Farewell Pols and Friends

I am sad to say that after this diary (and any discussion contained herewith), I will no longer be posting or participating with Coloradopols.  

As such, I wanted to take the opportunity to that Pols for allowing me to share their “soapbox”, and providing what was a great opportunity to exchange ideas, have heated arguments, and form friendships.

I would also like to express my deep appreciation for some of you who I have enjoyed exchanging ideas with.  While I fear that I may forget some, here I go…

David-I very much appreciate your level headed approach to our discussions and your posts.  You are a great ambassador for liberalism, and if more posters were like you, the blogging world would be a vastly better place.  Please keep up the good work!

Steve Harvey-Thanks for your intellectual and respectful approach to your views.  Discussing things with you has challenged my understanding and views, and has made me much more grounded in or changed my views.

Ari-While our discussions have gotten heated at times, we always managed to put that behind us and not hold a grudge.  You’re great!

Laughing Boy-Setting your endorsement of Obama aside 🙂 you have been a great voice for conservatism.  You’ve fought a lot of fights that I didn’t have the energy for and I always valued your input.

Redstateblues-Man, you rock!  You are one of the most intellectually honest posters here, and you have a way of seeing past the partisan crap.  Keep it up!

Dabee47-Man, if you’re not training to become a political scientist, you should be.  I deeply valued your perspective.

40 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. JeffcoBlue says:

    What’s up?

  2. DavidThi808 says:

    This sucks. This really really sucks. It’s not discussion when everyone agrees, it’s mutual masturbation. I say we tell Haners he’s not allowed to leave.

    ps – thank you for the kind words.

  3. redstateblues says:

    I don’t know what to say. Thanks so much for the kind words. Coming from you, it means a great deal.

    It’s been really fun discussing politics with you this past year or so. I hate to see you go. You’re by far one of the most level-headed conservatives I’ve ever met, and I always appreciate the way you try to have a conversation without compromising your principles.

    Shoot me an e-mail sometime: redstateblues2008@gmail.com

  4. GOPwarrior says:

    You’re a good guy, but the people who say conservatives should flee this blog are wrong. I’ve been reading this blog since 2005 and I really don’t see what the big deal is with these “Dead Governors”–their arguments aren’t that strong and they have lost debates before. Warriors take the fight to the enemy, and they are stupid enough to allow us in.

    I should stop before I give them any ideas. Anyway, thanks for all the reasonable things you’ve written here. I personally think 2010 is our comeback year, and I think I’ll be here rubbing some anonymous blogger face in that.

    • ClubTwitty says:

      Warriors take the fight to the enemy, and they are stupid enough to allow us in.

      Been eating your Wheaties I see.

      I personally think 2010 is our comeback year, and I think I’ll be here rubbing some anonymous blogger face in that.

      Please come back to do that in December ’10.

      • GOPwarrior says:

        I will be accepting your apologies.

        The rug is coming out from under the Democrat Party’s feet, and you’re all still mesmerized by Obama’s bedazzling speech at Invesco. Hey Pols, you guys were there, right?

        CLOUDED YOUR JUDGMENT. You’re not able to see that the pendulum is swinging back now, and Americans will come back to their founding principles so fast you can’t believe it. This is a conservative nation.

        • Aristotle says:

          The pendulum swings in much greater periods than that.

          I think CT will be man enough to apologize should you be proven right, but based on your short commenting history, I can’t say I believe you’ll do the same if proven wrong.

          • GOPwarrior says:

            Because your side has everything to lose now.

              • Yokel says:

                Your side is utopia by way of the “perfection” of humanity by state fiat.

                I’d be happy with eutopia.

                • Steve Harvey says:

                  of a position based on micoeconomic theory of the value of the alignment of individual incentives to collective interests for mutual benefit, a major aspect of the evolutionary lathe which selects human memes and the social institutions they encode, producing such mechanisms as markets, governments, norms, and ideologies.

                  I assume neither that government, nor markets, nor norms, nor ideologies are uniquely superior as an a priori position, but rather examine our real challenges and real opportunities, one at a time, and apply an analysis to them to determine what mixture of those social institutional mechanisms combines efficiency, fairness, and sustainability in such a way as to maximize some reasonable balance between the maximization of the total production of utility, the maximization of the justness of its distribution (or of the distribution of opportunity to access it through individual effort), and the maximization of its sustainability, here and elsewhere, now and in the future.

                  I presuppose no teleogy, no final state of affairs in which the quantity and distribution of utility is permanently and absolutely maximized (“utopia”), a notion that seems to me to make no sense whatsoever, but rather recognize it as an ongoing challenge, in which we can be doing worse or better at any given moment, and in which striving to do better is the logical choice.

                  Repetition of shallow cliches is easy; systematic examination of a complex and subtle reality is more useful.

                  • Yokel says:

                    “Because I believe in the ultimate perfection of society by fiat.”

                    • Steve Harvey says:

                      But in the third paragraph of the post to which you are responding, I very explicity wrote that I don’t believe in “ultimate perfection” but rather “ongoing improvement,” and in the second paragraph I cogently explained that I don’t particularly privilege government (“fiat”) as a means to that ongoing improvement, but rather view all of our institutional fabric as the field in which we operate. I also explained that the challenge involves aligning individual incentives to collective interests, which is, in a sense, the opposite of “fiat.”

                      Other than that, you really hit the nail right on the head (once again). There’s that hammer of dogma at work again!

                    • Yokel says:

                      When applied over time, it IS “ultimate perfection.”  It’s science.

                      Also, “aligning individual incentives,” in practice, is indeed by fiat.  Who do you think will do the aligning, especially when individual and collective interests come in conflict?  Obviously by disincentivizing individual interests by…  fiat.  

                      It’s official, you don’t even know what you believe in means when carried out to its ultimate end.  It’s the soft tyranny not of utopia, but of Huxley’s dystopia.

                    • Steve Harvey says:

                      to affect the world for the better through the social institutional apparati at our disposal is the pursuit of utopia by fiat, then why do you bother to engage in these discussions, and how are they exempt from your expansive definition?

                      I tried to affect this notion of improvement through many institutions: Education, communications, literature, conversation, and, yes, the political process. How should I try to affect the world, and why is it “by fiat” when I try to affect it, but it is just good ol’ whateverthehellyouthinkitis when you try to affect it?

                      Aligning individual incentives is what markets do, what contracts do, what laws do, what morality does, what ethical guidelines do, what every single institution which purports to contribute to human welfare does. You impute something to it which facilitates your presumptive conclusion about who I am and what I advocate, conveniently ignoring what I actually say on those matters.

                      But, Yokel, as I said to your last post on another thread, you win, I concede, go forth and multiply, and promote your wisdom so that all the world can be as enlightened as you. I will seek to battle that misfortune, of which you are just one miniscule carrier, where I can, how I can, when I can. Conversing with you clearly is not such a venue. You will believe what you want, hate those who offend you with absolutely rational arguments that declare to your own satisfaction are not, and that is as it is. Up is down, in is out, and you, my friend, are absolutely right, about absolutely everything.

            • Aristotle says:

              Once you go that far out on the limb, you’ll look so stupid when proven wrong that you won’t show your ugly map around here for a while – which will come as a relief to your allies as well as your opponents.

  5. Danny the Red (hair) says:

    You are a solid conservative with a strong moral and ethical center.

    I like to think I share your virtues and only differ with you on politics.

    Your level of courtesy and respect have been an example to me and your presence will be missed.

    I felt saying this important enough to break my self imposed semi ban.  

    I’m really disheartened, because I was thinking about coming back after the session was over and all the conservatives of conscious are leaving.  

  6. A-bob says:

    it’s so sad to see a conservative go though 🙁

  7. Steve Harvey says:

    I sure wish I had read this before I posted what may well have been a wrong assessment on another thread. I haven’t interacted with you much since my return to Pols under my reverse-name reversed, but I always appreciated your willingness to listen to arguments-qua-arguments, rather than to perceive and respond on an ideological level. And I have really, greatly appreciated your civility, your respectfulness, your incidental reassurance to me that not all conservatives take an instant loathing to me!

    I wish you well. Feel free to get in touch with me any time: I’m easy to find.


  8. Aristotle says:

    Yes, things do get heated don’t they? 🙂  Well, I’m very sorry to see you go. Pols is a bit like family, at least among the regulars, so it’s always sad to see someone bid farewell. But I know where you’re coming from.

    Take care, and good luck! (Or is that live long and prosper? I never remember my etiquette…)

  9. Yokel says:

    I’ll try to hold my own when I can, but I don’t quite have the patience for hanging out in a liberal wind tunnel that you always did.  Take care.

  10. cologeek says:

    You will be sadly missed.

  11. Canines says:

    Hoping you find enjoyment doing whatever else you’ll be doing while away from the site.

    While here, you did a great job as a moderator and a thoughtful commentator.

    Best of luck.

  12. Car 31 says:

    Your opinions are some of the better ones aired here.  You will be missed and hope you’re able to come back someday.

    Good luck to Mr. H!  

  13. Middle of the Road says:

    I’m sorry to read this. I’ve enjoyed your perspective here so much. Feel free to change your mind and drop in any time you feel like it, okay?  

  14. Your voice will definitely be missed here.  I wish you the best, and hope to see you ’round here again some day.

  15. comnВў says:

    We will miss your intelligent, thoughtful and courteous posts.  I hope someday you will come back into the fold.

  16. GOPpundit says:

    I monitor this blog regularly, though I no longer spend time conversing here.

    Hit me up any time at goppundit@gmail.com.

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