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U.S. Combat in Iraq Ends...Now!

by: Colorado Pols

Tue Aug 31, 2010 at 15:00:00 PM MDT


As of right now, 3:00 p.m., U.S. Combat Operations in Iraq are over. From CNN:

Almost seven and a half years ago, President George W. Bush launched a blistering "shock and awe" invasion of Iraq.

The goal: Eliminate a perceived threat of weapons of mass destruction while replacing a hostile, tyrannical regime with a friendly democracy in the heart of the Middle East.

On Tuesday at 5 p.m. ET -- at a cost of more than 4,400 U.S. military personnel killed and 30,000 wounded -- America's combat mission in Iraq will officially draw to a close...

...President Barack Obama, who based much of his campaign for the White House on growing public exhaustion with the conflict, will announce the conclusion of the combat mission in a speech to be delivered from the Oval Office at 8 p.m. ET. He spent the day meeting with troops at Fort Bliss, Texas -- a base that has supplied soldiers at all stages of the conflict.

Obama called Bush for a "few minutes" from Air Force One while en route to Texas, according to White House Deputy Press Secretary Bill Burton. The White House has not said if Obama will give Bush any credit during his speech for the controversial 2007-08 military "surge," believed by some observers to have helped curtail Iraqi violence.

His remarks are "not going to be a victory lap," Obama told the troops stationed at Fort Bliss. "We still have a lot of work to do."
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U.S. Combat in Iraq Ends...Now! | 79 comments
About f*cking time...

"Mission Accomplished?"
Really?

Reminds me of Marx's comments on the 18th Brumaire.

"Hegel  remarks somewhere that all great world-historic facts and personages appear, so to speak, twice. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce."

50,000 troops. Contractors.  This is FAR from over, and the defense budget shows that.

Better we should end these "savage wars of peace" altogether.

"History is'a made at night! Character is what you are in the dark!"  Lord John Worfin

2nd Infantry Division gets the f*ck out of Dodge....
....and it's amazing that this column of Strykers (aka RPG Magnets) made it out without an accident.



"The nation which forgets its defenders will be itself forgotten." Calvin Coolidge

To paraphrase Plato...
"Only the dead have seen the end of combat."

Still, it's an important (if largely symbolic and semantic) day in America's ill-fated excursion into The Land Between Two Rivers.

I for one fervently hope Obama doesn't listen to those - such as the neocon moron Paul Wolfowitz (writing in today's NYT), who help lay the intellectual groundwork for our invasion of Iraq from his Pentagon perch - who suggest we should leave tens of thousands of 'noncombat' troops in Iraq indefinitely.

Nation building begins at home, and we as a country are sorely in need of it.
 

"The graveyards of the world are filled with indispensable men."
- Charles deGaulle

"It's hard to balance on a woman's head."  - sxp151

Nothing but PR ahead of the midterms
Plenty of American soldiers are still fighting and dying in Iraq.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
Really, Beej? Do you have a number?
How many total troops are in Iraq? How many combat brigades? Are all of them out in the country conducting independent operations, or are they all hunkered down in FOBs?

Math is your special talent, Beej....throw out some numbers and proof!


"The nation which forgets its defenders will be itself forgotten." Calvin Coolidge

[ Parent ]
Just because they're not designated "combat"
doesn't mean they're not fighting and dying. You, of all people, should know.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Jeremiah was a bullfrog
so was Neanderthal man

combat troops stationed in Germany, Japan, Korea, Phillipines and Colorado Springs are all fighting and dying

[ Parent ]
If you can't come up with an original thought,
but instead mindlessly attach some cryptic comment to my comments over and over, I'm going to stop responding to you.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Student of History. Mathematician.
Unicorn lover.  

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
On this one BJ is correct
Those troops may not be wearing U.S. military uniforms but to avoid a draft President Bush put more civilian contract security forces into Iraq than we had troops there. Many of those people are still there and they are armed to the teeth and, at times, they will be in combat in Iraq.
[ Parent ]
Oh, Beej can't help himself.....
Although we will of course continue to suffer casualties - albeit at a FAR lower pace - over the next 15+ months American forces (50,000) are formally slated to remain in Iraq.

Let's hope the Iraqis can get their political/security/economic house in order, so we have no reason to linger beyond December 2011.

I'm guardedly pessimistic on that outcome personally.  :(

"The graveyards of the world are filled with indispensable men."
- Charles deGaulle

"It's hard to balance on a woman's head."  - sxp151

[ Parent ]
Beej is in projection mode!
Beej knows how he and the Republicans lie and deceive voters so of course he expects Democrats to do the same.  
Sometimes I wish we weren't so nice!

[ Parent ]
Nothing but PR.

"Major combat operations have ended"  President Bush, May 1, 2003, Mission Accomplished speech.

Meanwhile, in 2008 Obama campaigned on a pledge to withdraw combat forces from Iraq asap.  And here we are.

Likewise, a little less than a year ago President Obama pledged to withdraw combat forces from AfPak in 2011 if possible.  When he does it will you mistakenly and foolishly call it just reelection  PR?

"....  I would rather you just said thank you and went on your way.  Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way...."     stfu

[ Parent ]
Rosen read a letter this morning from somebody in the military about that.
"Mission Accomplished" referred specifically to the mission of that ship. Truth never was the liberals' strong suit though. Obama of course lied about being an anti-war president, sending thousands more troops to Afghanistan. As for that last little snipe, see my sig line. Typical.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
No.
If you believe that such a carefully planned and composed photo op like that was "only about that ship," then let me give you first crack at purchasing the Brooklyn Bridge.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP
[ Parent ]
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
You mean the mission to sail out from San Diego and turn around so the president's entry and landing wouldn't have the San Diego skyline in the background of the tv shot?

That's the funniest thing I've ever read on CoPols. Good one.

[ Parent ]
Ask Rosen about it.
Are you calling him a liar?

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Ask Rosen.  Ha ha ha ha.  Snort.  Oh my.

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
I suppose you would be a bit outmatched
if you called into his radio program. Most mamma's boy basement bloggers would be.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Mommy live 1250 miles away.
I wouldn't listen to Rosen, let alone call his show.  Perhaps he is smarter than the crap he publishes in the paper?  

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Because you're scared.
You'd get demolished.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Student of History. Mathematician.
Unicorn lover.  

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Ironically,
frequent denizens of Pols are turning into trolls, while I provide all the meaningful content. What a crazy year this is.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
@ CT and the unicorns are nervous.

[ Parent ]
Meaningful unicorn content


"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Can you find the show's transcript?
Maybe we can all give it a read and see exactly who said what.

But I'll tell you this - if it took them over seven years to get around to claiming that the "mission accomplished" banner, which coincidentally was the backdrop for a speech Bush gave claiming victory in Iraq, was only about that ship's mission, a wise person won't buy it simply based on the fact that it took so long to explain that.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

[ Parent ]
You can find the audio here:
http://www.850koa.com/pages/mi...

I don't think there's any transcript. It's at the end of the first hour. (Listen to the second hour if you want to learn about Sharia Law.) Perhaps the truth has been there all along, but the liberals who ratcheted up the rhetoric to get Obama elected and control the media wouldn't let the truth get out there.  

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle

[ Parent ]
?
Perhaps the truth has been there all along, but the liberals who ratcheted up the rhetoric to get Obama elected and control the media wouldn't let the truth get out there.

What truth is that? I'm not following you.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

[ Parent ]
The truth I was just taking about.
That "mission accomplished" referred to that specific mission.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Jeremiah was a bullfrog
Neanderthal man was also a bullfrog

Jeremiah (the bullfrog, not the prophet) and Neanderthal man revealed truth

BJ either doesn't know or obfuscates truth

Home school champion

[ Parent ]
Runner-up for Homecoming King
(Don't ask how, I've found out it's a sore subject with him.)

Don't believe everything you think.
[ Parent ]
Really...?
From CNN, May 2, 2003:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOL...

President Bush made a landing aboard the USS Abraham Lincoln Thursday, arriving in the co-pilot's seat of a Navy S-3B Viking after making two fly-bys of the carrier.

***
Moments after the landing, the president, wearing a green flight suit and holding a white helmet, got off the plane, saluted those on the flight deck and shook hands with them. Above him, the tower was adorned with a big sign that read, "Mission
Accomplished."

***
The landing came just hours before Bush is to tell the nation that major combat operations in Iraq have ended. The speech will be delivered from the carrier's flight deck at 9 p.m. EDT.

It's a nice, long article, but doesn't say a word about the "Mission Accomplished" banner referring to the ship's mission.  

History does not repeat itself, but it does rhyme.  (Mark Twain)

[ Parent ]
Even Rumsfeld admitted it referred to the war
You and this guy Rosen (whoever he is) have it wrong. From notorious left-wing hate site The U.S. Department of Defense:

           MR. WOODWARD:  This is such a serious history and a most serious issue --

           SEC. RUMSFELD:  Exactly.

           MR. WOODWARD:  -- that the country is dealing with.  And you know, one thing -- just one quick thing not on the list but someone told me about the other day, which I found fascinating.  When the person that gave that speech on the Lincoln with the "Mission Accomplished" on the back, somebody told me that the White House speechwriters had used MacArthur's surrender speech on the Missouri as a model.  And they literally had in that speech "the guns are silent," and you edited it out.

           SEC. RUMSFELD:  I took "mission accomplished" out.  I was in Baghdad, and I was given a draft of that thing to look at.  And I just died, and I said my God, it's too conclusive.  And I fixed it and sent it back..

           MR. WOODWARD: were you on the trip?

           SEC. RUMSFELD: I was. And we got it back and they fixed the speech, but not the sign.

           MR. WOODWARD:  That's right. But it had "the guns are silent," and someone said you line-edited it out and said the guns are not silent.

           SEC. RUMSFELD:  Yeah, that's for darn sure.

           MR. WOODWARD:  Is that --

           SEC. RUMSFELD:  Yeah. No, there's no question but that I was well aware that things were still happening there.  I was there.



"Have a Bobby bar! My dad made them." --Jon Huntsman Jr.
[ Parent ]
Ok.
I seriously did not think you were serious. That was funny.

But I will ask Rosen about it.  I don't expext an answer, but I'll ask him.

Hey, Mike.
Do you really believe that the banner was inceidentally only about that USS Abraham Lincoln and not a prop for  President  Bush's ""Combat ops are over" speech?  Really?
 

[ Parent ]
Oh Beej, you're so consistent.
I've posted MANY a quote, video and link how Pres Obama ALWAYS campaigned that he would fight the war we needed to (Afghanistan) while getting us out of the disaster called Iraq.

Promise #1 kept.  

"The nation which forgets its defenders will be itself forgotten." Calvin Coolidge

[ Parent ]
oh, no snipe

One of the greatest dramatic scenes ever filmed.
Skip ahead to 1:10 if you're in a rush.


[ Parent ]
Let's never forget that it was a whole bunch of Republicans whack jobs
led by Bush, Cheney, and the neocons that wasted $1 TRILLION of our taxpayer dollars (Oh, how we could use that money!), WASTED 4500 American kids lives, WASTED 60,000 injured lives (about 1/2 with severe life long debilitating injuries), WASTED 10,000's of innocent Iraqi lives, DISPLACED nearly 5 million Iraqi's.....AND all on borrowed money from China! REPUBLICAN policies that we will be paying dearly for....for decades.

Sure, let's put these whackjobs back in power in November. Fuckin A, man!

Oil's flowing at about the same levels as before the war. Contracts in the oil fields are not being sold to Americans to pay for the war....remember that lie of many, many lies!

One of the saddest decades of American history, FINALLY coming to an end.

Thank you President obama.

Now get us out of Afghanistan.

Exercise your right to peaceably assemble and reclaim the commons. Stop the militarization of America.

At least we didn't have to fight a world war this time.
If people had stopped Hitler much earlier like we did with Sadaam, things would have been much better.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
And had Superman failed to thwart Lex Luthor...


"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Saddam wasn't on the march to anywhere.
We stopped him back in 1991. All he ever did was shake his stick at us since then. That's why sensible people like me knew there were no WMD's before we crossed the frontier in March 2003.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP
[ Parent ]
Except they found yellowcake.
Another liberal talking point demolished.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Link?
 

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Just one of the many links I found.
http://www.americanthinker.com...

Can't you guys ever google anything?

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle

[ Parent ]
I assumed that was what you were referring to, but before I called you an idiot I wanted you to demonstrate it clearly
Although, unicorn lover you are, 'mathematician' and 'student of history' you won't recognize it.  Here is the quote, from that very (biased, wingnut) source even:

That yellowcake stockpile pre-dated 1991, and had been under the UN's International Atomic Energy Agency "safeguard" from then until 2003.  



"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Now go re read my comment, and tell me what contradicts that statement.


"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Never mind, I know I'm going to have to spell it out for you.
Sadaam Hussein had a nuclear program, one which he apparently hid from inspectors for quite some time. The fact that yellowcake was produced or arrived in Iraq in 1991 has nothing to do with it.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Nope. Not really since 1986 when Israel Air Forces blew it up.
But for sure not after 1991 when I blew it up again.
[ Parent ]
You personally blew up Hussein's nuclear program?
Do tell.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
well, me and 35 of my best friends at the time.
But I drew the maps and chose the targeting sequence.

It's still quite astonishing what a 2000lb laser guided bomb will do.  36 in a coordinated attack are something to see.

[ Parent ]
were you on the Louisville?

[ Parent ]
nope - we got there a little after

[ Parent ]
Wow, impressive.
But doesn't the fact that the Israel Air Forces blew it up in 1986 and yet you had to blow it up again in 1991 tell you something? It's not like Sadaam gave up.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Well, that's one thing.
But the ability to succeed or more importantly to project any ind of meaningful threat outside of Iraq is the main thing.

At the time ('91) we didn't know. But certainly by 2004 we did know.

Meanwhile if iw as all about evil leadership possessing or trying to possess nukes, biologic or chem weapons - why didn't President Bush insist on invading North Korea?
We're already at war with them. All he had to do was hit the gas pedal.

NKorea is not a threat and has no oil.
Iraq is not a threat.

[ Parent ]
We're at war with them?
If so, it's a technicality. North Korea has indeed been a threat, and once we finish with Iran and Afghanistan we may have to deal with them. For now though, they don't seem to be attacking anyone just yet.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
once we finish with Iran and Afghanistan
Will that be the entire Axis of Evil? Will the world be safe then, or will we have to finish off France?
[ Parent ]
Hmm, I don't know.
I suppose it depends if they fall for the U.N.'s bicycle plot.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
PS
[ Parent ]
As noted I didn't expect you to recognize the idiocy
of your statement.  

Nor do I intend to outline the obvious to you.  A completely worthless exercise I have found such to be.  Continue in your delusions, my little unicorn lover, 'smart' and 'well-credentialed' as you are.  

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
The inspectors knew about it since 1991
2003 comes after 1991.  

DOH!  There I went explaining the obvious, a worthless exercise.  

"There are a lot of reasons not to elect me." Mitt Romney in a moment of clarity

"I'm Mitt Romney and yes, Wolf, that's also my first name," Willard Mitt Romney demonstrating 'policy flexibility.'  

[ Parent ]
Did I talk about 2003?
And if the inspectors "knew about it", why did liberals so vociferously claim that there were no WMD in Iraq? Politics, maybe?

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
We didn't. Until after when we found there weren't and the intel was staged.
Wellstone, Obama and a few others got it right.

Most of us got it wrong.

[ Parent ]
But then they found the yellowcake.


"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
only in your nightmares.

[ Parent ]
Head still in the sand?
Didn't I post a link?

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
only in your nightmares.

[ Parent ]
Another right wing talking point demolished.
It's been explained to you. That yellowcake goes back before the first war and wasn't about to be used because Iraq had no means to use it anymore. It's like finding bullets in someone's house, but no gun to fire them.

Gee, it sure was worth it to kill all those people, and have all those troops die, and to have spent trillions of dollars upon. Was it worth it all, beej?

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

[ Parent ]
Wasn't about to be used?
What murderous dictator wouldn't want to get their hands on some yellowcake? With all the other chemical and biological weapons, I think it's a safe bet to say that Sadaam would have used it if he had the technology.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
would have used it if he had the technology
And if he'd had the technology, Saddam would have ruled an undersea kingdom of sea monkeys without ever having to surface. It's a good thing we stopped him.
[ Parent ]
...he was developing it.
That's why we had to stop him. Now if only Iran would pipe down.

"...energy shouldn't be in the market." - Aristotle
[ Parent ]
Even if that were true,
and to date no evidence has been found that he had any such plans (sorry, but speculation isn't admissible), you still have to ask if the means justified the ends. The Israelis were able to do a lot more damage to these programs with a lot less death and destruction, not to mention without spending trillions and screwing up our diplomatic relations with half the world.

Even if you can make the case that Saddam was a threat - a case no one has made credibly, to date - Bush's approach was akin to nuking a city in order to demolish a house to make way for new development. Calling it "overkill" is laughably inadequate way to describe just what a waste it was in lives lost, money blown, and sheer destruction.

"Thank you for putting your rank political motives on display." - ArapaGOP

[ Parent ]
Beej, you could eat yellowcake with no ill effects
n/t

Its just like Further, but with tax cuts! - Fidel's Dirt Nap
[ Parent ]
BJ, the math-scientist
Who was Valerie Plame?
What was her job?
What did her work show?
How did she lose her job?



Its just like Further, but with tax cuts! - Fidel's Dirt Nap

[ Parent ]
Bonus points

Who was prosecuted as a result?
For what crime?
Was there a conviction and if so what was the sentence?
What was the sentence for the last conviction of the same crime of a non POTUS/VPOTUS staffer?
[ Parent ]
But his "stick" was bigger than it looked.

By the by - we (and be "we" I mean Reagan, Casey. North et al) provided the chemical and biological weapons to Iraq in the first place.  

It didn't get headlines because we (and by "we" I mean the same group) did not take the proceeds and fund an illegela secret war in another country. As far as we know.

[ Parent ]
Read it again and again and again whackjob.
Let's never forget that it was a whole bunch of Republicans whack jobs led by Bush, Cheney, and the neocons that wasted $1 TRILLION of our taxpayer dollars (Oh, how we could use that money!), WASTED 4500 American kids lives, WASTED 60,000 injured lives (about 1/2 with severe life long debilitating injuries), WASTED 10,000's of innocent Iraqi lives, DISPLACED nearly 5 million Iraqi's.....AND all on borrowed money from China! REPUBLICAN policies that we will be paying dearly for....for decades.
Sure, let's put these whackjobs back in power in November. Fuckin A, man!

Oil's flowing at about the same levels as before the war. Contracts in the oil fields are not being sold to Americans to pay for the war....remember that lie of many, many lies!

One of the saddest decades of American history, FINALLY coming to an end.

Thank you President obama.

Now get us out of Afghanistan.


Exercise your right to peaceably assemble and reclaim the commons. Stop the militarization of America.

[ Parent ]
Thank you President Obama
for continuing to work on a responsible exit from these foreign engagements.

My best wishes for success in bringing the Israelis and Palestinians once again to the table so these decades old enemies can embrace a new dawn of a political solution to their divided lands.  Palestinian and Israeli rights will need to be recognized if there are to be better days ahead.

You sure don't catch this president on vacation much.  It was a great speech and appropriate for the occasion.

[ Parent ]
Some thank yous and STFUs
When the President of the United States addresses the public on TV, the whole world listens. He needs to address clear messages to our allies, our enemies, our citizens, our representatives, our troops and our veterans all at once.

So to those Republicans like Boehner and McConnell who have their panties in a wad because our President is commemorating an important event in our history, STFU! A good portion of this speech was the USA talking to the world. It's bigger than your stupid partisan politics. How you can turn "End of combat operations in Iraq" into something bad is beyond me.

Thank you to President Obama and the leaders of our military for giving our troops definite, measurable goals.

And last, but anything but least, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU TO OUR TROOPS AND THEIR FAMILIES! 7.5 years of combat is a long time.  4,400 deaths is a lot of deaths. 30,000+ injuries is something I can't even get my head around. During this time, you've had to support the Iraqi people, support friends and family at home going through tough financial times, and support each other. I know your role in Iraq isn't done. I just had a friend leave to go to Iraq 2 weeks ago. But I just want to say thank you.

It's a sad day when our politicians are comical and I have to take our comedians seriously.

Thanks Scott
This isn't like Vietnam where you see the helicopters being pushed off the flight deck and the fall of Saigon.  There will be more violence but the Iraqis are also exhausted from all the bloodshed.

Leaving responsibly is an enormous task that needed to be done.  The effects are linger for a long time and the final outcome could disappoint but leaving responsibly was the honorable thing to do.

Our thoughts are with those whose sons and daughters died in these far away lands.  Hopefully they will take some solace from the presidents words tonight.

[ Parent ]
U.S. Combat in Iraq Ends...Now! | 79 comments
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