CO-04 (Special Election)
See Full Big Line
(R) Greg Lopez
(R) Trisha Calvarese
90%
10%
President (To Win Colorado)
See Full Big Line
(D) Joe Biden*
(R) Donald Trump
80%
20%↓
CO-01 (Denver)
See Full Big Line
(D) Diana DeGette*
90%
CO-02 (Boulder-ish)
See Full Big Line
(D) Joe Neguse*
90%
CO-03 (West & Southern CO)
See Full Big Line
(D) Adam Frisch
(R) Jeff Hurd
(R) Ron Hanks
40%
30%
20%
CO-04 (Northeast-ish Colorado)
See Full Big Line
(R) Lauren Boebert
(R) Deborah Flora
(R) J. Sonnenberg
30%↑
15%↑
10%↓
CO-05 (Colorado Springs)
See Full Big Line
(R) Dave Williams
(R) Jeff Crank
50%↓
50%↑
CO-06 (Aurora)
See Full Big Line
(D) Jason Crow*
90%
CO-07 (Jefferson County)
See Full Big Line
(D) Brittany Pettersen
85%↑
CO-08 (Northern Colo.)
See Full Big Line
(D) Yadira Caraveo
(R) Gabe Evans
(R) Janak Joshi
60%↑
35%↓
30%↑
State Senate Majority
See Full Big Line
DEMOCRATS
REPUBLICANS
80%
20%
State House Majority
See Full Big Line
DEMOCRATS
REPUBLICANS
95%
5%
October 23, 2010 07:46 AM UTC
105 Comments
I intentionally avoided both of Ard’s non-voting Obama-bashing diaries. I just couldn’t deal with the irrationality.
It just drives me crazy that the most pro-gay president in American history gets consistently bashed by short-sighted LGBT activists, because he feels obligated to fulfill his constitutional duties and refuses to overstep his constitutional prerogative.
Defending current law against challenges? That’s his responsibility.
Issuing executive orders that blatantly attempt to override an act of congress? Not in his authority.
in his duty to defend current law.
As a gay citizen, here are my biggest problems:
1) Comparing homosexuality to bestiality or incest
2) Fighting the INJUNCTION in addition to fighting the case
3) Not acknowledging that he personally believes the law to be unconstitutional (thereby allowing the DOJ to “nominally” defend the law while acknowledging they believe it to be unconstitutional).
Then again, maybe he believes equal protection rights really shouldn’t apply to homosexuals as a class, and the law isn’t unconstitutional. And if so, nuts to him.
If you don’t specify, I will take that as an admission that your comment is uninformed.
to defend the law. It is merely tradition. Taking the tradition as a requirement, however, he is not obligated to make “every conceivable legal argument” in order to defend it.
Nor is he obligated to fight the injunction.
“Merely tradition?” “Every conceivable legal argument?” I have a hard time believing that.
Granted, allowing Bush-era holdover attorneys to write the briefs on some of these fight was poor form. And granted, the president has been anything but the “fierce advocate” he called himself.
But try to square up this…
… with the above video. The one he posted at election time.
He refuses to state that he believes DADT to be unconstitutional.
http://www.towleroad.com/2010/…
And there’s lots of legal analyses (you have google, you can find them) suggesting many different options he has instead of defending the law
One mainstream (non legal blog) example:
http://www.newsweek.com/2010/1…
And come on, Republicans don’t wait for you to set the negative precedent. They’ll do it.
And taking quotes out of context.
The article is clear that there are plenty of options for the DOJ aside from the one path they’ve pursued.
… one of the rules of blogging is that you don’t tell someone else to google your arguments for you. It doesn’t work that way in court or in school – why should it work that way in blogs?
And the LGBT blogs are full of suggestions and analysis as to what Obama could do, but there’s little discussion coming from lawyers with expertise in this area. Lacking a legal background myself, there’s little I have to help me sort the wheat from the chaff. What’s your background?
I wish ohwelleke would weigh in.
Let’s just say, without further detail, I have a legal background. I don’t hold myself out to be an expert on this or any other area of law, however. But who is an expert in this area – the duty to defend that’s written down nowhere except in DOJ guidelines?
Here’s what I will say:
1) There are three exceptions to the traditional duty to defend. If Obama said it infringed on his constitutional powers as commander in chief, which he definitely could, since this negatively affects military readiness and cohesion, then it would most assuredly fall under the second exception. Also, if he would JUST PUBLICLY SAY HE THINKS IT’S UNCONSTITUTIONAL (yes, I’m yelling), it would fall under the third exception to the traditional duty to defend.
http://hunterforjustice.typepa…
Solicitor General – now Chief Justice of SCOTUS – John Roberts, under Bush I, laid out the three exceptions. He then chose not to defend a law and in fact argued a court should find it unconstitutional, even though it didn’t even fit an exception!
http://www.queerty.com/actuall…
2) President Clinton signed a law and enforced it (therefore fulfilling his duty to execute a law under the Constitution) without defending it in court:
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/…
The memo on the issue said “The President has determined that this provision is unconstitutional and, therefore, has directed the Attorney General not to defend it in court.”
http://www.scribd.com/doc/3933…
Look, I’m voting for Bennet. I’m voting for my rep – Betsy. But I think it’s far past time to admit Obama does NOT have to defend DOMA or DADT. Even Ted Olson, Solicitor General under Bush II, agrees.
http://reason.com/blog/2010/10…
It’s a political call. Good for him. I just wish my community wasn’t the one getting the shaft, and I wish people would stop saying Obama has to defend it.
and I’m sorry you couldn’t see fit to address the substance of my points.
Once you decide to shoot off your mouth, being convincing is your job, not mine.
Telling us you don’t know shit from Shinola isn’t a great start.
Or…I said I have a legal background but am not an expert on this area of law.
And neither is anyone else on this board.
I’ve been skeptical of these claims since they all seem to come from people without even a limited legal background, and I know that even “experts” don’t agree on the topic. So it comes to whether Obama deserves the benefit of the doubt. He just might not, at this point.
What if some future conservative federal judge finds hate crime laws to violate the equal protection clause?
Wouldn’t you like President Romney (Yikes!) or President Palin (Triple Yikes!) to feel obligated to defend the law in court? Or would you prefer Obama give them the political precedent to decline appeals?
Let’s not kid ourselves. Appealing the injunction is functionally defending the law.
If not, then the issue is decided only in one circuit. Then the rules might be different in California than Ohio than Florida. By appealing, it is pretty well certain that it will advance to SCOTUS, which will mean a ruling will apply to everyone.
As another gay citizen, here’s my responses:
1) Obama didn’t write the DOMA DOJ brief. In fact, I sincerely doubt he ever read it. He’s kind of been busy fighting two wars and fixing our broken economy. The people who wrote it were conservative DOJ officials left over from past administrations. I agree the wording was ugly. If you read the entire brief, though, it makes it clear that the administration believes that DOMA is “discriminatory and should be repealed by congress.”
Obama even released this statement the same day the DOJ issued the brief:
2) Fighting the injunction is effectively the exact same thing as defending the law.
3) He’s called it “discriminatory” and “unjust” on top of opposing it. His opinion is pretty clear. What else do you want?
“Then again, maybe he believes equal protection rights really shouldn’t apply to homosexuals as a class”
That’s an incredibly stupid thing to suggest. The man signed hate crime laws, is working to end DADT, and actively supports ENDA. Clearly he views LGBT citizens as a protected class.
He will not, will NOT, say that he believes those laws to be unconstitutional. Even when asked directly. (Or at least Gibbs won’t.)
And I don’t care if he wrote the brief or looked at it. He’s the President, it’s his DOJ, he oughta get his stuff together.
that he may well view at as constitutional but wrong and unAmerican?
If I were he and viewed it that way I would not say so and would hope that 1) a SC would find it unconstitutional and/or 2 that Congress would act and pass repealing legislation.
I would still like him to state his position.
then I think he ought to say he thinks it is unAmerican and wrong but keep his thoughts on constitutionality to himself
Barack Obama speaking to gay youth sends a signal, not only to America’s gay youth, but to people around the world – the Top 100 Gay Ugandans whose photos were just put on display in the national daily newspaper, and to the Russians whose federal courts this week ordered damages for a disrupted gay rights parade.
Simply put, I understand the frustration of guys like Arvadonian and the need for hurry from Dan Choi. But, in a democracy of millions and millions of people, change moves more slowly than we’d like. I’m older than Arvadonian and I’ve waited a long time – make that “worked a long time” for my rights, and his – but, suddenly, they’re coming quickly. Most Americans are already past the gay rights issues, which makes the process even more maddening – as progress seems to speed up, the process slows us down.
But, I’m still trusting a president that, a short 21 months after taking office – after literally millenia of discrimination – has signed hate crimes legislation, has signaled his OK of other GLBT-targeted laws, and has said that he will end Don’t Ask/Don’t Tell on his watch. Honestly, the blahblahblahgers at joemygod would kill me, but I’ll vote for Obama again – and Bennet and Udall and anyone else who will stand on the right side of history. Oh, and Ali, seriously, thank you – your advocacy, and that of guys like you from the right, is absolutely invaluable, as is the chorus of voices from everyone else here.
I had dinner tonight with high school friends, one with a gay nephew and another with a gay son. My first thought when this came up was, “Please, don’t say they want to hurt themselves,” – it’s a devastating feeling to think that right off the bat. It wasn’t that bad – mostly questions about dating, etc. But as parents, they don’t understand the vitriol directed against their young kids – none of us do
Their worlds – all of our worlds – will be better if we all pull together in the same direction – and that means doing the work, yes, work, of voting for men and women whose first priority is civil rights. It can’t be voting for candidates who don’t care – or who think maybe being gay is a condition similar to alcoholism – (Seriously, in this day and age, dude? Go back to Bedrock!).
It’s our duty to express our voices – and our support for those who need our voice. Please vote.
And it is an honor to be living right now, having the privilege to defend and implement the rights of minorities, with a civil rights movement that is still very much carrying on
I’m very lucky
(and we will succeed)
And let us hope all Americans remember that the promise of “free exercise of religion” incorporated into the First Amendment means just what it says: Catholic, Protestant, Jew, Muslim, Anabaptist, agnostic, atheist, buddhist, … just flat-out everybody.
We’re discriminated against, too.
Actually, the rich have to. The Bible says it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
Does the church still sell indulgences, or did that damn Martin Luther wreck all that?
of the gay community, I was still floored when I saw this video.
This was a very bold move. It was also an important one. It sends a very clear and positive message to anyone, young or old, who may be struggling with their sexuality.
Great diary Ari.
And the whole it gets better thing isn’t just for gays. Jr. High and High School have always been cruel places for those suffering under the dominion of mean girls and jocks for whatever reason. It was easier to lay low with your own group and not suffer quite so much back before electronic gadgetry so expanded the opportunities for additional non-stop humiliation.
The not very cool or popular kids survived and largely grew up to have lives as satisfying, if not more so, than those of their tormentors, especially the ones who were not cool because they were smart and not very athletic, especially the girls who weren’t perky hot and who didn’t play dumb. Of course it was the worst for gays not successful at passing for “normal” in my day. But it was no picnic for lots of us.
Middle School and High School wind up being a tiny part of life, though it certainly doesn’t seem that way at the time, and those who never again achieve the dominance they enjoyed as the school big shots and look back on those years as the high point of their lives are the only ones for whom it doesn’t get better. For the rest of us, the painful parts recede in the rear view pretty fast.
And that’s saying something!!!!
Happy Saturday.
Let’s hope Arvadonian sees it. He’s kind of an infrequent visitor these days. Probably he’s aware of the “It Gets Better” videos and likely has seen Obama’s by now.
These days I’m more impressed with actions than words….especially from this President who, give him credit, he does talk a good game.
I hope today’s LGBT kids are still alive when a President fights for our rights. So far there has only been talk on the campaign trail and no support. There has been zero fight and the reinforcement of Gibbs telling the world there is no fight. Actually, Gibbs is more of never answer that there will be support of any type.
The scary part is this president has squandered so much in not getting in front that we are now faced with more restrictions and institutionalized discrimination if the Republicans win majority. Places such as D.C. face loss of marriage rights.
Across the country the effect is it will be at least 12 plus years before we can see a equality friendly president. Obama stated before the election he did not believe in equality; that gays are not to be allowed equality in marriage.
His opening act of having Warren and the hiding of Robinson let the LGBT community know that he does not respect us or care about us for anything other than money. The campaign rhetoric has been that, pure rhetoric.
It is nice that he put out his video. I hope some children who do not know what the president has done and not done will believe it. For the rest of us – words.
I hope you read the comments I quoted above.
I’m disappointed he’s not doing more, but you’re taking the pessimistic view IMO. Past presidents have been hindered from fighting for Civil Rights in the past, and that’s no different from Obama. The tide is turning, and I’d bet a fortune that we’ll look back on this statement as a defining moment of that change in a few decades.
Sure, a step backwards now and then. Sure, in an ideal world your political goals would attained with a magic wand right now.
But this is reality. Three steps forward, one back, three forward.
LGBT rights are increasing, bit by bit, every day. Don’t aid the opposing side by not supporting those who aren’t perfect.
Equality is happening at the state, municipal levels, but not federal.
The Hate Crimes Act does not mean not being arrested for using the rest room. It does not give protection from being refused marriage protections. It does not make Social Security benefits available to the spouse of a married gay or lesbian couple. Remember Obama has stated he does not want to give marriage equality to LGBT people.
The rest of the crumbs given to the LGBT community such as visitation will most likely be revoked when the next Republican takes office.
The biggest change in the last few months has been the weight of public opinion shifting to allowing gays and lesbians to serve in the military. And even then the administration could not bother to put pressure on Congress to pass repeal of DADT, letting the vote happen to say “look – we had a vote, tough you lost, give us more money”.
The Republicans are jumping on marriage, I don’t know why except I suspect because Obama is against it. They are so anti-Obama that if he is against something they must be for it. I cannot see the Republican religious base letting the party get away with that.
There has been no effort to do anything that would change federal inequality. I have heard all the excuses, but seriously if Obama and his administration can only do one task before doing another (we can’t do DADT because we are doing X. then Y and Z, but Don’t worry give us more money) they are more incompetent than the Republicans describe them.
Granted, that’s Arvadian’s MO, you haven’t exactly said that, but there is a similar mindset.
So go vote Republican and see how much they help you.
they aren’t perfect. Fuck the Republicans too, if they aren’t perfect on civil rights.
You really have some gall, parsing. Would you ask any other minority group to accept anything short of equality?
“Settle, Muslims, the majority of Americans don’t want you to put your Mosque so close to ground zero. Yes, its bigotry, but you make them nervous.”
“Hey, lady, the company fired you because you are a woman. That is their right so no, you can’t sue them.”
“But Ma’m you are Catholic and he is Jewish, so no you can’t get married. The children would be so confused, and it is the children we are concerned about.”
Bottom line: I will not vote for democrats who want me to be content being a second class citizen….and I sure as hell won’t vote for republicans who want me to be fifth class.
Civil Rights for those groups came in fits and starts, and with setbacks and unfulfilled promises and half-assed action by the politicians. Read up on FDR and anti-lynching legislation sometime, or even JFK and the Civil Rights movement.
I”m not asking you to settle. I’m asking you to understand the reality of how civil rights change. How many blacks didn’t vote for Johnson or Kennedy because they didn’t score 100% on their wish list?
Ari says it right.
Blame Obama if Buck wins by one vote. It a combination of his actions and inactions that have led me to sit out the federal races.
Your excuses are your own.
If it helps you sleep. I hope, if Bennet loses, it is blamed on the gay vote. Perhaps we’d get a bit more attention out of this White House.
Most likely if Bennet loses, the media will conclude that Bennet’s pro-gay votes caused him problems, and that voters have endorsed Buck’s explicitly anti-gay agenda. Maybe he and all the people Jim DeMint helped elect will outlaw gay teachers in schools after the election. (I hope you didn’t think anti-gay legislation couldn’t get any worse in this country, because it always can.)
But hey, as the Marxists used to say, it’s gotta get worse before it gets better. Maybe in 20 years we’ll get another shot at civil rights for gay people.
When you start criticizing IrishPatti for her ethnic slurs against Italians, I’ll take you seriously.
Until then, I’ll just assume that you are a disgruntled ideologue who cherrypicks his or her causes.
I will never vote for a Republican or ACP or any of the nut jobs.
I did vote Dem all seats because it is important to keep the majority. Hopefully the Democratic members of Congress and other legislative branches will take notice that telling your base all sorts of good things on the campaign trail and then just asking for more money is not good. In fact when the administration insults you that really does not help.
Losing your base is good reason to take a look at what is being done, or rather what is not being done. Hopefully someone will review why this election is so close when it should have been a Dem blow out. There is no reason to lose like it is possibly going to happen.
I want Dems to be Dems not repub light. Stand up for working men and women. Stand up and fight. Take it to the Repubs if that is needed, but don’t go on vacation without even trying to pass unemployment extensions.
The treatment the LGBT community has received was not necessary, it would have been good to at least try to do something, other than ask for more money.
Take a look at Pam’s House Blend (not me) and you will see a lot more about where the LGBT people are.
I am proud to have Ed Perlmutter as my Representative. He does get in the scrum. But, he needs more Dems with him.
Well said.
I see Obama’s little video as a message of:
“Hey gays, don’t kill yourself. It will get better…unless you want to have your relationship recognized, join the military or have the misfortune of getting fired from your job in a state that doesn’t protect you….in which case you’re fucked cause I’m not doing a damned thing to help you. Sucks to be gay.”
Cut your nose to spite your face.
Other people in this nation have needs, too.
is that I should put the needs of those others that you reference over mine. I don’t accept that.
Why should I put your need to have my vote for a democrat over my need to have my relationship recognized by the government?
It is, afterall, my vote…not yours. I’ve put the needs of others first in voting for quite some time (choice has always been a make or break issue for me). No more though.
“unless you want to have your relationship recognized, join the military or have the misfortune of getting fired from your job in a state that doesn’t protect you”
Keep in mind that all of these are things that Obama is working to change…
He did not–not–say
He said, he, personally, from his own background, did not believe in homosexual marriage, as he understood this thing called “marriage”. He did not say he would not “allow” it. If you and your righteously indignant allies (I hate to use the term self-righteous for my friends. But it is true, Pam.) don’t discern that difference, and respect it, you fail yourselves, and you fail all of us.
If you truthfully, face-in-the-mirror, believe President Obama is an empty suit in the cause of gays’ civic rights, you are, simply, wrong. Or wilfully confused, which is absolutely indefensible. He is a “fierce advocate”. But he must still uphold the laws promulgated by our Congress. He swore to do so on inauguration day.
Homosexuals’ rights should not be an issue of politics. The whole discussion is a blight on the American conscience as dark as that of racial equality. But, in America, today, they are. And their attainment must be a political victory, if that victory is to last. That means those rights, in which I fervently believe, must be politically won to become permanent. Not by presidential fiat, but by political wrangling. Sickening, but true. Obama looks forward to a permanent settlement of those rights. He accepts that a permanent settlement must be won through the political process. That’s wrong, but he’s right.
Please, Pam. Affirm your self, your rights. Without any debate, you and all gays deserve more than “words” or “rhetoric”. But, in that affirmation, please don’t deny the integrity of the best ally we can imagine in the White House. In short, drop the self-satisfying, but non-achieving, “forsaken” rhetoric, the “victim” words . Please. We’ve got to win this thing.
Climb all over your damned senators. The Senate is the asshole institution keeping this political fuck-you in play.
No voting is surrendering!
Here is the link to an important LGBT diary on this topic: Pam’s House Blend
With Captain Wiggette on this one
Republican Attorney General Bill McCollum has decided on the last possible day to not appeal the Third District court ruling that overturned Florida’s law preventing gays from adopting.
He said that it would be best for the Supreme Court to handle this; I read that as a cop out. He knows which way the winds are blowing,especially as time goes on.
http://www.keennewsservice.com…
And downtown today I saw two women holding hands walking down the sidewalk. Didn’t seem that anyone cared.
So, Arvadonian, don’t these small but persistent steps of society changing count? H
ow about not effectively giving your vote to the very candidates that will do everything possible to STOP your ever increasing rights?
I have no delusions that Arvadonian (or other “Woe is me. I have no real choice.” folks) will read, much less heed, this message, but I’ll say it anyway: I really hurt for the suffering that gay people have undergone, and still experience, at the hands of unknowing, uncaring or wilfully cruel forces in our country, whether those forces are persons, religious cranks or political agents and institutions.
But I also cry for families thrown from the security of their homes by criminal banksters; for workers thrown from their jobs by greedy corporations and corrupted congresspeople; for young black men with no hope — no hope — of ever entering into a mainstream economy; for women of all colors and stations whose lives continue to be dominated by patriarchial ideology; by idealistic college kids who will graduate, not to the jobs of their dreams, but as serfs to credit capitalism; for America’s Muslim citizens who suffer suspicion and scorn in the “land of tolerance”; for Mexicans and Central Americans who have fled barbaric chaos to grasp at the straw of this nation’s (relative) fairness and prosperity; for those older Americans manipulated by political cynicism; and for those Americans who embrace confusion, who wallow in their inability to discern their own legitimate self interest — for you I pain the most.
I also hurt for our chosen leaders — the wiser ones, the empathetic ones, the ones whose hearts beat in sync with the hearts of those of us whose hurt they recognise — who daily walk the walk, then are abandoned for not sprinting their talk.
BUT: In an election, hurting doesn’t count. Crying doesn’t count. Votes count. You want to send a message, Arvadonian? Your non-vote won’t send any message to anybody, except “I don’t care.” And that’s a naked self-pitying lie.
OR: You care. Perhaps you actually do care about your own civic needs and the needs of fellow gays, and about the necessity for changes that will improve the lives of others in your community, gay and non-gay: people without jobs, families without homes, black guys, women, seniors, subjects of religious persecution, economic refugees, and others like you who have accepted confusion and denial, and for whom you could be an inspiration.
It’s your call. Don’t vote. Lie. Or vote. Send a message that you care.
That is why I sent the letters to the candidates who I did not vote for. That is why I’ve called (monthly since January of 2009) demanding action on gay rights issues.
Don’t confuse my non-voting for apathy. It isn’t. It is anger.
It all has the same end result.
I saw Obama’s message…and it is the very least he could do. In short, I’m not impressed.
What would it take to impress me?
1) Stop loss executive order on DADT enforcement.
2) Don’t appeal the judges’ rulings which found discrimination against gays and lesbians in DADT and DOMA unconstitutional. I’ve read the discussions here saying that Poor President Obama doesn’t have a choice….I’m not buying it, and here is a link to a summary of several legal scholars who don’t buy it either. At minimum, there is disagreement.
http://www.newsweek.com/2010/1…
3) If you come down on the side that you must appeal, then fine….appeal. But don’t request an injunction preventing the implementation of the judges’ ruling while you are appealing. You claim you want these discriminatory laws gone, what better way to make them go away than to show that when they were found unconstitutional the world didn’t fall apart with mass straight divorces and suddently gay folks losing all of the wars that we are in.
Finally, I understand that some people within the gay community are fine with slow progress (in my opinion these people have been so beat up for being gay they have begun beleiving the rhetoric that they are second class citizens). That isn’t me. I’m tired of hearing divorced people tell me that the government recognizing my relationship would weaken marriage. I’m tired of being told that gay tax money is good enough for the government but gay military service isn’t. I’m tired of gay people being fired for being gay and having no legal recourse. But most of all, I’m tired of working my ass off to elect Democrats who promise the world and deliver nothing.
I submitted my ballot yesterday…I didn’t vote in the Senate or the CD 7 race. I will not vote for any incumbent democrats for federal office until ENDA is passed (they couldn’t even be bothered to vote on it in the last two years); DADT is no longer the law of the land; and DOMA is no longer the law of the land.
This is a site for politically engaged people. I have more repsect for BJ and David than you. As wrong as they are they at least try to impact the results. You have surrendered! See where that gets you.
Get a grip.
Arvadonian is engaged. He just isn’t doing what you (or I, for that matter) think he should be doing. He’s voting most of his ballot and withholding two votes in protest. There’s nothing more politically engaged than protest via the ballot.
Sorry again to offend. I disagree with not voting but should be a bit more classy.
None of your comments we in any way out of line, rude or offensive.
So take off your hairshirt and man up would’ja?
When all the votes are counted, do you think a Minus-One will stand out as a protest? A no vote is, well, no vote. Simple. You want to send a “message”? Then send a message. Votes are not messages, they’re choices.
Mature citizens make choices.
Arvadonian has a long history here as an engaged and thoughtful polster. (David goes even further back.) He’s earned his place at the table, and at the very least there’s no call lumping him in with a thicky like beej.
I’ll not go away….I just refuse to be the good little gay boy and do what you think I should. I have a brain, I’m fully engaged and I don’t need permission from you or anyone else to participate in a discussion on MY RIGHTS.
Keep it up, asshole, and I’ll leave my entire ballot blank in two years….just to piss you off.
Stay classy my Friend! You my friend apparently have some anger issues you need to deal with. You can post whatever you want but you better expect some response.
I’ll not be bullied by you or anyone else, friend.
We’ll show them Dems how pissed we are!
Boy, that worked real well, didn’t it? That wasn’t Kerry taking the oath of office, you know.
Do you really, really think that if Dems pull a squeaker that they will sit around saying, “Whew, that was close. We really have to do more for the LGBT voters!” Fact: They, nor anyone else, will have a clue how many votes were withheld by those unhappy with federal sexual policies.
On another thread we Dems are appalled that a Hispanic Republican is telling Hispanics to not vote, then we have our own Benedict Arnolds right here.
not voting for Nader. Not voting for Perlmutter. Not voting for Frazier. Not voting for Bennet. Not voting for Buck….and in two years, likely not voting for Obama.
As to the Hispanic Republican who is telling Hispanics not to vote, no one told me not to vote in these two races…I made that decision on my own. I’m not encouraging anyone else to follow my lead.
Parsing, I do have a question for you though, how many more gays and lesbians being thrown out of the military is acceptable to you?
One is too many, of course.
Be sure to keep writing letters of protest…..to your Republican representatives.
then you should share my outrage with Obama for, at a minimum, not issuing a stop loss order.
I will continue writing letters of protest to whomever claims to represent me in Washington.
I don’t need your respect. I respect myself.
Sorry man. We are on the same side we just have different visions of how to get to the prize.
I am 100% on your side of this issue.
Really does a minority of the population and voters make a difference? We make up roughly 8% of the U.S. We can only make noise, and rely on the Republicans to yell and scream about how powerful we are. If you listen to them we have more influence and power in this country than the roman Catholic church.
But it is a lie. We have 8% +/- a touch.
I am the optimist in hoping that almost losing this year will wake up the Dems and get them back to being Dems.
The other view is if the Dems lose enough elections being Republican light they might actually work at being Dems.
It takes guts to be out in America because there are no federal protections for your job, or SS benefits, or tax benefits. It does not take anything for a Representative or Senator to take up the fight for equality. It is cowardly to do nothing or worse.
that gay voters gave roughly 75% of our votes to Obama…and we are one of the higher particpatory demographics….it is fairly easy to figure out that we can swing close elections.
And that isn’t even addressing how much cash we pump into democratic campaigns.
It is cowardly to do nothing, to not make those choices, to not vote.
It is even more cowardly to not hold elected officials accountable when they don’t deliver on their promises to you.
And one more given….Bennet and Buck are TIED in the polls so I’ll just bet that Bennet would have preferred that Obama and Reid would have made DADT repeal a bit of a bigger issue in the senate right about now…you can bet he would have preferred to have my vote instead of a blank ballot sitting in a box at the Arvada City Hall.
I disagree. The least he could do is sit on his hands. This is a risky thing to do with the election at hand. That can’t be overstated.
But I respect your choice. I have the luxury of being a straight ally, meaning it’s not me who is suffering legal discrimination. It’s not me who is being asked for money and getting lip service in return for my contributions. It’s not me who has to pay lawyer’s fees to draw up a legal arrangement guaranteeing my partner has hospital visitation rights, nor is it my legal arrangement that can still be challenged in court by bigoted in-laws. Much as I can see the injustice, and seethe and rail at it, I can’t experience it.
I hope that your protest is noticed and that the Dems take up the fight. I’m still not convinced that the President really has the authority to do the things you and others say he can do, since even the legal minds out there can’t agree on the topic. But that aside, I remember what a similar protest vote in 2000 gave us, and I fear that this will put the brakes on progress even more.
And I think Arvadonian is similar to a large number of voters, he elected the dream team and 2 years later he sees no improvement. So what to do when the effort and votes puts your team in, and you still don’t get improvement.
Refusing to vote is basically the nuclear option. I don’t think we’re at that point, but I understand how others can be.
You equate “sees no improvement” with “don’t get improvement”. Just look at what we’ve gotten. It’s a hell of a lot more than you, or Arvadonian, see. And whose problem is that?
And most of all, thanks for acknowledging the different perspective you have as a straight ally….very few here seem to recongnize how easily they are willing to trade off the rights of others.
I wonder if you would be just as angry if the President ignored LGBT issues altogether.
Just curious.
put myself in right now. He campaigned to be a “fierce advocate” for gay rights. He hasn’t been. He sure knew how to fundraise from our community, I’ll give him that!
My irritation with Obama began when he invited gay bashing Pastor Rick Warren to deliver his inaugural invocation. Of all the pastors he could have chosen, he chose an Evangelical who has made his name partially on his support of Prop H8. (He couldn’t pick some nice no-name Methodist pastor from Maryland?) Then it escalated when his justice department equated gay relationships with pedophelia (the complete ignoring of ENDA over the last two years also helped it pick up speed) and went into overdrive last week when he appealed the court rulings on DADT and DOMA (I know you say he doesn’t have a choice, I don’t buy it and I’ve submitted my links outlining legal scholars who are on both sides of the issue).
At this point, I’ve pretty much given up on the man. I really don’t think he has any intention of delivering on any of his campaign promises to the LGBT community. Nothing could make me more pleased to be proven wrong, and if I am, I’ll be the first to step up and admit it. I’ll even vote for him in 2012.
Like my friend’s mother that voted for Bush because he is anti-choice. Not that he ever did a damned thing for the anti-choice people, and despite bankrupting the country and putting us into to wars, she voted for him.
So, just go ahead and not vote for the people who are not dropping every legislative need this nation has just to meet yours.
That’ll show them! (NOT!)
As a person who has spent a lot of time travelling and living outside of the US I have no patience for not voting. So Arvadonian and David sorry if I have offended it is not personal. I am just passionate about this issue.
We’re in the last 2 weeks and it’s going to be a damn close vote. And people who put 100% into efforts to get someone elected is critical to our system, but it inflames passion (which in sum is a good thing).
I’ve also worked outside the U.S., but in the industrial world where they do vote.
It is all good. I have just spent too much time in countries where either people can not vote in open fair elections, so I am passionate aboute it. And yes I should apologize because as you pointed out we all tend to get emotional but should “be excellent to each other.”
Any voter who thinks that a man who actively campaigned to be in charge of the world’s largest killing machine is also a man who has the individual voter’s welfare in mind is just deluded.
Power, P-O-W-E-R is the name of the game. Electing any person to office because you think that person cares about anything except their own self-aggrandizement is laughable. Elect them because you think they will (or at least might) enact policies you support, but don’t elect them because they say things that make you feel all gooey inside. Those are lies for the campaign. The particular lies in this video are for the current congressional campaign and for Obama’s 2012 re-election campaign.
Note: whether or not you agree with Obama’s words here, they are lies because they are spoken out of a cynical desire to affect election outcomes. He’s desperately trying to reach those 20-somethings who voted for him in 2008, patted themselves on the back for “making history”, moved on to other Facebook campaigns (e.g. Betty White on SNL), and are never going to mark a ballot again. In other words, it’s a gimmick. Remember, just like with the stock market, if you can’t figure out who the sucker is in any campaign, the sucker is you.
One thing that we/I have not been able to get across is what being a minority, a very tiny minority means when promised equality.
There is an overall feeling of betrayal. Obama promised so much equality when campaigning, and that he would fight for our equality. The reality was he poked us in the eye with his Warren inauguration preacher. Than as time went by we began to realize equality was not on the agenda.
When it came time to appeal an equality ruling the DOJ came up with every stereotype and out dated statement there was. When it came time to support LGBT people, there was no support and Gibbs stuttered all over his lying mouth.
Each and every possible moment there was an opening to “fight” for equality there was the opposite tack or nothing. This has been going on from the start.
The sense of betrayal in the LGBT communities across this country is huge. With DADT the focal point due to his major fight to preserve it at the same time he promises that he desires it to be repealed. That the promises are seen as more BS is because we have heard this before. On the campaign trail and for two years in office and the fight has been to preserve it.
You cannot understand the feeling of let down in my communities. So much had been promised and then nothing or worse has happened.
What are our options? Voting numbers are tiny. Money numbers are good, except the gAyTM is closed. The drop in LGBT contributions is very noticeable now. We only have power through money and allies. So by cutting back the money there is a little hurt being applied.
Hopefully, our allies will put more pressure on the White House to bring about a little of the equality and change we were promised. But the history is not in our favor.
for a crazy long post, but I need to make a point.
Andy Tobias (DNC) created a list of Obama’s thirty greatest LGBT accomplishments in his first two years.
THIRTY. In 24 Months.
Don’t like the guy? Fine.
Disagree with his interpretation of his duties? Fine.
Don’t like the strategy he’s taking for accomplishing equality? Fine.
But let’s stop pretending there’s an ounce of homophobia in the man.
If the debate tonight doesn’t make Arvadonian reconsider…
He said elsewhere that his ballot’s in the mail.
But it’s a good list, one that ought to be food for thought at least.
But facts aren’t going to “engage” those who’ve already given up on thinking, unselfish civic participation, it seems.
Some are definitely more impressive than others, but the fact that the President has done so much for our community speaks volumes.
And yet for Arvadonion and apparently, Pam, that’s not good enough.
On a tangent, Obama truly suffers from a Perception Problem. For instance, those of us on the sorta far-ish left don’t see him as having done enough economically, or in HCR. But similar to this lists pop up, and I have to admit I’m impressed. Sure, no single payer system, but a hell of an improvement, for instance.
I recall him meeting the Republican congressmen at some dinner awhile back. He was very much on the offense in a spirited debate, call “BS” on them when they used Talking Points parading as Facts. He knew, from memory (no Palin Palm needed) what some of these guys had said at times. It was very impressive.
Here we are going into the midterms and instead of being on a defensive, we should be on an offensive:
“We all want jobs for Americans. We could have had XXXXX amount of more jobs except for the obfuscating Republicans who lie to you, the voters. Blah blah etc. blah.”
is this give up attitude.
Can you imagine Martin Luther King writing from the Birmingham jail that because Democrats weren’t moving fast enough on civil rights that he Martin Luther King was going to undervote and let Strom Thurmond decide how civil rights would be defined?
Can you imagine Jared Polis saying that he wasn’t going to run for office because people weren’t making it easy for him?
Can you imagine change being easy and light hearted with no effort or tears necessary?
It was a stupid protest by Arvadonian and showed little backbone or heart.
Arvadonian isn’t an LGBT leader. It would be more fair to compare him to an African American c. 1960 who thought the nonviolence movement wasn’t doing enough and was throwing his lot in with Malcolm X and the Nation of Islam instead. (People tend to forget that the existence of more militant, insistent groups like that gave white leaders added incentive to deal with MLK and the SCLC.)
On the contrary. I used the most powerful weapon I have—my vote—to deliver a message. I notified the two candidates who would have otherwise received my votes why they were not receiving them and then simply did not vote in the federal races as a way of sending a message. I completed my ballot for all of the state and county races, ballot initiatives and judicial retention questions.