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November 04, 2006 01:57 AM UTC

Is Haggard Making Story Worse?

  • 61 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

It would obviously be hard for anyone to make Ted Haggard’s story any worse, but his ridiculous attempts at explaining things are really going to provide fodder to critics and late-night talk show hosts. As CNN reports:

The Rev. Ted Haggard, who resigned as one of the nation’s top evangelical leaders, admitted Friday he had contacted a male prostitute for a massage and bought drugs from him.

Haggard, 50, said he never had sex with Mike Jones and never used the methamphetamine he bought.

Even if you had been inclined to believe Haggard from the beginning, surely you don’t accept this explanation. He bought drugs, but didn’t use them, and he called a male prostitute, but didn’t have sex with him? Does he expect people to believe him? This is completely absurd.

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61 thoughts on “Is Haggard Making Story Worse?

  1. This story is so far-fetched that it probably won’t even hold up until Election Day, which was the only goal…

    Haggard admits he got a “massage” from a male prostitute who just happened to have sold him meth, the drug that’s simultaneously powering and killing the GLBT community.

    We’re to believe the “massage” didn’t involve his penis and he pitched the meth instead of doing it? It’s absurd, you can see through this faster than you can say the words “Hot Carl.”

    1. First the good Reverend said he didn’t know Mike Jones, never had gay sex, never used drugs, and was “steady” with his wife.  Then the voicemails were aired and an expert said it was the Rev’s voice, at which point the Rev said he DID know Mike Jones, but only to receive a massage and buy meth, which he only bought once and threw away. However, one voicemail asked Jones if he could “get any more” meth, which isn’t consistent with the story about “bought it once and threw it away.” I wonder what his next story will be, after this inconsistency is pointed out to the Rev.

      I also wonder why none of the hard-hitting reporters on this story have asked the Rev. exactly what he got massaged.

  2. From the AP 4 p.m. Friday. Was Haggard as invisible as Abramoff?

    White House Deputy Press Secretary Tony Fratto said Friday Haggard had visited the White House once or twice and had participated in some of the conference calls, but he did not have exact numbers.

    He declined to comment further, calling the matter a personal issue for Haggard. Fratto said he did not believe the allegations would discourage conservative Christians from voting Tuesday.

        1. in the interview Mike Jones said that he recived an envelope from “Art” with 2 one hundred dollar bills.

          ATMs only pay in 20s.

          If the money was withdrawn from a personal checking or saving account it would have left a trail for Mrs. Haggard or the Haggard family accountant.

          If the money was taken from the collection plate before it was officially counted (and no recpeit given) no one would be the wiser.

          Sure it’s posiable Haggards personal income might be great enough that his Meth and prostitution expences could go unnoticed, but it appears that he was trying to cover his tracks.

          We also really have no way of knowing how many other, if any, prostitutes’s services were being purchased by Haggard.

          1. This is ridiculous.  Based only on the evidence that the payment was in hundreds, you decide that it’s plausible enough to publicly speculate that Haggard stole money from the collection plate in order to pay for his drug habit.  That’s no evidence at all.  You really think there’s no possible way for Ted Haggard to acquire hundred dollar bills except from a collection plate?  With everything that’s going on, why would you feel the need to make up groundless accusations and spread pointless rumors?

        2. in the interview Mike Jones said that he recived an envelope from “Art” with 2 one hundred dollar bills.

          ATMs only pay in 20s.

          If the money was withdrawn from a personal checking or saving account it would have left a trail for Mrs. Haggard or the Haggard family accountant.

          If the money was taken from the collection plate before it was officially counted (and no recpeit given) no one would be the wiser.

          Sure it’s posiable Haggards personal income might be great enough that his Meth and prostitution expences could go unnoticed, but it appears that he was trying to cover his tracks.

          We also really have no way of knowing how many other, if any, prostitutes’s services were being purchased by Haggard.

  3. This reminds me of when Clinton said he never inhailed.

    Also, it reminds me of the virginity concerned Christian young woman who says – “Oral doesn’t count right?”

    1. All sorts of quotes from recent time.

      • I am not a crook.
      • I do not remember.
      • There is no connection between Iran and Contras.
      • We did not interfere with the hostages.
      • We know where the weapons of mass destruction are.
      • I never inhaled.
      • It depends on how you define is.
      • Mission accomplished.
      • We kept our eye on the ball.
      • This is all of clinton’s faults.

      Since the 70’s the only 2 presidents that we did not elect twice are the honest ones who were doing the right things for the nation. I guess you can fool most the people all the time.

    1. it seems clear Haggard was talking about meth in the two voice mails, but Jones has also been quoted as saying $200 for approximately an hour on a monthly basis for three years. No clue how much meth that would purchase … anyone?

    1. I can give a pass on a joint a LOT easier than on a nose full of meth. Come on – everyone abused Clinton for that lie; if it had been a Schedule II drug he would never have been elected.

    2. Can we please, please get off of the Clinton equivalency train? The only reason that was a big deal back then was he was the first elected official to admit to using drugs. Now, we have Condi who smoked a few times, and W who has used the Bolivian marching powder.

      If this is sarcasm, i apologize. I am no longer funny.

  4. I want to believe that he didn’t have sexual contact with Mr. Jones, as indicated by the lie detector, and that he bought but didn’t use the drugs. 

    It seems plausible to me.  He’s staying at a hotel.  He calls the front desk and asks for a referral for a masseuse.  The desk clerk is an acquaintance of Mr. Jones, and gives his name.  No talk of sex or even innuendo.  I assume Mr. Jones would massage a woman or straight man for the rates he quoted. 

    After the massage, Mr. Jones says that, if you think you feel good now, you’ll feel even better after this recreational drug I can get you.  Rev Ted is reluctant, but says, sure, let me see what you’ve got.  Mr. Jones produces the drug and Rev Ted pays.  He asks, so what is this ?  Is it dangerous ? 

    When he learns its crystal meth, he says he isn’t sure, maybe he’ll use it later.  Mr. Jones leaves.  Rev Ted has a “what have I done” moment and flushes it down the toilet. 

    This account is totally a creation of my imagination.  It’s what I want to believe.  But up to now, the evidence doesn’t show that I’m wrong.  And, of course, if contradictory evidence comes up, I’ll adjust the scenario to fit the new evidence in the most favorable light. 

    Maybe that proves my hypocrisy.  But I want to believe in this guy.  I disagree with his brand of Christian fundamentalism, since I subscribe to a different (Roman Catholic) brand of fundamentalism.  But, like LDS (Mormons,) folks from New Life are great neighbors.  He’s inspirational to a lot of folks.  The rest of his private life might be A-OK.  After all, he gave that impromptu interview in his car with his kids in the back seat and his wife next to him.  He clearly made an accounting to them beforehand, no lies or excuses. 

    Please give him a break.  Please.

    1. If that is what it takes for you to sleep at night keep than enjoy, but for me that is not enough. No, I will not give him a break. He doesnt deserve one. To think that a lie detector is a valid measure of anything is the most absurd idea I have heard in a while.

      I would be interested to know at which hotels he stays at in denver. I am sure that a man like him would stay at such a fine establishment that, A) they would have onsite services that cater to the clientele, and B) a conceirge that is not going to call up “some guy” he knows. Maybe you are not familiar with classy hotels and their staff. Conceirges often get perks from fine dining establishments and other outlets to recommend their services. Some random guy who also happens to be an escort is not going to be one of those that gets the referral. If an employee actually referred him, and the hotel found out I am sure that that person would be fired on the spot, if not more severly punished.

      Your story reads like bad fan fic. But lets, for the sake of argument, continue. I am sure that a man who regularly rails against drugs is like, you bet I’ll try some of that recreational drug that you are offering. And then I will call you again to get some more. And then again. Cmon, man. If you want to be blind to the fact that he is at a minimum wasting money, thats your perogative, but I for one am not going to give him a break. I dont care how nice his followers are to live next to.

    2. He didn’t buy meth once and throw it away. Listen to the voicemails! He clearly was a repeat customer.

      And this “gee, I had NO IDEA he was a male prostitute, I was only there for a massage” story won’t fly either. Nobody calls a hotel they “can’t remember” and asks for a referral to a masseuse who just happens to be a full-time male prostitute.

      Plus, no one gets a referral from ONE hotel to go to ANOTHER hotel for a massage.

      Look at Haggard when he’s talking from his car: he even says at one point “I NEVER used it, I threw it away.” You don’t use the word “NEVER” when you only bought meth ONCE.

      Plus, he’s already lied a bunch of times within the past day. Look at his first tape where he lies over and over again.

      A pathetic performance.

  5. If they find out that there is less to the story than once thought???  If Amendment 43 passes, and Referendum I fails as it looks like it will.  And if Mr. Jones’ story starts unraveling just as much as Ted Haggards.  What then???

    Most of those who are on here speculating will look like the south ends of north bound horses.

    What the gays want is for Ted Haggard to have engaged in a homosexual trist.  Actually, if Ted Haggard did, he would be BISEXUAL, not homosexual.  He has a wife and family.

    They would like noting more than to have a poster child for the Gay and Lesbian Movement.  What if it doesn’t happen folks???

    I’m certain you haven’t thought past that notion.  But be comforted, I will be one to constantly remind you.  Be careful what you wish for, you may just get it.  Then again, maybe not.

    1. That Ted haggard engaged in a homosexual affair with a prostitute? And that he also is, apparently, a habitual drug user? Please, continue to bring that up. I have no problem with that.

      1. As much as this blog discusses us religious fundies, you seem to not understand us very much.

        For me, when Jesus says something like, “unless you drop your pretensiousness (?sp) and come to me like little children, I will not accept you as my disciples” (this is a really loose approximation,) it means I have to trust when I know that trust may not make sense. 

        For sure, in my church (Catholic,) we’ve had many fallible priests who have misbehaved, abusing children and adults.  I think that there are a lot of homosexual priests.  Ordained priests are all sinners.  Our church teaches that all of us are sinners.  But they take on the yoke of serving the community as a facilitator of individual parishoners growing in their personal relationships with their God-Creator.  It’s an awesome (the word literally means “instilling fear”) responsibility, and a crushing burden, but they are called to service and have to respond. 

        This burden killed one priest my family knew and loved.  He taught at St. Mary’s, and died about 12 years ago, taking his own life because (I think) of the humiliation of being accused of a crime against the students in his charge.  I’ve seen a handful of priests run out of parishes because lay people complained to the Bishop that they drank too much or showed too much interest in young women or just enjoyed life too much.  Catholics can be vicious to their priests and demand superhuman, impossible things.  I was called to be a priest but refused, and have discouraged my sons, because it is so darn hard. 

        You see Pastor Ted as self-aggrandizing and ambitious and power-hungry, and you may be right.  But I see a guy who answered a call I was too cowardly to answer.  I see a guy who answered God, “here I am.  Your will be done.  But remember, I’m just a man.” 

    2. …OK?

      How can Mr. Jones’ story start unraveling as much as Haggard’s? We know that Haggard did indeed pay Mr. Jones for something. We know from the voicemails that there were MULTIPLE – not just one “I threw it away” – purchases of meth. We know – or we should know – that no one goes to a hotel they “can’t remember” and gets a referral to a sleazy male prostitute when they’re asking for a massage.

      This isn’t about “a poster child for the gay and lesbian movement.” It’s a poster child for HYPOCRISY!!!

      THAT’S what bothered Mike Jones: not that Haggard was anti-gay but that he was a freaking hypocrite. (Not that Jones is some saint himself, but he seems honest about who he is. Here’s a guy who’s confessing to a felony: distribution of meth.)

  6. the only news would have been his accuser failing the polygraph.  What a dolt!  This sounds like Foley’s priest:  “I was naked in a hot tub with him but I never……”

    1. But that’s not what he thought was most important, it seems to me.  He was thinking about what was the best way to witness that Christ was moving in him and through him.  His denial that first night, it seems to me, was accurate.  And he apparently immediately confessed to his family, his coworkers and his board of directors. 

      I hope I acquit myself that well when I am found out. 

      1. Are you a person that leads a 30 million member organization who is engaging in illicit sexual liasons while using illegal controlled, substances? If not, what do you have to be found out about?

        Look, if you feel like less of a man because you did not join the priesthood, which is vastly different than becoming a protestant pastor, than haggard than that is fine. That is something that you will have to deal. But what galls me is that you would defend him, because you feel that you are inadequate in some way. While I am not going to sit here and try and boost your self-esteem, consider this: Haggard has effectively ruined the lives of his family; he did this by using drugs and engaging in sexual acts with a male prostitute. If you would knowingly destroy your family like he has done, and then lie about it, and then try and concoct some story after you have already lied, you deserve whatever embarassment, punishment, and damage that comes your way, but not your family.

        1. but it’s sort of a part of being a Catholic that we each carry around this guilt, this conviction of our unworthiness, that we each deserve to be banished to an eternity in a lake of fire.  That’s why we are so grateful to the Savior, for showing us mercy and saving us from justice. 

          Some brands of Christian devotion are more uplifting and affirming, and downplay the negatives, but I think this guilt is foundational to all of them, even if it isn’t repeated very often. 

          I think if you find a Christian who doesn’t feel inadequate in some way, you should ask them why they bother with the rituals and mumbo jumbo.  This particular religion is for sinners and weaklings.  The strong, self-reliant don’t need it.  Some of us wish we didn’t need it, but the beginning of our Strength is in seeing that we do. 

  7. Yes, I not only expect that people will believe, but despite overwhelming evidence will forgive and forget.

    Do a google on CALVARY TEMPLE, CHARLES  BLAIR

    http://www.westword….

    I find one link.  Thank Cerf and Berners-Lee for even that little bit of reality.

    Non-native auslanders may not understand the grief that this slimebag caused.
     

  8. Sure, Ted…just like Bill Clinton didn’t inhale, or have “sexual relations with that woman.” You’d better steal your lies from a more credible source next time.

  9. enlightening to read this thread almsot as “new” from top to bottom. The angry denunciations of “fraud” flowing to “the accuser is a slime and Ted wasn’t that bad” to “how come you are piling on this guy”. I remember the same response from Ds when I called Clinton a slimeball for screwing Monica and then lying about it. Haggart is no different than Clinton and Clinton at least didn’t confess to a felony possession charge. People got after Clinton for lying about it, so did Haggert – his lies just didn’t last as long and he didn’t commit perjury (ok, so they both committed felonies). Either stop bashing Clinton for Monica or let the Ds have their fun on Haggert.

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