President (To Win Colorado)
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(D) Kamala Harris
(R) Donald Trump
80%↑
20%
CO-01 (Denver)
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(D) Diana DeGette*
(R) V. Archuleta
98%
2%
CO-02 (Boulder-ish)
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(D) Joe Neguse*
(R) Marshall Dawson
95%
5%
CO-03 (West & Southern CO)
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(R) Jeff Hurd
(D) Adam Frisch
52%↑
48%
CO-04 (Northeast-ish Colorado)
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(R) Lauren Boebert
(D) Trisha Calvarese
90%
10%
CO-05 (Colorado Springs)
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(R) Jeff Crank
(D) River Gassen
80%
20%
CO-06 (Aurora)
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(D) Jason Crow*
(R) John Fabbricatore
90%
10%
CO-07 (Jefferson County)
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(D) B. Pettersen
(R) Sergei Matveyuk
90%
10%
CO-08 (Northern Colo.)
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(D) Yadira Caraveo
(R) Gabe Evans
50%
50%
State Senate Majority
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DEMOCRATS
REPUBLICANS
80%
20%
State House Majority
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DEMOCRATS
REPUBLICANS
95%
5%
August 18, 2006 05:55 PM UTC
86 Comments
And yet another wave washes over the BB campaign in the press today: Feds snubbed BB, Vets are mad about another ‘Mexican time’-like quote, and Survey USA has proven BB has no where to go to; Unaffiliated voters are, by over 50%, breaking for Ritter.
BB shills: where are you?
It’s like an echo chamber in here…..
What are you talking about? I don’t understand what “feds snubbed BB, Vets are mad about another ‘Mexican time’-like quote and Survey USA has proven BB has no where to go.” Can you elaborate?
A spokesman for Beauprez said he simply meant that he was relieved to have his draft status defined. “There was some uncertainty about his status,” said John Marshall. “Once that was cleared up, it allowed him to get on with his life. Bob has fought tooth and nail for veterans.”
Is that why he missed the vote to secure $52 million for the VA hospital in his district?
He wants to use the rhetoric without the action.
There have been conflicting reports re: the nature of Both Ways’ medical disability. Someone posted on here that it was due to asthema. Someone else disclosed that he had a boil on his buttocks. (I do not question the existence of a boil on his buttocks, but that just developed last Monday with the selection Janet Rowland as his running mate.)
What was the actual medical disability from which Both Ways suffered, or suffers?
actually he had a “bleeding ucler” which most men groan their way through with either surgery and meds, or just cutting back on the fatty foods.
I personally do not think it’s an excuse for a deferment, but Rove came up 4 good excuses along with Bush, Cheney and rest of the Chicken Hawks.
What profiles in courage we have serving as our leaders! And let’s not forget Tom “Back to the Border” Tancredo and his bount with depression which got him out of Vietnam.
The bleeding ulcer ocurred while he was in High School. He was playing football for CU when his draft numbers were called. Some 4 to 5 years later (at least). Way, way, way after the surgery and hospitalization.
“I’m frustrated with the administration and I’m extremely frustrated with Congress,” said Beauprez, who is running for governor
“EXTREMELY FRUSTRATED WITH CONGRESS” while he serves in the majority party for the past several years of do nothing on real isses.
He’s been a part of the problem, not the solution. He’s a rubber stamper who has done nothing for this state, but inflame our numerous national crisis.
A surpising amount of voters have already made up their minds. With U voters going for Ritter more than 50 percent, and less then 20 percent undecided, Bob has no where to go for votes.
I would expect attacks to start soon to try to peel off some of those who have decided.
There’s not a lot of negative stuff out there on Bill Ritter. He’s pretty much of a 50-year old Eagle Scout.
Their first salvo was that as D.A., Ritter plea bargained most cases. Big deal. Is there anyone over the age of six who has not heard of plea bargaining in the criminal justice system?
Ritter’s biggest potential problem as D.A. could backfire on Both Ways if he tries to use it. It is the way in which Ritter handled police misconduct cases. He didn’t prosecute any of the cases of alleged misconduct.
Here’s the problem with Both Ways trying to raise that as an issue. Most of the victims of police misconduct cases were African American or Latino.
While Both Ways may try to depress support for Ritter amongst minority voters by emphasising Ritter’s role in letting cops get tough on criminals (albeit perhaps occasionally getting a little too tough), Both Ways actually will be boosting Ritter’s standing amongst moderate-to-conservative, Anglo suburban voters.
Votes which Ritter may lose in north Denver he may make up for Jeffco, Arapahoe and Douglas counties.
Well, there’s always that fatal traffic accident in Africa and the allegations of eating monkey meat. I would expect Trailhead to work those two to the max……….
“Feds skip Beauprez event”
http://www.denverpos…
“Beauprez comment irks vets”
http://www.rockymoun…
Survey USA
http://www.surveyusa…
Enjoy the reads.
there never really was many BB supporters to begin with here. Half of the non lefties were for MH and the other half for BB.
But by the way, wasn’t it not long ago that Ritter was way down on the bottom of your totem pole? Wasn’t there a mayor for some second rate city that was on the list for knightdom?
Oh you forgot about that….OK. So now Ritter is the saviour lord and master defender of lefty values.
I get it.
The fun will start when he pushes to ban abortions.
That will be a good day…………
It’s called a primary process to find the best candidate for the party, and the Democrats managed to succesfully find great candidates to run through the primary process. If you are bitter, upset, and a crumudgeon, you’re must likely a conservative.
Us, “lefties” do not declare our candidates that we support as “saviour lord,” since we respect both religion and politics by keeping them separate from one another as our founding fathers intended (note: Thomas Jefferson).
And to throw out a blatant lie that Ritter will ban abortion when he has never waivered on his stance to oppose abortion, but not change the law to completey ban it is weak willed and shows your calousness.
second choice is more like. You just have a short memory of all the hoopla you libs were spouting for Hick a few months ago. Then he told you that he wanted no part of it as he had it made sucking up funds in the ghetto called Denver. Ritter was a speck of dirt on the floor to most of you back then.
HAHA
We’ll see when your #2 choice gets in and taxes go up, inflation goes up, unemployement goes up, and abortion is banned.
GO RED
If you want to argue with yourself, that’s great. I just laid out the facts and you cannot accept that. Much in the same manner as Conservative cannot accept SCIENCE!
Marilyn Musgrave’s heroic fight in the Fourth District shows a woman of deep values standing up against the tide of liberalisn and RINOism that is infecting the country and attacking the American Spirit. Her mainstream values will protect us against the radical agendas of the Big Spenders and Al Qaida sympathizers who hate this great country.
I agree Rizzo. The recent “poll” is just wishful thinking by the radical leftist. AP doesn’t have near the political clout that Matsunaka had and AP has a ton of baggage that Matsunaka didn’t. So I think Marilyn’s fight to stand up and represent the values of CD 4 and her willingness to speak out on the issues that matter to most of Colorado and America is what really wins the day and makes her stand out from the crowd. Unfortunately, it’s also what makes her opponents howl and scream. But it’s good that she has vocal opponents, it means she’s effective and they can’t stand it.
Contrast her opponets with Hefley in the 5th, nobody ever said anything about him. Why? Because he never really stood for anything and he just got along to go along and he was never effective. In the end, nobody had anything really good to say about him, but nobody said anything bad either. People were forgetting who he was even while he was serving in office. It’s a sad commentary really.
Marilyn Musgrave is someone who stands for personal responsibility, and who doesn’t run away from the consequences of her actions. That’s why she makes sure that the family is protected and that people aren’t burdend by excessive government.
RINOs like Hefley have attacked Republican leaders just to make headlines, and tried to undermine the party’s leadership. A Real Republican would have stood up against the slander but he bought it. Marilyn Musgrave is on the side of heroic conservative leadership in Washington.
Thank God for MM. My family was absolutely terrified of gay parents wanting to get married. I was heading toward alcoholism and divorce, and my daughter toward butch lesbianism, until MM came along and introduced her failed amendment. Now I’m handsomer than ever and my marriage is like the Rock of Gibralter. My girl is studying how to be another June Cleaver. Thanks MM!
for MM. My family was absolutely terrified of gay parents wanting to get married.”…….
Kinda funny you make your little funnies about that.
I just heard a couple days ago that the first lesb couple that filed for marriage just filed for a seperation.
Awww I guess they were just not meant for each other.
… that there’s no reason to oppose gay marriage. Their failed marriage shows that gays and lesbians can be just like any hetero couple.
Aristotle,
Your logic just goes to show….that your a dumbass!
Guess I’ll hang my head in shame and never post again. I’m a dumbass! You know it’s true because “sybil” says so, without providing a shred of rational argument against gay marriage … because there isn’t one to be had. Hmm, maybe I’m not the dumbass at all…
Clearly this comment is designed to fire people up.
So, have it your way.
You certainly haven’t been out door-knocking.
The average voter is completely fed-up with partisan extremism.
I am happy to report that old “chamber of commerce” type Republicans are rising up and are prepared to take their party back from the neo-cons.
You need to get your face out there at the front doors of the average Coloradan. They are mad as hell, and they aren’t going to take it any more.
Call them whatever name you will RINO or whatever, they aren’t going to be bullied by you.
What I am hearing is, “stick a fork in me, ’cause I’m done!”
I have talked to numerous Republicans who are saying, “this year I am voting Democrat”.
This election cycle, Mainstream trumps Wing-nut.
Real Republicans are rallying around Marilyn Musgrave, because they have every right to be proud of her heroic leadership in Washington. She stands up for Traditional Values against the onslaught of the radical agenda behind public education, anti-Faith, and Taliban apologism. Real Republicans won’t waver like the RINO bed wetters and tax hikers.
john marshall? is that you?! how about expanding your horizons when it comes to insults, you already used bed-wetting on ritter so cmon now think of something new. just a thought.
tmgt hit the nail right on the head!!!!
I wouldn’t use the name RINO to describe myself, but I’m probably the kind of person you’re referring to.
I’d describe my voting habits as similar to that of a customer deciding which store to shop from. I might shop more frequently from the Republican Party, but I don’t feel any loyalty to them and don’t see any reason why I should. You shop from the store that serves your needs the best and if one stops doing that, you try the store next door.
Standing up against the tide of RINOism seems like a self-defeating strategy to me. It’s a little like a store deciding it won’t compete for comparison shoppers anymore; it’ll just sell to idiots.
I’m not in Musgrave’s district, but I have a lot of respect for some of her principles. If she spent more time protecting the practical interests of people in her district, she wouldn’t even be in a political fight this election. She needs to cover the whole spectrum, not just part, if she wants to be successful.
Marilyn Musgrave’s strength has meant good representation in Washington, because she’s on the side of responsible leaders who believe in fiscal conservatism and Traditional Values. That’s why farmers know she is on their side. The RINOs will give in and change their minds and blow with the wind. Marilyn Musgrave is truly strong because she stays true to her values in the face of evil.
Truly, just wondering if you could expand on what you mean.
http://www.denverpos…
Sounds like Bobby really does like it Both Ways…
Is Tipton on TV and radio already? I hear the White House is sending in big guns to raise money for him.
New Survey USA poll has Bob down 10 points.
http://www.9news.com…
Pretty small sample though.
was furter blasted in both Grand Junction newspapers today, both replete with articles on Rowland’s bestiality rant. The Grand Junction Free Press editor went as far as to say that Rowland meant exactly what she said. Since the Rowland choice was announced, Bill Ritter’s poll numbers have now have climbed into double figure range and he appears to be putting a comfortable distance over the Beauprez/Rowland dog and sheep show.
The Al Franken show today. Al played the audio clip of Rowland comparing homosexuality to beastiality twice. So glad that Both Ways Bob’s running mate can bring national attention to his sham candidacy.
It brings national attention to the Colorado governor’s race. At least we’re important enough to talk about. Okay, so it’s for a comedy writer and talk show host…
That was bitter sarcasm. National coverage that highlights the stupidity of Republicans is A+ in my book!
As an avid fan of Colorado politics for many, many years now I have never witnessed a poorer performance from a consulting team as the one put together by Peggy Lamm’s congressional campaign.
I truly believe that Peggy would have been a fine candidate for congress. But the truly sophomoric and pathetic performance by Rick Ridder, Faye Diamond, and Tyler Chaffey just irks me to no end!
The Ridder-Braden (RBI) Team of bumbuling buffoons has once again ship wrecked a candidacy. RBI has not won a statewide or congressional campaign in Colorado since Mark Udall’s 1998 congressional campaign. People, that’s going on a decade of failure! Why would any rational candidate or interest group ever hire such a group of unadultereated losers?
Yes we know that Rick’s connections and familiy name has kept him in play for many years, but this “lucky sperm club” rational for hiring him has frankly got to STOP! It’s time to call on all Democratic campaigns both locally and nationally that care about advancing the cause of putting an end to the Republican demise of our way of life to disregard the foolish out-of-date, out-of-touch service provided by RBI. Its time to win baby, and Rick doesn’t know how to spell the word!
pissedDem
Stay tuned . . .
Just wanted to make sure you knew how to spell my name.
What’s yours?
Does anybody from the Perlmutter camp know why Ed hasn’t accepted O’Donnell’s debate challenge yet? We’re ten days into the general election and I would like to know when and where Perlmutter is going to stomp Rick. I have no doubt that Lamm would’ve stood next to Pelosi (our future speaker) and that she would have faced little Ricky already. What’s the deal?
Miss this? The morning after the primary Ed sat down with little Ricky on 9news’ morning show. At 6:00 AM. The morning after his victory party where I personally witnessed him leaving around 11:30 PM.
Don’t get your panties in a wad, Ed’s doing a pretty good job at just letting Ricky shoot himself in the feet at this point.
As a more or less ordinary (albeit opinionated) voter (not affiliated with either party, never worked on a campaign, not much into policy wonk), I think debates are a bit of a pain and are best served up close to Election Day. Anytime after October 1 is good. If they insist on having multiple debates, space them out 3 weeks or so. Debates aren’t like sporting events to me so I can wait.
your crap about not being affiliated with either party, never worked on a campaign and not much into policy wonk and you blog on this site? Yeah I really believe that your are “a more or less ordinary voter”. What a pile of bull.
You don’t have to be any of those things to care about politics. Really. Trust me on this. I know your having trouble with these complicated subjects, but it’s really possible.
You sound defensive Aristotle. Admit it, you’re full of crap!
Is that your best? Hmm, took you a couple of hours to think that up. Strictly kiddie league stuff. Oh well. When you’re ready to leave the shallow end of the pool maybe one of us will teach you how to swim.
I’ve had it with this idiot.
We’ve got the president of the fucking United States of America lecturing a US court of law that it’s supposed to reach decisions NOT based on the rule of law, but on “the nature of the world we live in.”
You God damn stupid fuck.
You have the nerve to claim Osama and the terrorists hate our democracy? They got nothing on you and your fellow “Republicans.” Do you people even believe in freedom? Do you believe in the Bill of Rights? Do you believe in our Constitution? Do you fucking believe in anything other than your absolute power to do whatever the fuck you want like some two-bit communist dictator rather than the president of the greatest country on earth?
We live in a democracy, you incompetent ass – one that is quickly eroding because half the people of this country elected a moron to the presidency (twice) and now are so embarrassed by their vote that they refuse to stand up and demand an end to your idiotic reign of terror.
These are judges you’re demeaning. American jurists. The people in charge of our laws. And you speak of them like they’re nothing more than crap. You and your party have contempt for our entire system of jurisprudence, the entire system of checks and balances our democracy is based on, because you can’t get your way 100% of the time. Well boo-fucking-hoo. We are a country of laws, you stupid stupid man.
The world in which we live is one in which the town drunk thinks he’s the king of the fucking world.
Osama bin Laden is a danger to be sure. But the greatest threat to our democracy is from George Bush and his genuflecting Republicans. (h/t to John @ Americablog)
Tell us how you REALLY feel! 🙂
What is the matter with you. Watch your language. Didn’t you learn enough English or manners do stop the foul language. It is not polite, it is inapprorpiate and I thought not allowed on this board. If you spread anymore of this foul language and the Pols dont stop you I will report this to anyone or thing I can think of.
Note to POLS try to encourage civilty. It elevates the discussion, makes people want to participate and just may help out our county into not being warring factions that can find no commonality but just want to assinate one way or another anyone that they don’t agree with.
I would not support any candidate or agree with any thought you may try to express because you show what kind of a person you are by your language. Anyone you support, I saure wouldn’t. Grow up and learn some manners. Right now I don’t think of you as a decent person or American just a nasty foul mouthed jerk.
One – he’s quoting from another posting. (Note the “h/t”, meaning hat tip, at the end.) Obviously he agrees with every word, or why post it.
Two – If you are so unable to handle adult language that you would actually discount what’s being communicated on that basis alone, you’re not the one in any position to question someone’s maturity or intellect. Granted, this kind of hyperemotional stuff does not encourage participatory debate, but then again nothing Sir Robin posts ever does.
Wow! So this is what it’s like when a whole lot of lefties get together to talk politics? We’ve covered Bob Beauprez’s butt cyst and then a whole bunch more other rubbish. Listen, this site is a real beauty. I mean…who else would put out a betting line on political races. When they put out lines on horse races, it is quite often that the underdogs win. How much more so politicians? I’m really amused how Bill Ritter is the new rockstar. After all, isn’t he the fallback guy? Beauprez has always been the GOP’s top candidate and he’s going to win this fall. Why are you all still talking about Holtzman? Seriously. He is as much a bygone as Sam Zakham was in the 7th CD in 2002. Get over it. Bob is our man and we’re sticking with him.
As far as Musgrave goes…she’s going to win because she’s in a very conservative district. The state’s liberals (I suppose that would amount to about everybody on this site) need to worry about keeping Salazar alive in the 3rd. And finally…Perlmutter? He’s a rock star too? Crazy Ed is one of those old guys who did too much dope in college and protested too much. Now he’s standing out with about 30 or 40 others from the local senior homes holding “Bush lied people died” signs. So fetching, isn’t it? Rick O’donnell actually talks about the great issues of the day in a cogent, honest way. Crazy Ed gripes about Bush’s oil war. And you guys think you’ll win in November. Try this: get in your cars (or Segways, bikes, or scooters, as the case may be), drive down to the Denver suburbs where normal people live, and ask them what they think about things. You see, these are people who have kids and lives and spouses and jobs and live the average American life. They want to have an American that is safe and prosperous and that maintains an environment when kids’ moral characters can be bulit. That’s life and that’s why the GOP will continue to wallop.
… how crow tastes in November. You’re probably right about MM (though it doesn’t say much about a Republican in a conservative district when she only wins by a hair and probably will win by a hair again), but your calls on the gov’s race, CD7 and Salazar are myopic indeed.
At least this Republican in the ‘burbs doesn’t care for the platform of the GOP, the president that has been twice elected, and a majority of the candidates who are running for office under the R banner. I feel less safe (except when we did duck and cover drills in elementary school) and more intruded upon in the past 6 years than I can recall.
I think the Rs in control have overstepped their bounds and they believe they are supreme controllers of the country, its government, and its citizens.
I am rarely able to vote for a Republican candidate and this year is no different. Today’s Republican candidate does not represent my views or values or that of my family.
Am I the type of suburban American (Republican) mom — married, three kids, three dogs, two turtles, and a cat — that you think will vote for people like Beauprez and O’Donnell? Think again.
If you don’t vote Republican and you think that President Bush is a “supreme controller,” my guess is that you are definately not the average suburban, American, Republican mom. You may be a very nice lady and you may have two very nice turtles, kids, dogs, whatever. But the fact that you don’t realize that there is a really big war going on today puts you on the outside looking in. Listen, this fall will be a referendum on the Global War on Terror: do you want one or not…I think the yays will win. As far as statewide politics…Ritter: pro-gay, much more pro-abortion than he contends, pro-tax. In summation: anti-family. I don’t know what your values are, but most Coloradans care about family and marriage and affordable living (low-taxes). Unless a whole lot of people have suddenly decided that Massachusetts is good model for a conservative state like ours, there’s no way Democrats will continue to win.
We’ve internally polled thousands of (R)s all over Denver, and the numbers are coming back in favor of a big change in November.
A majority of self-described (R)s are fed-up with massive deficits, massive tax cuts for the ultra rich, and the never-ending misadventure in Iraq. Not to mention the fact that those gay marriage and flag burning bans (R)s have been concentrating on aren’t doing squat to help voters pay for skyrocketing energy and healthcare costs.
The only way Republican candidates can maintain ground in November is by smearing the other side and somehow convincing voters that they have been good stewards. That’s a tall order indeed. Most people will have to think hard to come up with just one thing that our Republican-controlled government has done to improve their lives.
I just got through watching a report on TV about how many soccer moms are blasting Bush and turning away from that administration’s extremist agenda. Mod girl is probably exactly what they are talking about….republican moms opposed to extremism.
I think you’re correct that many Republicans are tired of the extremism of the GOP; even people who generally support the social planks of the Republican platform. I know people on the West Slope who refer to themselves as pro-life, pro-gun, pro-family, etc., who no longer believe the GOP can lead this country in the right direction.
When I consider my own Lakewood neighborhood, the last Republican state senator we had was Bonnie Alison. Alison was a traditional Republican and she lost a primary to Lyn Watwood, a right wing nut. Watwood lost to Feeley. Then the senate district elected Hanna, and now we have Boyd up against Knoedler.
Knoedler is probably the most formidable candidate the Rs have put up in this senate district in a long time. Between Alison and Knoedler we had a string of mostly forgettable far right nuts who could easily win a Republican primary but couldn’t win in the general. Knoedler will have to play well with the mainstream voters of this district and, in the end, I don’t think he can do that with his record. The Boyd/Knoedler race is going to be a squeaker.
Tori Merritts probably came the closest to being a candidate that more mainstream Republicans could support, but she made a move to the right from moderate and that left a enough voters wondering where she really stood.
I digress. All we can do is speculate … the truth will be told in November.
Silly rabbit…Soccer moms never supported Bush.
it’s a no win situation for you here. This site leans so far left that the foot pegs are ground down and the primary is leaking.
They will all sit around saying they are the voice of moderation but unless you are a tree hugging liberal, they will drown you with their rhetoric and soon change your handle to KKK.
I used to enjoy this place but now I only visit briefly when I feel like getting pissed off.
To paraphrase FFF:
“Waahhhhhh, Bob Beauprez is really great and he’s super and he’s going to win! Why doesn’t anyone else see it?! I keep telling people he’s great but they keep wanting to know “about his record” and “what he’s done,” that’s just piddly bullshit! Bob is great and that’s that. He’s pulling all of %55 in Colorado Springs, he’s a JUGGERNAUT!!!”
Both Ways should have picked Jeff Crank or Lionel Rivera. He’d be approaching 60% in Colo. Spgs. at this point, and he wouldn’t be explaining the “Beastiality Rant” to the rest of the world.
Ah, yes indeed! Of course this site is full of a lot of lovely liberals posing as moderates. I know that! But I honestly thought my posts would be more controversial considering that I actually believe that abortion is wrong and traditional marriage is good and that the war on terror is essential and I’m not afraid to say those are Colorado values. (Yes, go right ahead. I know I’m a Bible-beating, Dobson-loving, theocratic, provincial maniac bent on turning America into a Christian country with a nasty case of the military industrial complex, etc.). As far as Tori Merritts goes…you’re very right…she was a very formidable candidate. But tell me: is Betty Boyd (she my Lakewood neighborhood’s rep., too) very moderate? Come on…her raison d’etre is the morning-after pill and not a whole lot else. Alas, I am a big Matt Knoedler fan and I do believe he’ll win. But please, finally, stop calling yourselves Republicans. If you haven’t voted for many of ’em post 9/11, just switch parties, okay? Don’t be afraid to just call yourselves libreals. Yes, the GOP has done some stupid things lately. But are the Dems your knights in shining armor? Really?! The GOP stands for powerful values and only acts some of the time on those values. The Dems stand for nothing or awfull values and act on those values most of the time. Maybe you stand for those awefull values. Just please, you’re not Republicans. And one more thing…it’s very unbecoming and hardly “moderate” to use foul language like Michael Moore did above (was that actually Mikey himself?…maybe just a wannabe.) Don’t make fun of people’s butt cysts. Don’t pretend like you all know the ins and outs of every campaign in the state when you dislike half of them. And for God’s sake!: laugh and joke a bit here. This is like the Sith Lord’s layer in the Dark Side where all is gloom and doom, everybody with an (R) by their name is evil, and the Democratic Forces of Light are held back by the Man (namely, George Bush). Please. Have some fun liberals.
So this is Trailhead’s blogging strategy? To admit the GOP’s done some dumb stuff lately, but still try to shame the disaffected moderates?
Here’s a quick test. True or false: It’s possible to have a respectable, middle-of-the-road, moderate position in politics.
If you answer true, you’re a reasonable and probably thoughtful person, especially if you’re actually quite liberal or conservative.
If you answer false, you’re a knee-jerk reactionary who is not interested in real dialogue or discourse, just in shouting to the hills about how right you are. Again, that’s regardless of whether you’re liberal or conservative.
I like baiting the knee-jerks on this site, but I also like engaging in real debate with reasonable posters so I have plenty of fun.
as a moderate, im always fascinated when people talk about being a republican: pro-marriage, pro-life, anti-terror. no mention of government spending and budgeting, which is one of the most important government responsibilities. There may not be a bill where a politician can impact abortion, but theyre guaranteed to vote on budget issues.
if i voted for bush because i thought he would do not “as bad” of a job as the other guy and might cut spending a little, does that make me a liberal posing as a moderate? im kind of sick of the “borrow, spend, AND cut taxes” philosophy, so i guess i need to stop calling myself a republican. im no libertarian because i feel the government is needed for more than roads and defense, so please dont try to lump me with them either.
take your own advice as well-
oh, and paragraphs are good 🙂
Nope … no soccer mom in this house. My kids were into baseball, wrestling, horses, music … nobody played soccer.
I’m not a liberal and I don’t support all of the planks in the Ds platform either.
I still consider myself R for the fiscal reasons. I think a smaller central government with greater local control is best. Yet, I think the government plays an important role in defense, infrastructure, education …
I think public education is a good thing. I will never support vouchers unless those schools receiving government funds in the form of vouchers are required to abide by the same rules as the public schools. Pro-voucher people would never go along with that … why all those rules would ruin the private schools, right? Isn’t that what voucher supporters are trying to do to public schools?
I think it’s okay to have prayer in school. I don’t think it’s okay to have government forced prayer. Give the kids a moment of silence and let them pray in the manner they’ve been taught at home. The kids can handle it. It’s the adults and politicians and paranoid religious extremists who can’t handle trusting kids.
My family owns a small business that is now being run by the 2nd generation. WE CREATE JOBS! We’re in the construction industry and we are non-union. Our employees choose to be non-union because they would rather control their earnings and their ability to advance in their chosen field rather than live by the union rule. We pay competitive wages (they must be competitive or we wouldn’t have such a stable crew), offer health insurance, and 401k. We take our role as employer seriously. Care to discuss corporate taxes? If the government thinks small business is a good thing, you couldn’t tell by the way we’re taxed.
I believe in less government intrusion in my personal life and I believe in personal responsibility. I don’t think the government should be involved in the abortion issue.
And, really, abortion is a red herring. The problem isn’t that women are having abortions; the problem is that women are getting pregnant when they don’t mean to. We need better education about and access to birth control. We need MEN AND WOMEN to take more responsibility for their actions.
I think the government should help those people who cannot help themselves. I think we owe an equal opportunity to all. It’s true: If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. If you teach a man to fish, you’ve fed him for a lifetime.
I’m not interested in hunting, but don’t feel compelled to keep you from your chosen sport. My youngest is a member of the NRA. He’d never shoot an animal, but he likes the sport and challenge of shooting. (His grandfather helped him earn marksman awards through the NRA.) I wouldn’t try to take away your precious gun and I don’t think more laws keep firearms out of the hands of the bad guys. However, somebody has to explain to me how a semi-automatic weapon is useful in hunting deer.
In my house, 60 percent of us are vegetarians.
We recycle.
I drive a compact car.
My husband and I have taught our children about personal responsibility and about consequences for poor choices. We’ve taught them about the evils of credit cards and spending beyond your means. (Perhaps our current administration needs some fiscal learning, ModerateGal style.)
Do you still think I’m a Democrat?
I think I’m a traditional Republican.
I think I’m a moderate Republican.
I think today’s Republican party has forsaken its traditional values for revival tent politicians and snake oil salesmen.
But I don’t think I’m a Democrat.
You run. You have my vote. I’m also a real republican.
I agree with a little of what you said except for vouchers and abortion.
I think abortion should really only be used in the case of rape, incest, when the mother’s health is in jeopardy, or if the baby will only suffer and probably die soon from some abnormality. I think adoption should be pushed, not abortion becuase it is more convienant. It is a good thing our moms thought the same thing eh?
Vouchers…
I don’t understand the concept of throwing more and more money at government schooling when there is no acountability for the schools or especially the teachers. Each year the school districts cry they are under funded and each year we raise the taxes or set bond issues. And each year teachers whether they are good or bad continue on with no acountabilty. We can and do have some terrible teachers in place, not doing the kids any good. We also have some great teachers that put up with a lot of shit from the darlings and they don’t get noticed.
I think if you are going to forever fight vouchers, we need to set up a board to oversee the teachers and administrators on a daily basis. Fire the loafers and promote the strivers.
Throwing billions and billions at the system as it is now and has always been doesn’t work well.
The lefty tree hugging liberals on this site are the first to say that just because a marriage has always been between a man and a women for thousands of years doesn’t mean it should stay that way.
Why doesn’t that logic apply to shcooling?
“The lefty tree hugging liberals on this site are the first to say that just because a marriage has always been between a man and a women for thousands of years doesn’t mean it should stay that way.
Why doesn’t that logic apply to shcooling?”
I, for one, admit ignorance on the issue. I’m not close-minded to vouchers, but my gut reaction is that since this is coming from the right it’s a front for giving taxpayer money to business. I also never hear any conditions or guarantees that only those who can’t afford private schools would receive it – there’s no need to fund the choice to those who have it.
Even if that’s not true (the part about it just being another corporate giveaway, that is), we all know that new goverment programs are going to be extremely expensive and seldom (if ever) work out like they should and are hard to fix. I can understand the frustration with failing schools (I have a young daughter who’ll be school age soon, and you bet I want the best for her) but chuck-it-aside-and-start-over solutions are impractical, to say the least.
Again, I admit I haven’t done my homework on the issue. Who wants to give me the “vouchers for dummies” breakdown? (Or point me to a good resource please.)
BTW Gecko, you’re right – just because something has gone on for millenia doesn’t mean that it’s the way it should be. After all, slavery was around since prehistoric times too.
but I have a few concerns about vouchers:
1. Public schools must accept any student who comes to their door. If that student is in a wheelchair and needs a full time aid to assist the student, it must be provided. At public schools, I think that is provided at no charge to the family. Private schools don’t have to provide that aid and if they do, they can charge for it. You’d have to be in the money to afford that kind of assist for your kid.
As an aside, what are the odds that the kid from Five Points has the ability to get across town to Kent or Colorado Academy or Graland anyway? Will mom or dad get them there? Will the school provide transportation all over the city to pick up kids? Not likely.
2. Vouchers won’t provide enough money to allow a kid from Five Points to attend Colorado Academy or Kent or Graland unless the school kicks in major scholarships. These are for-profit entities. What are the odds they want to fill their classrooms with kids who are paying full fare? It would be that much more expensive for the families that can afford the tuition.
3. Vouchers will provide enough money to allow a kid to attend, say, Our Lady of Fatima Catholic School or Silver State Baptist School or another parochial school. That’s my biggest concern. Vouchers would mean we are using government funds to help pay for religious school.
4. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think private schools have to give the CSAP tests. If a school is receiving goverment funds through vouchers, then they should have to meet the same requirements of the public schools.
I’ll say up front that I’d probably be classified as a lefty by most on this web site. (*)
That said, I think your first point hits the nail on the head with regard to vouchers. Public education has certain goals. Private schools have different goals. To propose to take money away from one to give it to another is short-sighted and misunderstands the issue. Public schools MUST provide every child with access to an education, with transportation to schools, with meals if their family can’t afford it, etc. Do public schools sometimes fail? You bet! We need to address those problems. We cannot, though, simply replace them with private schools, because private schools don’t do those things. To take money away from public schools and send it toward private schools just leaves public schools, which must still exist in order to do the job that only they can do, with a greater share of funds spent on overhead and building maintenance, and therefore less to spend per student.
(* My footnote: Just to prove the silliness of such left/right classifications, though, I am to everyone’s so-called “right” on abortion. I strongly believe it should be illegal to ever intentionally kill an unborn child, ever. If the life of the mother is at stake, then procedures may be necessary that make it extremely unlikely that the child will survive; but it should remain illegal not to make every attempt to save the child’s life to the extent possible. Such legislation would need to strongly support a doctor’s judgement, and painstakingly ensure that doctors aren’t making bad medical decisions for fear of being charged with a crime. It should nevertheless be illegal to ever choose to kill a child under any circumstances, such as when failing to provide life support for a near-viable fetus. I consider this absolutely consistent with my being a liberal. Respecting the rights and human dignity of minority age groups is just as important to me as respecting the human dignity and rights of minority ethnic groups, religions, sexual orientations, etc. That said, I agree that we need focus on effective education, and also on ensuring the subsidized availability of prenatal and pediatric care to ALL children and mothers in order to stop the economic incentives for abortion. I refuse to acknowledge someone as being pro-life if they support retaining economic incentives for abortion in order to keep taxes low. Even more so if they then run out like bigoted hypocrits and complain about poor mothers “popping out” children, just after they finish advocating ineffectual sex ed and writing their congressman to thank them for cuts to WIC and Medicaid. Okay, I’ll stop ranting now…)
I think what’s really wrong with public schools is a severe lack of parent involvement. When my kids were in elementary school I had the great fortune of being a stay-at-home-mom and used my time to be the PTA mom of the century — very involved with the classroom, the school, the school district, and PTA.
From helping in the classroom a few hours a week or on special occassions it soon became obvious which kids had involved parents and which kids had parents that treated school like a convenient babysitter.
Kids who come to school with completed homework and who don’t have trauma at home are kids who can succeed. Kids who have parents who teach them the difference between right and wrong weren’t the kids that disrupted while the teacher was teaching. Those kids didn’t know how to behave and didn’t think school was important and they stole education from the kids who were ready to learn.
Those one or two or three kids who couldn’t handle the classroom setting took more of the teacher’s time than the 20 or 25 who knew how to sit and learn.
Yes, there are bad teachers, bad principals, and bad school district administrators, but their numbers pale in comparison to the bad parents. And, contrary to former Gov. Lamm and Gov. Owens, bad parents come in all different colors.
I know it’s easier to blame the teachers and administrators and lack of funds, but if we really want to improve education we’ll point our collective finger at parents and make it socially unacceptable to not make education a priority. But, oh geez, does that open a can of worms …
If nothing else, instead of finger pointing, if you haven’t had the opportunity to volunteer at your local school and you have a bit of time to do so, I encourage you to make a committment to helping the kids learn. You’ll meet some awesome kids who are perfectly able to learn but nobody at home told them it was important and nobody at home took the time to help.
make a difference but changing the parents will be next to impossible.
My point still is that there is no accountability for teachers due to their union.
Where I work if an employee is a slacker he is disiplined and eventually let go if he/she continues to fail. Show me where this is the same for schools.
Again, throwing billions at the problem only means less money in our wallets.
Teachers need to be held accountable just like I am. That is why I like the voucher idea.
As far as voluntering at school, I raised three boys who turned out just fine. My school days are over. If I never had to step foot in a school again it would be too soon.
that the unions can be a problem. Bad teachers can hide behind union protection. It’s a shame that principals can’t get bad teachers out of the classroom unless they do something egregious. And, it’s probably easier to deal with the unions than the parents.
If I were a member of the teachers union, I would much prefer that we set policies and standards that help us to police ourselves rather than having the government come in and do it for us.
What kind of certifications do we require in Colorado? Anybody know?
If the sacred teachers union would police themselves, I would jump on your bandwagon in a minute. But because there is no consequences for being a bad teacher, why give them more money? By doing that you are simply condoning their behavior.
(1)I was a high school teacher for a while, and you are right that a lot of problems have to do with bad parenting. As the saying goes…the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. I have stories, but I won’t even go there…
(2) It is true that the public schools fully pay for the individual (full time) help that severly disabled students get. The mandate that student’s with disabilities are “mainstreamed” into the regular classroom is a huge complication and take up a HUGE amount of ($)recources. From cases of mild dislexia to severe mental and physical handicap, students are given ILP (individual learning plans) that tailor that student’s lesson plans to his/her needs and abilities/disabilities. So each teacher who has an average of 7 classes of 30 students/day will need to have lesson plans for the average student as well as provide individual lessons for each ILP. There were times when some teachers had classes with 50% ILP students. This is a teaching nightmare! The more learning disabilities that are discovered, the more complicated the work becomes for the teacher. I can not see private schools offering the same thing.
(3)There were a few students with severly bad behavioral problems…to the point where it was documented (no lie) that when they were transfered into a class, that classes performance would drop between 10-20 % points. I have been waiting for a parent to sue because their childs learning potential/envionment was disrupted by kids with behavioral problems. Will private schools be required to take problem kids and mainstream them?
Thanks for the viewpoint. I don’t know if Gecko’s answer is typical of the pro-voucher crowd (sorry if you’re saying more and I’m not getting it all, but your point seems to be that it will make teachers more accountable since schools will have to compete – is that a fair reading of your position?) but if this is a complete summary of the debate then I won’t be pro-voucher.
Hey, pro-voucher folks – can you argue this point further? Or can you recommend any good books, websites, or other resources with more info? Same with you anti-voucher folks. I’m interested in hearing both sides.
I also agree with the point about the parents. I know from my own example that I did as well as I did exactly to the extent that my parents were involved.
What they need to do is devise a strategy where Scott Gessler, Steve Durham, John Zakhem, Mike Norton, and the Colorado Republican Party can sue any and every opposing candidate off the ballot.
If that fails, they can count on our ever so incompetent Secretary of State Gigi Dennis to rule them out. Maybe she can lose their papers like she did with those voter files.
Hey, they did and it kept that Holtzman character off the ballot. Why don’t they take up a notch and just litigate everyone they don’t like.
Wait to go Colorado GOP!!!
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Littleton, CO – Mike Kopp, Republican Candidate for Senate District 22, is at it again. For the second time this campaign season, Kopp has decided to use the judicial system for a cheap shot, short-term political gain and to get his name in the newspapers.
This week, Republican candidate Mike Kopp got one of his supporters to file a campaign finance complaint against fellow Republican candidate Kiki Traylor. The matter has been sent to an Administrative Law Judge by the Colorado Secretary of State. This is the second complaint Kopp and his supporters have filed against a fellow Republicans this campaign season. Kopp filed a complaint in January over Traylor’s appointment to the seat by a Vacancy Committee. That complaint was dismissed. Kopp and Traylor face fellow Republican Justin Everett in the August 8th Primary Election.
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At least it got Kopp his 79 vote margin in the primary. It’s justified because Traylor and those other moderates have no business in the republican party.
Enough said.
Isn’t the primary over? Can’t he find a reason to chase the Dem? Geez ….