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March 31, 2014 06:22 AM UTC

Monday Open Thread

  • 48 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

…A poor man is better than a liar.

Proverbs 19:22

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48 thoughts on “Monday Open Thread”

    1. No-one knows better the boundaries between fiction and non-fiction than Asimov, who explored it all. He used fiction to extend the questions he was examining in non-fiction.

      Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread in American life. It's waxed and waned. Al Gore's "Inconvenient Truth", and "The Assault on Reason" dealt with the scientific realities of climate change, and the growing culture of endlessly repeating talking points as a substitute for actual fact-based news.

      Al Gore probably was elected President by the voters in 2000. But the Supreme Court chose Bush, and so we had a "lost decade" – lost lives in two wars, lost treasure, lost ability to reason, lost willingness to compromise for governance.

      If we continue to disrespect and disregard our reasoners, our intellectuals, we have only ourselves to blame for what's coming.

          1. Why does our resident librarian hate local control? If the Front Range communities have done "the math" and determined that preserving their environment and creating twice as many jobs per-dollar-of-state-GDP  in the high-tech secter as opposed to what an oil-and-gas economy generates, why shouldn't those residents be able to make that decision?  

            Weld County is an oil-and-gas powerhouse; it's unlikely they would move to ban fracking.  Whether you agree with the method or not, the decision to frack or not frack is best left to them.  Every county in this state has some kind of "Weld County natural-gas-equivalent" asset/resource.  In the Larimer-Boulder corridor it's the human resources and the high-tech sector; on the eastern plains it's wind.  In the San Luis Valley its solar.  In the mountain areas and western slope it's tourism.  Let's stop exaggerating the role of oil and gas in the state.  The mining sector in toto is 4% of our economy….oil and natural gas as a stand alone are in the neighborhood of 2.25% of state GDP.  They are as important as any other sector that contributes to 2.25% of our state economy.

            The good news?  That gas isn't going anywhere else.  It's like a trust fund in a bank that we should be stewarding like the precious, finite resource it is. 

            2. Here's the rest of the 3/29/14 Chieftain article, including under the paywall:

              ‘Trust fund being raided’

              Group argues for local control in oil, gas drilling

              BY CHRIS WOODKA

              THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN

              Colorado communities

              should have the

              ability to set their own

              limits on oil and gas

              drillers, a Yuma County

              farmer told Puebloans

              this week.

              “In Eastern Colorado,

              we’re supportive of

              the oil and gas drilling

              industry, but every community

              is different,” said

              Michael Bowman, who

              is speaking in favor of a

              Local Control Initiative

              making its way to the

              state ballot. “Any decision

              about drilling is

              best put in the hands of

              the community.”

              The initiative is making

              its way to the ballot,

              and faces title hearings

              next week. It would

              allow local communities

              to place additional

              restrictions on oil and

              gas drilling operations.

              It would allow only

              STATE BALLOT ISSUE

               

              More on the web

              CHIEFTAIN.COM/

              NEWS/POLITICSLOCAL CONTROL/from page 5A _____________________________________

              restrictions that are more

              protective than those the

              state has in place.

              Supporters say local

              communities should have

              the ability to impose

              restrictions to mitigate

              impacts on air, land and

              water from chemical processes

              used in hydraulic

              fracturing of oil and gas

              wells.

              Communities which

              have done this are facing

              lawsuits from the state

              and industry.

              “Some communities,

              like those in the Boulder-

              Fort Collins corridor,

              have other resources,

              and it should solely be

              up the governor’s office

              and industry how those

              resources are employed,”

              Bowman said. “In Yuma

              County, it’s a resource

              that should be extracted

              to the benefit of Colorado

              and the local community.”

              Even so, the county

              should be able to impose

              appropriate controls

              on drilling activity, said

              Bowman, a former Yuma

              County planning commission

              member. He said

              it is an extension of the

              type of controls cities

              and counties already

              use in the process set up

              under HB1041, enacted in

              1974.

              He does not think the

              state should dictate how

              oil and gas companies

              operate at the local level.

              “To me, it’s the equivalent

              of a large trust fund

              being raided,” Bowman

              said.

              cwoodka@chieftain.com

               

              I thought it was unbiased coverage, for a Chieftain article. Thanks for visiting Pueblo!

            1. How about that January 25th Day of Action!  That has nothing to do with the measures working their way to the ballot–which allow for local decision-making on oil and gas matters as it exists for all other industrial activities, which still operate under local control.  Again I ask, "who is proposing [as in currently] a statewide fracking ban?" Bunch of industry fear-mongerers riling up low-info uninformed nutjobs.  

              You are so incompetent at what you do it's laughable.  Trolls like you are what give me hope.  

              1. DimTwitt, The fractovists want fracking banned everywhere. They recognize they can't do that so they are trying an incrementalist approach.  We both know their first choice would be national, plan B statewide, if not possible then try local in places like Boulder.

                1. Please cite one actual source for your statement: "fracktivists want fracking banned everywhere".

                  Peak Politics doesn't count. A real quote from an actual anti-fracking group, please.

                  I beleive that both ct and curmudgeon, as well as Michael, have asked for this previously. Having trouble?

                  2. Whatever invented slippery slope industry–and its self-loathing toadys–has to beat its breast about to try and confuse Coloradans is irrelevant.  Its the language of the ballot that determines the policy.  Good god almighty you are one dense individual.  

                2. …and Ft. Collins. And Lafayette. And Broomfield.

                  These four cities have a combined population of 334,451 citizens (a number greater than half the number of the entire population of our neighbor to the north, Wyoming), who, through the democratic process said either "no", or "time out". 

                  Why do you hate democracy?

                3. This will not happen often. I'm conceding AC's point. You are correct about one group, "Protect Our Colorado" calling for a statewide fracking ban.

                  This is in the tradition of asking for more than you know you will get in hopes of getting something reasonable in negotiation.

                  The "Local Control Colorado" ballot language is the "something reasonable in negotiation". It simply allows communities to choose fracking….or not.

                  Over-the-top hysteria and exaggeration does nothing to advance any pro-industry arguments.

            2. Our librarian seems to be stuck in a time machine. But, given that he could go back in time to January 25, he may not appreciate the  problematic steps it would (have) require(d) to bring about a ban under this scenario  1) they are(were) asking the legislature to put a moretorium in place (would never happen, even with Democrats in the majority of both chambers), and 2) even if that did happen, it would have to be able to survive a certain veto from the Governor (which would have happened by now). 

              In other news, there is (today, real-time) an industry-funded group proposing ballot language that makes the state environmental standards a 'celing' rather than a 'floor' and would allow local communities to, in effect, gut all environmental regulations.  What could possilby go wrong under that scheme?

               

               

        2. I was just about to shut down my laptop and leave for the day when I saw this unmitigated bullshit posted by the dipshit troll.

          As CT says, no one is seriously suggesting a statewide ban…even though there are some of those crazy radicals who think it should be banned from residential areas ( even though we all know proximity to fracking improves your health and your property values).

          But the important point to make is that all those numbers on the the trolls' chart are MADE UP SHIT…and I will encourage our rightie O&G expert to verify those ridiculous claims. Hah…fat chance of that.

          But, anyway, I'm off to enjoy beautiful southern Utah…bye!

      1. It would serve us better if he had written her into fiction and killed the character off. She would be remembered longer and remain a warning for future readers.

  2. Asimov was an inspiration to this teenage boy (when I was one). I devoured his books and credit him with helping to unlock my imagination. How sad for all those people whose lives and minds are so small and restricted.

    thanks for the posts, Dave and mama

     

  3. Hurry!  Hurry!  Hurry!  

    Today is the last day to sign up for Udallcare or you will face a massive Tax!

    Actually if you miss the deadline, that's OK we'll keep it open a little longer.

    About that tax, if you say it was a hardship you actualy don't have to pay the tax and documentation is optional.

    By the way, just to be consistent, apparently the website is not working today.

     

    3. If only those irresponsible free-loaders faced a massive tax like they should.  The $90 this year just isn't enough to make those folks get off their ass and get insurance so the rest of us don't have to pay their bills.

  5. Good laugh this morning, the banner ad up top here which is usually Winter Park or some such for me is a "oMG stop teh Obama!!!" ad today from the Koch-funded American Encore moneybags. 

    Their targeting clearly needs some retooling. Hilariously lame.

  6. and..Good morning from St.George! My wife and I are enjoying a mini-vacay over here in the beehive state. Visited Zion Nat. Park yesterday. What a splendid place!

    Headed for Bryce Canyon this morning….I am offline….smiley

  7. Some of us have been around long enough to remember when the US had two minimum wages: one for non-farm workers and another about 50% of that for farmworkers.

    Today we honor the life of César Chávez, one of many children of farmworkers to serve in the US Armed Forces, and all farmworkers across our nation who make America's agriculture strong. Without them our fields would not be tilled or planted and our crops would not be harvested or packed.

    Let us remember those people today  the man who first gave them a voice. And let us not forget we have a long way yet to go to achieve social justice for the least amongst us.

    1. Both will be just fine.

      People losing their jobs in the Obama economy will file for bankruptcy.

      Lack of quality of care and not covering specialty services will keep the funeral directors busy.

      Business as usual.

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