Tuesday Open Thread

“It is not necessary to have enemies if you go out of your way to make friends hate you.”

–Frank Dane

52 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. caroman says:

    Maybe you’ve heard of the game where you add the words “in bed” to any Chinese fortune cookie, e.g. “You  will find great happiness … in bed.”

    Do this to any GOP politician who today says, “We cannot raise taxes … on the wealthy.” It changes everything.

    • Gray in Mountains says:

      to benefit the wealthy.

      We must get rid of medicare…to benefit the wealthy.  

      We must get rid of Social Security…to benefit the wealthy.

      I see billboards with a pic of caroman opening fortune cookies…

      • BlueCat says:

        to benefit the wealthy.

        We must throw poor people off medicaid…to benefit the wealthy

        We must let our infrastructure go to hell…to benefit the wealthy.

        We must send more jobs overseas…to benefit the wealthy

        We must lay off more police…to benefit the wealthy

        We must lay off  more first responders…to benefit the wealthy

        Hey, this works like a charm.

    • caroman says:

      Hey, let’s call them “Job Creators!”

      Like, hedge fund “job creators”.

      Or, landscaping “job creators”.

      Boy, that Frank Luntz is working overtime.  See, that’s another job creator!

  2. Aristotle says:

    Some people seem to think so.

    BJ – I loathe your politics, but admire you being big-enough to keep showing up here and getting beat up by shameless bullies day after day after day.

    Hmm. Where I come from, bullying happens to small, sometimes meek people who seldom do anything to provoke it. They don’t even fight back. They certainly don’t make obnoxious statements meant to rile up people they don’t agree with, something the subject of this comment has done thousands of times since he first registered at Colorado Pols.

    So, let’s have a discussion. What, if anything, constitutes cyber-bullying at Colorado Pols?

    Nancy, since you’re the author of the quoted statement, I’d like to hear from you.

    • SSG_Dan says:

      Every time he opens his cyber-mouth and something monumentally stupids spills forth, he deserves all the return fire this website puts forth.

      On the rare occasions when Beej manages to engage his brain before he releases his mouth, I find he’s no different than some of the other right-ish pollsters who hang out here.

      If we were truely cyber-bullies, we would be attacking Beej on a personal level, using techniques that ‘tad uses every day. But we don’t – we respond to the stupidity he posts, and when he starts to spin his right-wing victimhood, he punish him appropriately.

      When I first started hanging out on Pols, some of the Rightie posters on this site were great examples of critical thinking – backed by proof that came from mainstream or respectable sources.

      When Beej goes into dipshit mode and pulls stats or assumptions out of his ass, he gets the scathing criticism he deserves.

    • Car 31 says:

      Agree with the prior post. Bullying is attacking someone with little or no provocation – calling them names and dismissing their thoughts/comments.

      Not tolerating fools is attacking someone who is an idiot and shameless partisan hack not interested in dialogue or reason.

      Who decides the difference?

      Me.

      I’m the decider 🙂

      Nancy’s comments were well intentioned but naive. People who post radical right wing comments on this site do it for no other reason than to see all the replies. It is a superiority thing.  If others wish to pile on, it’s their choice, but it isn’t bullying.

      Personally, I don’t know why anybody replies to them at all. It really isn’t worth the time…

    • ProgressiveCowgirl says:

      BJ is here to provoke people, and he succeeds. For whatever reason, Nancy and Ali respect that about him. I don’t, but I respect Nancy and Ali.

      And yes, people have bullied BJ around here. He invites it enthusiastically. He knows that if he objects to it so much, he can leave–which he announced his intention to do several months ago, and is still here. So apparently he is perfectly willing to continue trolling and continue being bullied in response. His choice.

        • ProgressiveCowgirl says:

          * People continue an argument from another thread by bringing it up in a different place after BJ (or anyone else) has already moved on from the previous argument. Hijacking another conversation to demand answers to old questions is rude.

          * People target BJ personally by making nasty remarks about his offline life–that verges on outing (even though he regularly self-outs) and it’s not something that most of us are willing to put up with, hence the choice NOT to self-out… so it really shouldn’t be something we force on others.

          Generally insult-trading and suggesting he has no brains or making fun of his name (my personal favorite, ’cause I have the sense of humor of a 12-year-old boy) are just part of online discourse. The above two are excessive, IMO, but not something the guvs should try to stop unless they’re hoping to get rid of BJ, since he thrives on being pushed around. Martyr complex.

          • Aristotle says:

            but I think only the second example approximates bullying.

            Cyberbullying has a lot more to do with violating one’s, um, cyberspace – say, flooding the target’s inbox with hate email or offensive and upsetting material, or creating a page designed to humiliate the person, or just going after someone unprovoked. The first example is obnoxious but not vicious; the second is certainly more personal, but doesn’t rise to the level of harassment that constitutes bullying. Not excusable, but not bullying either.

            I’m harping on this a bit because bullying means something. It means torturing and humiliating someone because he or she doesn’t fit. And it’s something that the target can do very little about. Kids can’t always change schools (and sometimes the other options wouldn’t constitute an improvement). Adult victims shouldn’t have to change jobs or move to a new town. And cyber targets shouldn’t have to get new email addresses, social network profiles, and the like.

            Beej, as you point out, isn’t suffering. He’s thriving, if anything. He has profiles at other forums and nobody follows him there to harass him. One polster even got the boot at his request.

            If he feels bullied, maybe he can tell us about the time it happened. (Preferably with links so we can read the transcript – beej is notoriously unreliable when it comes to relating things that actually happened.)

            • Diogenesdemar says:

              that only ended when Pols finally banned some jerk who followed Beej all over this site and posted obnoxious bullying crap repeatedly (“Are you a communist?”) after dozens upon dozens of poor, picked-on Wilson’s posts, remember? . . . (wait, I am reacalling that correctly, aren’t I?)

          • Gray in Mountains says:

            nor tried to out him.

            I have ridiculed his ideas and his selfaffirming narcissism.

    • redstateblues says:

      Is he up to his old Facebook sockpuppet tricks again? Many Democrats were recently friended by someone named “Dave Willson” who used pictures lifted from a male model’s facebook page, and made themselves appear to be a Denver Democrat.

      David Chestnut’s hotter, Pakistani cousin perhaps?

      At any rate, the account has apparently been deleted by its creator–probably as a result of being caught red-handed at their not-so-clever (not to mention downright creepy) attempt at opposition research.

    • Diogenesdemar says:

      that was once applied to Dick Wadhams — and I’m really very sorry that I don’t remember who said it first.)

      .

      .

      “Kick him in the balls again . . . repeatedly.”

    • Leonard Smalls says:

      no one seems to have much patience with him.

      It might be time for him to pack up and go back to Oklahoma to handle snakes or whatever it is he used to do out there.

  3. SSG_Dan says:

    In ten years of conflict on multiple fronts, I have a hard time believing so few men and woman have been awarded our nation’s highest honor. (I’m still pissed about SPC Monica Brown getting downgraded to a Silver Star).

    But in an effort to try and reach out to the media, the Army has created a website for their MoH recipients. Here’s an excellent job of describing SFC Petry’s courage under fire and selfless disregard for his personal safety:

    http://www.army.mil/medalofhon

    Yes,it looks like a FPS video game…and on one level, I’m not happy about the Army’s recruiting efforts using this as a way to get men and women to sign up. But this soldiers’ story of heroism deserves to be told, and if this is the way they want to do it, so be it….

  4. SSG_Dan says:

    I’m sorry, but did the collection of asshats that try and run the GOP just figure out they’ve been played again?

    You were for the “Grand Bargain” before you were against it?


    Republicans Attack Obama Bid to Forge Debt ‘Grand Bargain’

    The top Senate Republican attacked the credibility of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge a “grand bargain” of spending cuts and tax increases, saying the president himself was an obstacle to an agreement on the debt.

    Senator Mitch McConnell and other Republican leaders said Obama is putting an expansion of government ahead of the goal of reaching a bipartisan accord to cut the U.S. deficit. He said Democrats’ “smoke and mirrors” proposals prevented the type of $4 trillion deficit reduction that Obama is seeking.

    “As long as this president is in the Oval Office, a real solution is unattainable,” McConnell of Kentucky said on the Senate floor today in his toughest comments about the negotiations since bipartisan talks began.

    White House Press Secretary Jay Carney called McConnell’s remarks “unfortunate,” saying, “this president is going to be in office for at least another 18 months, and I think that the American people expect Congress to work with him.”

    http://www.businessweek.com/ne

    The Repubs aren’t painting themselves into a corner on this, they’re also setting the room on fire and stabbing themselves with a sharp stick….

    • jadodd says:

      Obama threatens that Social Security checks could be delayed if the debt ceiling isn’t raised.  Why is it we never hear about the politician’s checks being held up.  Obama should tell the treasury to just stop paying for Congressional salaries and shut the Congress down – no staff, no lights, no fancy gyms.  These should be the first to go – not retirees Social Security checks.

      • Libertad says:

        Our President continues to flounder. With this series of statements on cutting military paychecks and social security and what not our President exposes his failed leadership.

        He can’t lead or chooses not to lead; I just can’t figure oout which it is? Does this guy get that the people read through his hostile actions; we see him for what he is trapped by his own failures and leadership gaps. What he is actually doing is threatening the American public.

        In essence he is saying …. citizens you’d better call your legislators because im suggesting to you that YOUR WORLD WILL CRUMBLE IF WE DONT FIX THE DEBT AND SPENDING CAPS MY WAY.

        Sorry Charlie, Americans see through that failed rhetoric.

        • Aristotle says:

          Or do you think sending out rubber checks is something the government should do?

          • Libertad says:

            Then maybe our President needs to find a replacement.

            The “boy crying wolf” charade is a cheap ploy that most Americans see through. Your leaders have lost their street cred and are low on political capital.

            • Diogenesdemar says:

              and unlike most Americans, you still haven’t seemed to see through that yet.

              • Libertad says:

                After he covered for the mayor of NO and the LA Gov following Katrina. The AirForce One photo was the fuse.

                Don’t deny it your team loved watching our President fail, it was a perfect opening to play the race card ….. which you kept sliding out from under the deck every day thru Nov 2008.

                • Diogenesdemar says:

                  I hated seeing Bush fail, admitedly he was a zen master of failure, but the cost to the people in this country was, is, and continues to be truly outrageous and obscene.  In fact, about the only thing I hate more than Bush’s failure is seeing jackasses like you (collectively) who want to replace our current President with another Grand Old Failure.  And, to help facilitate this next disaster your team is doing every single thing it can to obstruct any opportunity for and semblance of real recovery now, today, because it diminishes your chances to fuck things up and grab a little bit more for yourselves.

            • Aristotle says:

              This is Congress’s doing, not Treasury’s.

        • jadodd says:

          Mitch McConnell and John Boehner appear to be folding.  McConnell is proposing a bill that would give the President the authority to raise the debt limit subject to a disapproval super majority vote of Congress.

          • Republicans have been strung along in this vote by Obama, who has looked willing to cave in to a lot of GOP demands while offering a huge debt reduction package – all in exchange for closing some tax loopholes.  And Republicans said “no”, making themselves look like the extremists they are.

            I understand this will give Republicans the opportunity to vote against the debt ceiling increases three times over the next year.  But if Obama and the Democrats are smart, then each vote will be accompanied by an offer to do something to reduce the deficit and a reminder as to what might have been and that Republicans approved the budget which is forcing the President to ask for those approvals.

            Keep it in the news, GOP…

          • Diogenesdemar says:

            desperate attempt by the Republicans to avoid voting on rasing taxes on billionaires and closing corporate welfare tax loopholes.

            That way McYurtle & Co, hope to still have it both ways — scream about the deficit on the one hand, and let their moneyed overlords continue to avoid any of their responsibility to the country on the other.

            Obama’s response should be simply: Fuck you boys.  You said $4 trillion, now get your fat, dumb asses back in here and let’s get it done — right.

        • SSG_Dan says:

          …President Obama has punk’d the Republican’t party so thoroughly on this issue all that’s left to do is see what face-saving comments they throw out on Faux News.

          In a game of Deficit Poker, he took the Orange Man’s wallet, watch and pants. All the Senate Repubs can do now is hoot about the Dem deficit reduction bill that will plow thru both houses of Congress.

          I know that Haters Gotta Hate, but hate the players, not the game. The GOP got torched…

          • Libertad says:

            … like they did with ARRA.  You all recall the final outcome on that spending gorge-down … $278,000 per job created or saved.

            You also know they could have cut 2.4 million $100k checks and still had $400-500 billion less in growing debt obligations.

            The gorge-down of spending your team has conducted in 2.5 years put us into fifth gear racing toward the debt cap … and now we are here.

            Time to pay the piper and teach our kids about the lifelong future we’ve mortgaged for they and their grandchildren to pay-off.

            • SSG_Dan says:

              I’ve already done that “mathy thing” to deflate your delusion about that number you keep pulling from Grover Norquist’s ass.

              So I’ll just say this:

              “Stupidity has a certain charm – ignorance does not.” Frank Zappa

      • raymond1 says:

        Obama should tell the treasury to just stop paying for Congressional salaries and shut the Congress down – no staff, no lights, no fancy gyms.  These should be the first to go – not retirees Social Security checks

        Seriously, how much do you think is spent each month on Congress’s “fancy gyms?” Even Congressional salaries are a drop in the toilet compared to social security. Let’s do some quick math:

        * 535 members congress x $200K/yr / 12 mn = about 9 million/mn

        * Gyms/lights/crap: piddling, but sure, let’s say 500K/month

        –> Congress’s salaries, lights, gym = 9.5 million per month

        –> Social security: about $644 BILLION a year, or $54 BILLION a month

        • Diogenesdemar says:

          It’s not about the money, elsewise they would have made efforts to raise revenues long, long ago.

          It’s about letting these clowns know that the pain could, and should, start with them.

          I promise you that noise coming from the collective squealing at the Senate Minority hog trough would overwhelm the sounds from all the millions of middle and lower class Americans who have gotten far too used to being shafted and sold out over these past thirty years.

          • Sir Robin says:

            Reagan did away with regulating the media. Since then, it’s an Orwellian voice clamoring in the ears of the uneducated voter.

            The assault on teachers, and the assault on workers, is where the rub lays.

        • Libertad says:

          It’s like the $100 billion Omaba cut a few years back, equivalent to $4 on the average Americans $2,000 monthly spend.

          Jadodd is pissing on her leg, you’re right to just stand back, be polite and inform her of the weak stream puddling near her flats.

        • jadodd says:

          First, let me say that Diogenesdemar is correct.  It is about making the idiots in Congress feel the pain.

          However, ray, you should get your facts straight.  The Congressional budget is $4.7 billion.

          Oh, but I forgot, facts don’t mean anything to conservatives.

          • raymond1 says:

            Seriously, your ability to make things up is getting worse. If you’d read any of my other posts, you’d know I’m no such thing. You’re not required to read what I write, but if you haven’t, STFU rather than characterize my views.

            And yeah, the entire congressional budget is $4.7, but c’mon, that’s not congressmembers’ salaries and “fancy gyms”; I’ve interned in congressional office buildings, and like most major offices, they have lots of support staff. Security likely costs a ton; you wanna eliminate that? Shitloads of computers, printers, and copiers needed to write and amend our nation’s laws. Janitorial services….

  5. SSG_Dan says:

    ah, that didn’t take long. “Please, Mr President, don’t take our lunch money as well!”


    Conservative reviews mixed on McConnell debt-limit plan

    It didn’t take long for conservatives invested in the debt-limit debate to take sides over Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell’s radical escape plan to resolve the burgeoning crisis.

    As both sides grew pessimistic Tuesday about the prospects for a deal to raise the federal debt ceiling, McConnell offered up a complicated legislative scheme that would allow the limit to be raised in three stages while affording the GOP a chance to vote against any increase without consequences.

    The downside for Republicans: The limit would likely be raised without corresponding spending cuts.

    That riled Erick Erickson, a conservative commentator for CNN, who likened McConnell to Pontius Pilate on his RedState blog and also labeled him a “weasel” for good measure. (He also initially suggested hanging the GOP leader in effigy but later tempered his remarks.)

    “Mitch McConnell is right now talking about making a historic capitulation. So fearful of being blamed for a default, McConnell is proposing a compromise that lets Barack Obama raise the debt ceiling without making any spending cuts at all,” Erickson wrote.

    http://www.latimes.com/news/po

    If I were the ref, I’d be tempted to stop this ass-whuppin’ and give it to Obama as a TKO.

    But damn, I LOVE watching this….

    • SSG_Dan says:

      Just posted on the Wall Street Journal:

      Raise Revenues, Not Taxes

      http://online.wsj.com/article/

      • Libertad says:

        It’s a tad more sustainable then self serving bloated government spending.

        For those of you who hate business, think of it this way.  The more jobs we create the more the government coffers will fill with resulting taxes to pay for the massive debts you’ve created.

        Just think when your grand or great grandchildren hit their 50s you “Progressives” will be able to ramp up the massive progressive government machine. Until then you have few choices.

        The Congressman must have dialed in Rushbo for lunchtime listening pleasure today! 😉 … just joking, Congressman Polis actually does get it and for some of you that really chaps your ass.

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