Catholic Church Tells People to Oppose Health Care Reform Legislation

maybe change the block quote to match the headline

.
or vice versa.

The headline is contradicted by the text.  
The text says:
"Catholic Church Tells People to Oppose Public Funding of Abortion."  

If you're going to flat-out lie in the headline, wouldn't it be more consistent to monkey with the quote so that it supports that lie ?
.

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by: Barron X @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 16:45:11 PM CST

Ha, ha! You almost got me!

But this isn't you trolling, it's you not reading.  Try again.

"I'm all naked and wet!" - Homer Simpson

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by: droll @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 16:48:42 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Uh...

The statement Bishops are instructed to read tells people to oppose health care reform legislation. Thems the facts. Sorry if you don't like them.

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by: Colorado Pols @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 16:52:30 PM CST

[ Parent ]

contradicted by the text

... instructed pastors at parishes across the country to distribute material urging Catholics to oppose the health reform bills making their way through Congress

That squares with the headline. Of course they're opposing health care reform for some reason or another, but they're still opposing health care reform.

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by: RedGreen @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:00:58 PM CST

[ Parent ]

nice editing

... instructed pastors at parishes across the country to distribute material urging Catholics to oppose the health reform bills making their way through Congress for allowing public funding of abortions.

The Catholic Church is a stronger advocate of health care reform than the Democratic Party.  But it remains committed to following Jesus Christ, which means no abortion.
.

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by: Barron X @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 01:46:14 AM CST

[ Parent ]

appropriate editing

to draw attention to the action you said wasn't supported by the quote -- you'd already made the point about abortion funding. But again, everyone who opposed health reform bills does so for some reason, they're still opposing health reform because those bills are what's on the table.

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by: RedGreen @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 02:09:01 AM CST

[ Parent ]

BS BX

The Constitution makes abortion in the first trimester a civil right for all women.  Every elected and public official takes an oath to uphold the Constitution.  Catholics are forbidden by the 8th Commandment to bear false witness.  If the Church were following "Jesus Christ" OR their own doctrine, they would instruct all Catholics that they cannot take an oath to uphold the Constitution as long as abortion is a civil right under that Constitution.  NO WAY.

Church has been playing politics for 2000 years, doesn't have a damm thing to do with Christ....if the Church believed in Christ, they would not have to play politics.

So do me a favor, BX, drop the pious crap or read your gd Baltimore Cathecism

Voting Republican is legal, but it is morally wrong - David Thi808

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by: dwyer @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 08:28:38 AM CST

[ Parent ]

what was wrong with my post at noon pols?

http://coloradopols.com/diary/...

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by: wade norris @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:05:30 PM CST

[ Parent ]

There weren't enough embedded videos

and only a handful of bold-faced block quotes. Not up to your usual standards, Wade.

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by: RedGreen @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:20:48 PM CST

[ Parent ]

got it,

will use more flair from now on.

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by: wade norris @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:30:54 PM CST

[ Parent ]

If they're going to flat out lie to their parish...

they have to monkey with the facts - which they did.

The current health care reform proposals specifically state that Federal subsidy money for HCR will not go to fund abortions.

As a cynic, I'm going to have to say the Catholic Church has gone 'round the bend in the company of Sean Hannity.  If I were less cynical, I'd say it had something to do with their health care business.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result."  -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

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by: Phoenix Rising @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:23:20 PM CST

[ Parent ]

To avoid a "flat-out lie"

...please change your handle to Ridiculous X

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by: Jambalaya @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 18:51:43 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Gee, have we heard

from CS politician Bishop Mikey Sheridan?

Has he told people yet, that if they support heath care, he will withhold Holy Communion?

"It is for this reason that these Catholics, whether candidates for office or those who would vote for them, may not receive Holy Communion until they have recanted their positions and been reconciled with God and the Church in the Sacrament of Penance."  --Mike Sheridan

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by: WesternSlopeThought @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 17:34:03 PM CST

Express Advocacy

They appear to be opposing a specific piece of legislation, thereby risking their tax-exempt status.

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by: Stagarite @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 18:01:38 PM CST

Is that against the law?

I thought it was restricted to candidates only, at least at the Federal level.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result."  -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

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by: Phoenix Rising @ Tue Nov 03, 2009 at 18:08:16 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Here's a good explanation- and no, religious and other non-profits may advocate on issues

The free speech rights of religious leaders are already broadly protected by the U.S. Constitution. Clergy can and do address public policy concerns, ranging from abortion, gay rights and gun control to poverty, civil rights and the death penalty. Indeed, discussion of public issues is a common practice in religious institutions all over America.

The only thing houses of worship may not do is endorse or oppose candidates for public office or use their resources in partisan campaigns. This restriction, which is found in federal tax law, is not limited to churches and other religious ministries. In fact, it is applied to every non-profit organization in the country that holds a tax exemption under Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code.

http://www.au.org/resources/br...

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by: MADCO @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 10:13:39 AM CST

[ Parent ]

serious ? a non-profit shouldn't engage in politics ?

.
Have you read any non-profit charters lately ?
Practically every non-profit ever created was created for a political reason.  Whether fighting hunger or curing disease, they have politics, influencing decisions and influencing the public, at their core.  
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P...

Now, a non-profit should not engage in partisan politics.  Maybe that's what you were thinking ?  But health care reform is not a partisan issue.  

.

All day long the Democratic Party is pushing one religious belief or another: abortion on demand, homosexual marriage, access to healthcare, treating immigrants like human beings and children of God.  Why is it OK for your religious beliefs to inform your conscience, but its not OK for me, unless my beliefs happen to align with yours ?
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by: Barron X @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 02:01:36 AM CST

Just because you chase religious shadows everywhere

...does not mean that others are motivated by religion.  Stop projecting your silly superstitions on others.

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by: Jambalaya @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 09:00:19 AM CST

[ Parent ]

so, if you aren't informed by some religious beliefs,

.
where does your belief in, say, abortion come from ?  
Does science tell you that it's a morally acceptable choice ?  

.

From the Wikipedia entry for "Religion:"

A religion is a system of human thought which usually includes a set of narratives, symbols, beliefs and practices that give meaning to the practitioner's experiences of life through reference to a higher power, deity or deities, or ultimate truth.

Do you not adhere to some system of thought ?  
Haven't you recited some of your system's narratives and beliefs here ?  
Doesn't that system give meaning to your life experiences through reference to ultimate truth ?

People need some organizing beliefs in order to function.  Even you.
Go ahead and take pride in not belonging to an "organized" religion, you've earned that.  Without any sarcasm, I confess that needing the crutch of organized religion is a sign of my weakness.  At least on this web site, you come across as a much stronger person than me.  Good for you.

But your superstitions look just as silly to me as mine do to you.  I respect your right to believe such silly stuff.  But I must object when you act on that sillyness to kill children, for example.  

I'm not a very good Christian.  Billy Graham knew with 100% certainty that,despite whatever sinful acts he committed, or any evil that lurked in his heart, that he was assured of salvation because he took some unrelated passages of the Bible out of context and shaped them into a contract binding on Jesus.  
I'm not that clever.  I am even occasionally an agnostic.  I sure don't deserve the great reward promised to true believers.
I'm just a schlub hoping for mercy.  I also hope that mine is the "one true religion," as the Pope promises.  If I find out its not, when I cross the great divide, I'll be sure to let you know.  
.

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by: Barron X @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 13:09:48 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Science and the law and reason and my mother tell me..

..that I'm superior to you.  Who am I to question this fact?  I bow before the unexplained power of others.

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by: Jambalaya @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 19:26:40 PM CST

[ Parent ]

thank you. Finally.

.
Its been a long time coming, but in the end you admit that you DO have religious beliefs, handed on to you from yo momma.

Science and reason don't provide any rationalization for homosexual marriage, or for abortion.  But if yo momma sez they are good, you embrace that.  Fair enuf.  

[I cannot believe the rationalist Cajun spicy stew thinks that a quirk of law justifies or explains something, one way or the other, so I'll pass on that low hanging fruit.]

I acknowledge your claim to moral superiority, no questions asked.  After all, that's what your religion tells you.
.

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by: Barron X @ Fri Nov 06, 2009 at 11:31:23 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Certainly you've read about churches risking tax-exempt status due to politics...

That's nothing new.

It's my understanding that churches aren't non-profits; they're tax-exempt entities.

One Oklahoma newspaper article:

http://findarticles.com/p/arti...

A church that took out newspaper ads criticizing President Bill Clinton in 1992 lost its federal tax exemption.

Religious groups may also distribute voter guides, he said, as long as they are not biased in favor of or against a candidate.

Churches and related groups may also advocate for or against issues and, to a limited extent, ballot questions or legislation, he said.

"Churches and religious organizations may conduct educational meetings, prepare and distribute educational materials, or otherwise consider public policy issues in an education manner," Stell said. "However, a substantial part of its activities cannot be attempting to influence legislation, usually referred to as lobbying."

Stell said churches and religious groups that engage in prohibited activities risk both their tax-exempt status and eligibility to receive tax-deductible contributions. He said they may also become subject to an excise tax of up to $5,000 on each political expenditure, double that if the expenditure is not timely corrected.

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by: Canines @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 09:15:16 AM CST

[ Parent ]

The Episcopal Diocese of Colorado...

...passed a resolution at its Diocesan convention last month broadly supporting healthcare reform. The resolution was framed in general terms, i.e., not for or against any specific legislation, largely to avoid tax liability issues. Not-for-profit tax exemptions are justified on the basis of the public good created by the exempt entity. It's hard to rationalize express advocacy (lobbying on specific issues) as akin to operating soup kitchens or making rooms available for AA meetings.

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by: Stagarite @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 12:15:22 PM CST

The Episcopal Diocese of Colorado...

...passed a resolution at its Diocesan convention last month broadly supporting healthcare reform. The resolution was framed in general terms, i.e., not for or against any specific legislation, largely to avoid tax liability issues. Not-for-profit tax exemptions are justified on the basis of the public good created by the exempt entity. It's hard to rationalize express advocacy (lobbying on specific issues) as akin to operating soup kitchens or making rooms available for AA meetings.

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by: Stagarite @ Wed Nov 04, 2009 at 12:16:02 PM CST