Tuesday Open Thread

“Forgive me my nonsense, as I also forgive the nonsense of those that think they talk sense.”

–Robert Frost

39 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. Duke CoxDuke Cox says:

    Breaking news…

    Trump gives away farm to Kim!

    Fleeing gang violence no longer an acceptable reason to seek asylum.

    EU and US ready to divorce…

    US and Canada in cat fight…wall imminent.

    Trump preparing new coalition of dictators…..

    Prepare for Fortress US.



  2. I hit an emotional wall yesterday. After all the assholery of the current administration and its party-affiliated enablers, I finally reached a point yesterday where I cried for the state of my country and my religion (or at least the name of my religion). I don't know just which piece of news it was; I suspect it was Jeff Sessions' declaration that the US would now turn away domestic and gang violence victims as asylum seekers (stacked on top of prosecuting all illegal entries including asylum seekers, and separating all immigrant children from their parents, and…)

    Whatever the cause, I'm done. I've had it with the cover right-wingers pull on when they claim morality. They have none to speak of. They're cowards and fear-mongers and outright bigots. There's no compassion there. Not even the barest thread of following Christ remains. They're no better than generations of so-called believers before them, reduced to sucking Mammon's teat and proclaiming how much better they are. Fuck 'em. Not-so-sorry, Moddy and AC and other Trumpists – I won't join the name-calling, but you're all pieces of shit for supporting the vile policies that define the Republican Party these days.

    Oh, and stay upwind – if you can.

    • VoyageurVoyageur says:

      I left Christian church 55 years ago, PR.  I couldn't believe in a God that commanded genocide (Jerico and many others) and murdered babies still in their mothers wombs because they were sinners (Sodom and Gomorrah, etc.)

      Plus, I was rather fond of cheeseburgers, which Leviticus says are abominations because meat and dairy have to be on separate plates.

      Alas, I can no longer sin by cheeseburger s because I've had to go vegan to try to control diabetes.  And I still regard Matthew 25 as among the most sublime guides to humane behaviour ever written, a passage Mike Bowman cited yesterday.

      I can respect the horror with which you look at the Trumps and the Kochs.  But enjoy their efforts to pass their camels through the eye of a needle.  No, it's not a gate in Jerusalem.  It's proof that they will never enter the kingdom of heaven, not even here on earth.

      Jesus was in prison and they invested in more private prisons that they might profit from his pain.

      He was hungry and they cut his food stamps so they could give tax cuts to the rich.

      He  was thirsty and they ordered their servants to take his water and wash their  Porsches and BMWs, so the dust would not dim their grandeur.

      And as they did to these, the least of his people, they bowed to Putin and Kim and vowed to Make Hell great again.

      Pax vobiscum, friend.  

      Whether there truly are deities or not, your fight is a righteous one.

    • The realistThe realist says:

      Totally with you.

  3. JohnInDenverJohnInDenver says:

    Looking forward to reading comments from Sen. Cory Gardner on the amazingly wonderful summit he helped prepare. Anyone have a guess how he'll spin the conference of world leaders in Singapore, where we got promises quite similar to previous sets of talks, *resident Trump agreed that joint military exercises are irritating, and there apparently was discussion about the real estate development possibilities of the North Korean shores?


    • JohnInDenverJohnInDenver says:

      And … Cory's website says:

      Gardner Statement on President Trump Meeting with Kim Jong Un

      Washington, DC – Senator Cory Gardner (R-CO), Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Subcommittee on East Asia, the Pacific, and International Cybersecurity released the following statement regarding President Trump’s meeting with Kim Jong Un: 

      “The Trump Administration, under Congressional direction, deserves praise for abandoning the failed policy of strategic patience and pursuing a maximum pressure campaign that has resulted in unprecedented sanctions against this heinous regime,” said Senator Gardner. “Today’s summit must be followed by multiple meetings to test North Korea’s promises of denuclearization, which they have made in the past and then repeatedly violated. Until such time as North Korea takes concrete steps to denuclearize, our policy should be to continue the maximum pressure campaign. The complete, verifiable, and irreversible denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, as enshrined in US law and multiple United Nations Security Council Resolutions, must be the only goal of US engagement with North Korea. ”


      No comment on *resident Trump's admission that China has allowed more goods to go through its border.

      No comment on *resident Trump apparently agreeing to abandon joint military exercises.

      No comment on *resident Trump talking real estate development possibilities — "Boy, look at that view. Wouldn’t that make a great condo? Instead of doing that you could have the best hotels in the world right there. Think of it from a real estate perspective, you have South Korea, you have China, and they own the land in the middle, how bad is that, right? It’s great,” Trump said.

  4. PseudonymousPseudonymous says:

    I've never understood why Democrats don't devote more bandwidth toward trying to make voting rights a big issue.

    — Nate Silver (@NateSilver538) June 11, 2018

    • mamajama55mamajama55 says:

      Some of us do make voting rights a big issue – and we take a lot of shit for it, too.

      But I'm getting away from the computer for the rest of today. And I'm about to start my summer job teaching adults, so won't be on here much.

      I know a few who will be happy about that.

    • As part of my newfound outrage, I'm thinking of lobbying national Democrats for a Voting Rights Amendment. We don't technically have a right to vote, not in the Constitution. And bigots and party-control fanatics have been using that lack to suppress the vote since at least the end of the Civil War.

      It's so simple; it's black-and-white, really. You don't want citizens voting or you do. Democrats are on the right side of this and have been for years now, but they're fighting small battles. Put up an amendment and it becomes a single issue that illuminates the problem.

      • JohnInDenverJohnInDenver says:

        Voting Rights amendment is a fine idea …

        I'd complicate it a bit by insuring not only a national right to vote, but mandating Congress must set up a uniform standard for voting rights across the nation. I would like Congress to consolidate and set rules to:

        • eliminate discrepancies allowing former felons allowed in some states, but not in others;
        • eliminate a hodge-podge of rules about how long you must register before an election;
        • end differential treatment of the residence of students and those doing military service;
        • end the denial of representation (and a meaningful vote) if you live in US territories;
        • clarify standards of residency and identification needed to vote (and setting up ways EVERY citizen can satisfy them without personal cost).

        I'm sure there are others I'm not immediately thinking of — but this is a start.

        • mamajama55mamajama55 says:

          Those are good, John, but include automatic voter registration with motor vehicle registration, pre-registration of 17 year olds. Colorado is a leader in electoral reform (Thanks Senator Giron!), and other states are copying our system.

          Timely remote internet voting by deployed military. (Gilbert Ortiz fought a long battle over this in Pueblo – those "patriotic" GOP pols wanted to deny deployed soldiers their voting rights)

          Basically, citizens should automatically be registered to vote unless they are convicted of and serving sentence for a crime.

          Eric Holder /Barack Obama are fighting to roll back partisan redistricting.

          But the best all around voting and elections resource is the Brennan Center for Justice.  Here are their key principles for fair elections:

          The Brennan Center works to improve our voting system and bring elections into the 21st century. This starts with our signature proposal, automatic voter registration, which would securely add millions to the rolls, save money, and curb the potential for fraud. We also need to create more opportunities for Americans to vote by creating a minimum early voting period. This will make voting more accessible for everyone and provide a safety valve against Election Day overload. Finally, the federal government needs to set minimum standards for voting — including voting machine, polling place, and resource allocation — an idea Americans overwhelmingly support.

        • Amendments have historically been very simple but profound. The right wording should cover all of it. A right to vote is a right to vote.

  5. mamajama55mamajama55 says:

    Immigration detention deaths reach the highest total since 2009 –  and that was before they started breaking up the families and putting young kids in jail.

    What you can do:

    Sign the petition at familiesbelongtogether.org

    Find and attend a support rally or march on June 14 (in Aurora, Denver, Pueblo so far in Colorado, and over 4,000 signed up in >60 cities nationwide  so far.

    Write to your representatives and ask them to cosponsor and vote for one of the bills sponsored by California congresswomen Roybal-Allard, Torres, and Feinstein. The two bills so far are the Help Separated Families Act of 2018,  and the HELP Separated Children Act, and the Congress member introduced it along with Sen. Tina Smith (D-MN).

    Also,  House Democratic Reps. Pramila Jayapal of Washington, Bennie Johnson of Mississippi, and Zoe Lofgren of California are leading a group of 108 Democrats calling for Congress to say that no DHS budget funds can be used for family separation.

    -Vox, by Ella Nilsen

    In the Senate, Diane Feinstein has also introduced a bill, title unknown.

    • Why do we hold rallies on weekdays? And at 5pm when people are just leaving work, or in the middle of the day…

      I couldn't make an Aurora rally even by 6pm.

      • RepealAndReplace says:

        Why do we hold rallies on weekdays?

        Because real social activists do not trouble themselves with matters such as employment or work. They simply make a lot of noise and complain when they do not have a government willing to hand out free stuff to everyone.

      • mamajama55mamajama55 says:

        You're in luck, PR, RR, cook….there is a following "Zero Tolerance for Family Separation"  rally at 6:30 at Montview Presbyterian church in Park Hill. That's probably the one I'll be at, since I'm also working that day.

        Thursday at 6:30 PM – 8 PM Montview Boulevard Presbyterian Church

        1980 Dahlia St, Denver, Colorado 80220

        People will rally at the church, then march 1/3 of a mile to Temple Micah on Montview . This reflects the interfaith organizing of the immigrant rights movement.

        The Aurora ICE facility rally at 5 pm may have been scheduled at 5 partly to encourage those incarcerated in the facility, who will be in dinner or recreation at that time.

        As far as press coverage, Gertie, it isn't my responsibility, and these are young and inexperienced people organizing it, so I hope that they have their bases covered. You're right that the timing isn't convenient for reporters on deadline.


  6. ZappateroZappatero says:

    Message to Democrats:

    Several Senate Democrats were deeply offended when their colleague Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) publicly called them out by name for backing a bank deregulation bill that will heighten the chances of yet another devastating financial crisis, but that hasn't deterred the Massachusetts senator from continuing to denounce members of her own party for cozying up to corporate power.

    I’m guessing, no, almost sure, that our very own SFL Bennet was one of the offended.

    She said this: "Until we have all of the Democrats who are willing to fight for the American people and not for a handful of billionaires and giant corporations, then it's going to stay an uphill fight."

    I’m also sure most around here don’t agree with Liz, but how else do you explain voters who voted twice for Obama and then the last time for Der Drumpf?

    To this voter that shift seems inconceivable. Yet it seems they are somewhere out there.

  7. PseudonymousPseudonymous says:

    Bernie Sanders supporter attends every DNC rule-change meeting. DNC member calls her a Russian plant.

    Selina Vickers’s weekend trip to Rhode Island was as cheap as she could make it. She shelled out $143.60 for a train ticket from West Virginia to Providence, where the Democratic National Committee’s rules and bylaws group was meeting.

    She paid $68.07 for an Airbnb in Cranston, a short commute from Providence. Once there, Vickers did what she always did at DNC meetings — she took notes, recorded video and made sure that the party was committing to overhaul its primary rules.

    A few days later, Vickers was accused of being a Russia-backed agent of chaos, working to destabilize the Democratic Party from within.

    The DNC’s current argument over how to overhaul its primaries process, which has now lasted longer than the United States’ involvement in World War I¹, achieved a special kind of absurdity Monday when longtime DNC member Bob Mulholland asked whether Vickers’s appearances at meetings were paid for by Russians. Mulholland, who often cc’s reporters on his memos about the rules debate, speculated over the weekend that “someone is picking up her expenses” and that this was evidence that “the Putin operation is still active.”

    • JohnInDenverJohnInDenver says:

      Ought to encourage BOTH of these people to take a moment or two and introduce themselves.

      A quick search of Google turned up another Mulholland moment:  someone named Tim Black tweeted yesterday: "I just spoke with DNC Member Bob Mulholland. Bob thinks the Green Party is funded by Putin and aims to hurt Dems by cutting SuperDelegates. Bob blames Jill Stein. Bob ignores most Dems favor SuperDelegate reform. To Bob it's always the damned Russians."

      Just checking … is there anyone similar to this on the Colorado delegation to the DNC?

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