwebs and posted more and more bullshit.

          As I’ve said, I’ve got time today. Your frenzied posts trying to change the subject have made my day…

          1. Diverting millions from places like the Veterens Admin and the soldiers they care for to some group affectionately known as The Race, aka La Raza.

            It’s like fish in a barrel with this administration. Failure to lead, failure to execute, Fast and Furious guns for drug lords and lobbyist funneled diversions of millions for groups such as this ….

            1. …that has NO basis in fact, and has no weblink, and has not proven to be anything other than another one of your Right-Wing-O-Verse fantasies.




    (I don’t care what party you like, this one’s funny!!)


    A Republican, in a wheelchair, entered a restaurant one afternoon and asked the waitress for a cup of coffee. The Republican looked across the restaurant and asked, “Is that Jesus sitting over there?”


    The waitress nodded “yes,” so the Republican requested that she give Jesus a cup of coffee, on him.


    The next patron to come in was a Libertarian, with a hunched back. He shuffled over to a booth, painfully sat down, and asked the waitress for a cup of hot tea. He also glanced across the restaurant and asked, “Is that Jesus, over there?”


    The waitress nodded, so the Libertarian asked her to give Jesus a cup of hot tea, “My treat.”


    The third patron to come into the restaurant was a Democrat on crutches He hobbled over to a booth, sat down and hollered, “Hey there honey! How’s about getting me a cold mug of Miller Light?” He too looked across the restaurant and asked, “Isn’t that God’s boy over there?


    The waitress nodded, so the Democrat directed her to give Jesus a cold beer. “On my bill,” he said loudly.


    As Jesus got up to leave, he passed by the Republican, touched him and said, “For your kindness, you are healed.” The Republican felt the strength come back into his legs, got up, and danced a jig out the door.


    Jesus passed by the Libertarian, touched him and said, “For your kindness, you are healed.” The Libertarian felt his back straightening up and he raised his hands, praised the Lord, and did a series of back flips out the door.


    Then, Jesus walked towards the Democrat, just smiling.


    The Democrat jumped up and yelled,


    “Don’t touch me … I’m collecting disability.”




    1. (I don’t care what party you like, this one’s funny!!)

      Top 10 Reasons You know you’re a Republican:

      1. You don’t think “The Simpsons” is all that funny, but you watch it because that Flanders fellow makes a lot of sense.

      2. You’ve ever referred to the moral fiber of something.

      3. You don’t let your kids watch Sesame Street because you accuse Bert and Ernie of “sexual deviance.”

      4. You’ve ever tried to prove Jesus was a capitalist and opposed to welfare.

      5. You’re a pro-lifer, but support the death penalty.

      6. You use any of these terms to describe your wife: Old ball and chain, little woman, old lady, tax credit…

      7. You’ve ever uttered the phrase, “Why don’t we just bomb the sons of bitches.”

      8. You answer to “The Man.”

      9. You fax the FBI a list of “Commies in my Neighborhood.”

      10. You’ve ever referred to someone as “my (insert racial or ethnic minority here) friend”

      1. No to all except …..

        7. Absolutely, many times and in many contexts including business. I also like to incorporate the wording “carpet bomb” and “mother f____ers”.

        10. Absolutely have refered to people. ‘That black, white, Indian with a dot, Mexican, etc… guy or gal’.

        Now just to get you over the edge I do have a buddy that is half beaner and a sister that is half Mexican. My buddy refers to himself as the richest beaner in Colorado, therefore I repeat it for you. I don’t think he is really the richest American of Mexican heritage, but he claims it so ….

        1. remember my disclaimer – (I don’t care what party you like, this one’s funny!!)

          Seems you’re the one with issues so big you feel the need to post such lame disclaimers…..I do know a few good therapists thru the Vets court – would you like some contact info?

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