GOP Answers Coordination Charge With Middle Finger

Separating private and official emails

Wouldn't it be possible to pull all the official emails from a private email box using fields in the email header?  It should be easy to tell the difference between mail originally sent to "joe.blow.house@state.co.us" that was subsequently forwarded and mail that was sent directly to "partyboyjoe@foobar.com".

Many were increasingly of the opinion that they'd all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place.  And some said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans. - Douglas Adams

---

by: GeoGreg @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 15:37:42 PM UTC

Pols is off-base here

It would seem from CORA that the litmus test has nothing to do with what address the message was sent to.  If either party (send/receive) is an elected official, and the content relates to public policy, then it is an open record.  On the other hand, the act has exceptions for private content, also regardless of the destination address.  An official can have private conversations via e-mail, they just can't have a conversation about public policy and pretend its private, unless it meets one of the act's exceptions.

---

by: MontesquieuianGauntlet @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 00:45:22 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Rove in the same pickle

Let's see how the white house and the RNC plays this one out.
http://www.washingto...

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

---

by: Go Blue @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:15:04 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Which is exactly what we're talking about

Actually, this failure to divorce in a technical sense legislator's private and public email account creates for them the exact problem Rove has been able to neatly avoid so far.
If legislators had their official email boxes hosted by the state, and no mingling with any other private email address, Merrifield's ranty email to Windels from one webmail service to another would never have been disclosed. Not that it would or wouldn't have been a CORAable public record, that doesn't even matter as you should be able to figure out if you think about this for a minute.

Unless the CBI starts seizing hard drives every time there's a CORA request, we submit to you all that you're being a little naive here.

---

by: Colorado Pols @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 16:19:56 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Yawn

So what.  Politicians are public figures and if they same in private as they are in public then they'd have nothing to worry about.

---

by: mountain man @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 15:39:57 PM UTC

I'm sure I don't want to know the

private lives of my legislators unless I'm forming a 527.  As a matter of fact I don't want to know the really private lives of anyone.  That's why they are private.

---

by: puddin @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 16:40:55 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

If you don't want to be caught saying something stupid - don't say something stupid

Someone (don't remember who) had that advice for politicians. I think it might have been from back in the 60s well before YouTube.

I think people accept that their legislators are not perfect. But sometimes what comes through shows a side of them that people will find unacceptable.

Are we better off that George Allen lost in Virginia and had his chances for President killed because it became clear he is a closet racist? I think so.

Where all the cool kids will be on Saturday - Code War!

---

by: DavidThi808 @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 04:16:05 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

We are not talking about the same thing.

The Allen comments were made publicly at an open political meeting.  The Allen didn't handle the incident well.  They allowed the issue to build for a week and a half before they started making amends with an apology.  By that time momentum started building for Webb and Allen was kept on the defensive.  Webb won by 9,000 votes because he ended with enthusiasm and we got out the vote.  I was there and watched the whole thing unfold.  Yes, we are better off without Allen.

What the question is is do you want your private utterances, things you say to a good friend, to be publicly exposed?  I grant that two public officials exchanging information about a public issue should expect those words to be examined.  But if those words were uttered to me they should be kept private because I'm not a public official.

This instance is not the Allen incident.

 

---

by: puddin @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 04:54:16 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I mostly agree with you

but I think they need to operate under the assumption that most private utterances will stay private - but not all.

Where all the cool kids will be on Saturday - Code War!

---

by: DavidThi808 @ Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 07:34:42 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Whoa!

So are you saying that folks should never say things in private that might embarrass them in public?  Sounds like "1984" to me.

"Thousands are sailing, across the western ocean, to a land of opportunity, that some of them will never see . . ."

- The Pogues

---

by: Druid @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:34:35 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

This post (Druid) must be in response to MM's post rather than mine (puddin)

but if it is aimed at what I wrote the answer is "no".

---

by: puddin @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:46:11 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

If they live with integrity

then it shouldn't be a problem.  If they are talking bad about people behind their backs then they will be embaressed like this.

---

by: mountain man @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 19:21:22 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Was Merrifield

acting without integrity? Not in my opinion.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

---

by: Aristotle @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 19:52:34 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Clearly he thinks so

otherwise he wouldn't have stepped down.

---

by: mountain man @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 19:55:45 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Not so clear to me

The whole thing was blowing up and he quickly stepped down in order to nip it in the bud. But if he were truly acting unethically, I think he would have resigned his entire office, not just step down as chair of a committee on which he still sits.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

---

by: Aristotle @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 19:59:37 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Seems like much ado to me

Big surprise that Merrifield doesn't want private or charter school options. The "special place in hell" comment is over the top, but I'm not running for the smelling salts that he said it.

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Sat Apr 07, 2007 at 23:50:32 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

So do you think

that he acted unethically? Or that he should do more than what he's done, which is to resign the chair of the education committee?

My point of view isn't so much about his remarks. I think it's hypocritical that everyone is so mad about it because I'm positive that a solid, if not overwhelming, majority of voters who care about pet issues want someone like this representing them as long as they're on the same side on those issues. In other words the very people who requested and published the emails most likely would have had no problem if they found a Republican, pro-voucher and pro-charter legislator saying there was a special place in hell for some teachers' union lobbyist. That's a double standard and that's hypocritical.

Your comment touches on what this is really all about - the "voucherizers, charterizers, and privatizers" wanted to get a democratically elected representative who chaired the education committee out of the way because he was obstructing their progress. Sorry, but that's what legislative politics are all about, and both sides do it when they're in power. Most don't like it when they're in the minority, but they shouldn't complain if they don't mind it at all when they're in the majority.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

---

by: Aristotle @ Sun Apr 08, 2007 at 06:24:38 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

No, I don't think he acted unethically

I don't even understand why he resigned.  The party currently in the majority is supported by the CEA and generally speaking, opposes vouchers.  I'd prefer they put that out there loud and proud and then let the voters decide.  If people want something different, they can elect like minded legislators.  The question is, why was he asked to step down and why did he agree to do so?  If we were all held accountable for off color e-mail remarks, well, I for one would be tarred and feathered in the public square. 

I think if Ted Harvey had written the same thing about pro public school people, the intensity of criticism would be much different, IMHO.

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Sun Apr 08, 2007 at 15:31:23 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

You're probably right.

"I think if Ted Harvey had written the same thing about pro public school people, the intensity of criticism would be much different, IMHO."

For me, context is important. I already believe many politicians opposed to my ideals already think that about me and my allies, so if they say it in private, big deal. But many would be outraged as well.

I think it was a smart move on the Dem's side to ask him to step down (or did he do that voluntarily) so as to try to limit the potential for distracting scandal. That, along with the removal of William Jefferson from his plum committee assignments in the US House, contrasts quite a bit with the stick-it-out-as-the-scandal-gets-worse resistance shown by Republicans in recent scandals like DeLay/Abramoff and Duke Cunningham. Of course we need to take Merrifield's illness into account too, but the timing can only be read as a response to his comments becoming news.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

---

by: Aristotle @ Sun Apr 08, 2007 at 21:41:57 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Well, we're learning

We got rid of Foley pretty fast, but the Dems do a pretty good job of it with their own. Sen. Hanna was gone faster than you could say "reparations"!

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Sun Apr 08, 2007 at 23:14:40 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Sen. Hanna

I was at an informational legislative luncheon last year where she was also in attendance.  She cracked a "joke" about men that if the genders were reversed, there would have been a great hue and cry from the women.  I couldn't believe it.  I didn't laugh, not because of the content, but the hypocrisy.  I was not disappointed to see her gone.

"Politics determines who has the power, not who has the truth." Paul Krugman, 9/2010

---

by: parsingreality @ Mon Apr 09, 2007 at 00:46:18 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I wish a could remember some of the great stories

I heard from a former Representative.  Apparently, Hanna was known for saying some pretty, um, how do I say this nicely.... loopy things.  Cracked me up!  I don't think she was a big loss for your side.

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Mon Apr 09, 2007 at 19:51:39 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Nor I

If somehow we could gather all the "loopy" stories of all the legs, what a book!

"Politics determines who has the power, not who has the truth." Paul Krugman, 9/2010

---

by: parsingreality @ Tue Apr 10, 2007 at 16:01:09 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

No kidding

I'd like stock in that book!

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Wed Apr 11, 2007 at 04:27:54 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Someone should watch with a microscope everything Brad Jones does.

I sometimes hear him on KFKA radio out of Greeley. His view of the world is a series of Rush Limbaugh talking points.  His logic comes straight from the Independence Institute without their intellectual rigor (if you say II doesn't have intellectual rigor, you get the point).

He is not careful with assertions, facts, implications or consequences.  I assume he is a college graduate but he has yet to get beyond a frat house level of verbal engagement ( such as the ..You're an idiot!..response).

He's young, bullet proof and ready to make a name for himself.  He might be smart but doesn't show that on the radio.  He can be dangerous and will be encouraged. 

---

by: puddin @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 16:55:23 PM UTC

He was CU's College Republican.

He led that gang of four in 2004 when he was a Senior, and may have graduated as well.  He organized the Earth Day "Animal Appreciation BBQ":

[Senior Brad Jones] said environmentalists convince students that the only way to help the environment is by government's use [of] tax money.  He added that this ultimately takes away individual rights; for example, "You can't shoot prairie dogs in your own back yard."

The main theme of the College Republicans' "Free Market Earth Day" is to promote the idea that environmental friendly practices and conservation can be achieved through free market practices, according to Jones.

A barbecue will take place from 11 a.m. until 12 p.m. at the Norlin Quad in front of Old Main.

I think he was also the genius who held the CU bake sale where they charged black and Hispanic students more than whites...to prove some feverish point I don't recall now.  If so, then he failed to graduate on time in 2004...or just kept hanging around like that Matthew McConaughey character in Dazed and Confused.

His defenders are claiming he's "just a techie."  Nuh-uh.  He also writes the content.  (And he's not a very clever techie if he's actually running the version of Drupal he appears to be at FaceTheState...)

There must be a special place in Colorado Springs for these charlatans.

"But every Republican in the world is a lobbyist…" -- Bill O'Reilly

---

by: OscarTheCouch @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:16:02 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Impeccable, Ive been told

The bake sale was child-like stunt, encouraged by those at the Independence Institute (more specifically Jessica Peck Cory), to claim affirmative action is reverse discrimination. While, at that very time CU held demographic of one the most lilly white schools in the United State. Very impressive Brad, you showed your true color of ignorance on that day and have continued to do so every since. The bake was a set back for Jones has they sold not goods and we welcomed by hundreds in protest of it.

Brad may have also worn his "join us or work for us later" t-shirt showing his compassion for all those who disagree with his form of neo-conservativism.

While this story is just the tip of the iceberg http://www.coloradoc...

and more will be discovered http://www.coloradoc...

Jones is merely the puppet of this show. The guilt, and responsibility, lies with the Minority Leader. http://www.coloradoc...

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

---

by: Go Blue @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:29:34 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

"That's all right, that's ok,

you're gonna work for us someday."  The chant of the haters at CU, enshrined on their t-shirt:

Because "screw the poor" just doesn't flow off the tongue as well.

In 2004, the Boulder Weekly honored Brad Jones and the CU College Republicans as Future Corporate Criminals.  They sure got that one right.

"But every Republican in the world is a lobbyist…" -- Bill O'Reilly

---

by: OscarTheCouch @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:52:00 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Speak of the devil...

Just today the next Affirmative Action Bake Sale was announced for April 17th.  Good to see Mr. Jones' successor as College Repugs Chairman Justin Yarusso is keeping the tradition alive.  Boy am I proud to be a CU student!  Ugh...how lame is this crap...

---

by: Dabee47 @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 17:53:11 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

let the crap flow

heh.

The "Liberalism is a Sickness" user is an Ignorant Asshole

---

by: Zappatero @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 18:23:16 PM UTC

I don't have the time

But someone needs to challenge this. By challenge, I mean do what CoPols is suggesting. Do a CORA request for every private email of state GOP legislatures. One of two things will happen. (1) that person will get a ton of private emails and therefore a ton of negative information about the GOP or (2) some official in charge will get their head out of the sand and realize that private emails are private and not open to CORA requests.

To be honest, I am hoping the second one is the result. But if they are going to play hardball, we need to bring bats to the game.

---

by: WinstonSmith @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 18:25:32 PM UTC

Colorado Confidential filed an open records request

From a post by Erin Rosa:

"In order to answer these questions, Colorado Confidential filed an open records request with the Senate Minority Office yesterday, in an effort to determine any connections to Jones."

http://www.coloradoc...

---

by: mbeach @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 20:58:45 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Will Brad Jones...

fill the huge shoes of legendary John Marshall????  Only time will tell...

---

by: Democracy??? @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 20:59:45 PM UTC

LOL

Jones has at least accomplished something.  Who's filling who's shoes?

---

by: Haners @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 21:01:36 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Mission Accomplished!

What has he accomplished other than making a name for himself as a little Grover Norquist?

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

---

by: Go Blue @ Thu Apr 05, 2007 at 21:08:21 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

I have an idea

CoPols could hire Brad Jones as the resident right winger, and as a mirror to Jason Bane's CoPols/Colorado Confidential double duties. We could then receive regular from-the-right updates from Face The State like we now do from Colorado Confidential.  How about it? (She asked already knowing the answer)

---

by: Lauren Bacall @ Sun Apr 08, 2007 at 00:03:19 AM UTC

[ Parent ]