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July 24, 2009 03:44 PM UTC

Open Line Friday!

  • 54 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

“The government can then dictate and regulate every aspect of your behavior, because whatever your behavior is is going to have ramifications on your health.  This is not about health care. It’s not about the details of the plan…and I refuse to believe that this is not being done on purpose. I know the purpose of health care. I know it is to regulate your life. I know it is about control.”

–Rush Limbaugh

Comments

54 thoughts on “Open Line Friday!

  1. from the HuffPo

    A South Florida town manager who married a porn star last year was fired at an emergency meeting after the mayor and council members learned about it.

    Fort Myers Beach town council voted 5-0 to fire Scott Janke “without cause” after Mayor Larry Kiker called the Tuesday night meeting.

  2. It is so sad to see healthcare reform dying before our eyes.  Once again, the insurance industry purchasing of legislators pays huge dividends.  Once again, the democrats have turned into- well -democrats!  I am so disappointed in my president and my congress.  

    I guess it is the price of living in a “free” society.

    I think we need to take some radical steps to solve this problem.  I think, all at once, EVERY citizen of the United States should cancel their insurance and become wards of the state!  At one time, we could bankrupt the insurance companies and essentially “backdoor” national healthcare as each state would be swamped by claims and the feds would have to take action!

    My God, what has the United States come to?  Is this us?  Really?  This is what we want to leave to our children?

    God help us all…  We, the United States of America, are slidng into second-nation status and eventually the dust bin of history…

    1. It took a year between the time Bush/Cheney started agitating for war with Iraq and when Congress passed the war resolution. If only the right wing were as big of quitters as some on the left seem to be on health insurance reform, perhaps we wouldn’t be mired in Iraq after all this time.

      1. Why is it that some of the same people (from both parties) who supported the Iraq War are opposing health care reform.

        In 2002-2003 I didn’t hear anybody talking about how we were going to pay for the war. Now all of the sudden we have those very same people poring over every tiny detail of the health care bill. Where were the budget hawks then? Oh right, they were just hawks then–or chickenhawks.

        I’m not giving up on health car reform–I probably never will–but you have to admit that the past week and a half has been incredibly discouraging.

            1. The majority leader is, as (I think) Howard Fineman put it th “chief scheduler.”

              Baucus has stated that he will not move anything that doesn’t have Grassley’s support. And the reason for that is the finance committee rules, specifically this one:

              Rule 4. Quorums.-(a) Except as provided in subsection (b) one-third of the membership of the committee, including not less than one member of the majority party and one member of the minority party, shall constitute a quorum for the conduct of business. [emphasis added]

              Grassley can hold the committee hostage by just having members of his caucus not show up. Grassley gets to dictate whatever terms he wants or else threaten to walk out.

            2. They’ve made clear they won’t give us a single vote. So we don’t need to accommodate them in any way.

              Besides, everybody needs somebody to laugh at.

        1. on so many issues including health care.  So, instead of a failure it may turn out to be an opportunity for a state, a region or communities to create a solution that works.  Like so many issues that stumble along in Congress almost forever, the problem of access to health care doesn’t need to be that difficult to solve.  It may need to happen in phases – perhaps beginning with a community clinic model that is supported by the private sector (e.g. doctors, nurses and others provide some pro bono services, volunteers and some staff provide administrative services).  Once such lower-cost service providers become more available, then perhaps we can work to solve the mess that insurance companies have made of the medical care payment system.  

          1. but I doubt any health care solutions from the individual states will be forthcoming while they face the budget crises they’re currently facing.

            I just really didn’t want to see health care become for 2009 what immigration reform was for 2006. Sadly, it looks like they’re blowing it.

            1. Hey, I REALLY want healthcare reform.  I DO believe it falls under the “life” part of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

              That said, I just don’t see the political will of the Dems to get this done.  From here on out, EVERY candidate I speak to, no matter what office they seek, I will ask them if they are willing to serve only one term so they can make the tough decisions.

              I spent years in politics at a variety of levels.  I was so disappointed to find chickenshits at all levels in every party.  

              Where are the profiles in courage these days?

              1. Seriously, I absolutely agree – if the courageous do not run, or cannot win, this country’s in more trouble than we even understand.

          2. Federal action has to happen because most health insurance plans are already federally regulated under ERISA.

            So this bill sets up 50 state-based insurance exchanges through which insurance companies will be required to offer plans that meet a certain minimum threshold of coverage, and starting several years down the road a public option will be introduced into the mix as a means of squeezing administrative costs (which right now comprise upwards of 30% of the cost, compared with 2% for Medicare).

            To ease the transition, substantial investments will be made IT infrastructure so that the private plans can simplify their electronic billing, using Medicare as a perfect example–it went from being the most awful to deal with to being the best. Doctors file electronically and two weeks later the payment is direct deposited in their bank accounts.

            Community clinic models will be encouraged and funded. The Merillac clinic in Grand Junction is being held up as a perfect example, as is the community quality board they have in Grand Junction. The proposed system encourages that kind of innovation and offers grants for setting it up.

              1. But I do know if I want to get an appointment with my Denver doctor it usually takes about a month. If I need to get in sooner I see the PA.

            1. For this time period (quoted from OpenLeft)

              1. Schering-Plough Corp – $ 86,200

              2. AMGEN Inc. – $ 65,250

              3. Blue Cross/Blue Shield – $ 62,350


              4. UST Inc. – $ 61,950

              5. New York Life Insurance – $ 59,150

              6. JP Morgan Chase & Co – $ 58,100

              7. American International Group – $ 51,750

              8. Aetna Inc. – $ 51,250

              9. Goldman Sachs – $ 47,900

              10. DaVita Inc. – $ 47,850

              Deep in the pockets of those who want to keep things just the way they are.  What a shitbag.

              RSB, remember my comment a few weeks ago about lobbyists killing any sort of healthcare reform ?  Its sad.  Hopefully something can happen after August recess, but a lot of MO will be lost.

              1. And that list of Baucus donors is quite revealing. I wonder how much money some of the other blue dogs who are opposing reform have been paid by the insurance companies.

            2. He respresents, what tenth of a percent of the nation’s population and he’s stonewalling what most American’s want?

              I think Harmann is right; folks like Baucus can’t squeeze the poverty turnip of Montana’s people, so he goes to the corps.  They will fund him and he will ask, “How high?”

              1. grease Baucus for a couple hundred thousand dollars, which is a drop in the bucket for them, and you can subvert the will of 47 million uninsured americans, the untold millions more that want a public option, and the 12,000 or so each day who lose their coverage.

                So giving up what they make for say an hour or so, they can keep thier billion dollar racket in place.  Baucus is easy !

                A sad commentary on our democracy today.

                1. Thom Hartmann has good stats that I sure don’t recall, but let’s say Corporation A spends ten million for political influence, they will get back one hundred million in benefits, contracts, tax evasion, etc.  

  3. We all know many of you will associate some of the high numbers in the link with a lack of government spending and taxation.  Maybe someone could find the breakout data – scoring detail?

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/31965853

    I’m surprised Carpey/Carpie hasn’t posted a diary tying this “official CNBC study” to all the pro business/pro labor accomplishments of the administration and how we just need to spend and tax more to cure the “failures”.  

    Oh yeah, last time they fired then aimed the GOP had a field day with the details.

    1. 1. Georgia 2. North Carolina 3. Florida 4. Arizona (T) 4. Tennessee (T)

      If only the Right to Work was available to all Coloradoans and not just state employers we might score even higher.

          1. You misunderstood the Post story — the percentage of job losses in the last year was at the highest rate in 65 years, but the unemployment rate isn’t the highest in 65 years.

            In June 1982 the rate went to 7.7% and didn’t drop below today’s rate until a year later. During the first Reagan recession it topped out at 9.1% in November 1982.

            The rate went higher in Colorado again in September 1986 at 7.9% and didn’t drop back below today’s level again until June 1987. In March 1987 the Colorado unemployment rate was 8.5%.

            Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics historic data output: http://data.bls.gov/PDQ/servle

    2. First, to answer the obvious propaganda point – the CNBC study does not survey businesses, nor does it study the state’s business climate – it studies the state’s business marketing pitch.  It then creates a weighted score based on various aspects of the pitch.

      Colorado ranks #3 overall, but never higher than 5th in any of the individual categories.

      Category Points Colorado Rank
      Cost of Doing Business 450 22
      Workforce 350 12
      Quality of Life 350 10
      Economy 314 5
      Transportation & Infrastructure 300 36
      Technology & Innovation 250 11
      Education 175 33
      Business Friendliness 175 5
      Access to Capital 50 9
      Cost of Living 25 32

      Particularly notable: our lousy transportation and education rankings – directly attributable to the lack of government funding from low taxes.  We aren’t particularly inexpensive – but we are “business friendly” and allow easy access to our Legislature.

      Not, overall, the picture I as a resident really want to see for my state.

    1. But I’ve lived without healthcare for 9 years now while I run a small business, pay taxes and work my ass off and I just can’t find the humor in this at all, while I hold my breath and pray to God I don’t have an appendicitis which would bankrupt me.

      But hey, glad to see someone is enjoying the misery of millions.  

    2. But I’ve lived without healthcare for 9 years now while I run a small business, pay taxes and work my ass off and I just can’t find the humor in this at all, while I hold my breath and pray to God I don’t have an appendicitis which would bankrupt me.

      But hey, glad to see someone is enjoying the misery of millions.  

        1. Currently shelling out $ 300 for myself, $ 400 for my wife who is pregnant, and $ 130 for our son PER MONTH for individual policies.

          I make a good living but this just isn’t sustainable.

          1. than I pay in rent, you know that? I pay $825 for my house. That’s just a staggering slap of reality, that you are paying out over $10 grand a year for insurance. You’re absolutely right–it’s not sustainable and yet, what other choice do you have? None, as of right now.

      1. I have a wife and three girls.  The premiums kill me.  I want reform desperately, but this ain’t it.  

        This bill is a power grab.  That’s why you’re seeing so much internal fighting from the dems over it.

        It doesn’t lower costs at all – it increases them according to the CBO, and I don’t trust anyone that tries to rush you into a big money deal.

        Take your time, craft a good bill, and let’s fix it.

        1. $1 trillion bailout or GM takeover or Pinnocol takeover or …. name the socialist spend and tax policy to force the new ideology down our throats

        2. ALL health care reforms made at a government level will cost some taxpayer money.  Regulation of insurance companies costs money.  It will save the consumer, but cost the government.  Bigger health care reforms are similar – the CBO only scores government cost, not consumer savings.

    3. I am kind of torn on what to think about it.

      On one hand, if there are good faith legitimate concerns by the blue dogs, the pubs and others, and those concerns are somehow met, also in good faith, by compromise on the bill, then great.  That is the legislative process and hopefully a better bill would be the result.

      On the other, however, if raising all sort of concerns is just part of some callous effort by reps to hang their hat on a reason why they are voting against the bill, and they will vote against ANY BILL, no matter how good it is, then we’re all fucked.

      I just don’t know, but it looks really bad.  Being the cynic I am I tend to think the healthcare industry is giving a swift kick in the crotch to ordinary Americans through by proxy of their well funded and well supported members of congress, AGAIN.

      1. Is they do have a very good point – the bill does not address bringing costs down. And that is critical.

        I wish they would introduce a second bill focused on cost reduction – with items that make it credible. Then move this bill forward and go to work on that second one.

        1. I think that’s a sound strategy as well. But it has to be followed through on. It’s a vital issue. Just growing the covered base will bring down costs a little by moving primary care out of the emergency room and back into the physician’s office, but it will also bring those people into the same system where the inflation rate is unsustainable even if you subtract emergency room care from the cost equation.

          1. This bill eliminates choices, and creates a gigantic arm of government.  

            Fix it.  Regulate it better if need be.  Do not allow the government to take over the healthcare system, which they will do if they are both a regulator and a participant with an endless supply of tax dollars.

        1. Doc notated something funny that turned out to be nothing when he took my appendix out, yet I’m permanently uninsurable on the individual market,

          That means I can never start my own business without losing health insurance, which is a problem. And whether or not a potential employer has a group policy has to take precedence over salary or whether I’d even like the job. I work to have health insurance.

          I’ve taken three jobs in the past 10 years for shitty pay with shitty hours and a shitty boss just so I could have health insurance.

          So while I know you don’t want health reform that doesn’t meet the libertarian ideal, please spare me. Elections have consequences. Despite the millions being spent by the insurance industry on scary ads that seem to have worked on you, more people want the public option than think puppies are cute. You’re in the extreme minority.

          The beauty is that I know you’re a thoughtful person and i think if you take two steps back, erase the rhetoric from your head, and examine the house bill on its merits (it’s not that long, despite the complaining from reform opponents–I’ve actually skimmed through the whole thing) you’ll have a different opinion. There’s nothing in there that doesn’t align with what Obama was very specific about on the campaign, and nobody was freaking out about it then. If anything it’s more conservative than his campaign plan.

    4. Y’know, LB, if Republicans had done anything about health care reform in the time they held an absolute majority, you might have a point.

      But they didn’t.

      Oh, wait, they helped pass Medicare D, which prohibits the cost-cutting measure of negotiating drug prices. Nice.

      Face it, LB, Republicans in Congress don’t give a shit about your conservative ass any more than they do my lib one.  

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