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February 14, 2014 07:10 AM UTC

Friday Open Thread

  • 55 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

"Justice is sweet and musical; but injustice is harsh and discordant."

–Henry David Thoreau

Comments

55 thoughts on “Friday Open Thread

    1. This particular article seems to be about how the Farm Bill loans and grants to small businesses and non-profits in small towns…..I know that there is a lot of lardy pork in the subsidies to Big Ag, and I despise the cuts to SNAP…but the folks showcased in this article seem be be using the money well.

    2. The Farm Bill has a lot of great programs that support rural communitiies.  Any community that can pull off their ideological blinders and focus on what is in their citizens best interest will find a plethera of federal support. 

  1. Good morning Polsters and Happy Valentines Day.

    What did President Obama have to say about Presidents' use of pens and telephones, so to speak, before he was elected President?  In October 2008, he actually said this:

    “I take the Constitution very seriously, the biggest problems that we’re facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all. And that’s what I intend to reverse when I’m president of the United States of America.”

    What has Barack Obama been doing ever since he was elected?

    Political Cartoons by Glenn McCoy

     

    How has this been helping his buddy, Mark Udall, who has been with him 99% of the time on his misguided policies?  According to the former Chairman of the Colorado Democratic Party, Floyd Ciruli, not so much.

    1. What has Barack Obama been doing ever since he was elected?

      Trying to work with Congress…until last week. So now the Republican thugs that wouldn't give him the time of day are crying because he has changed tactics and has essentially said to Congress…Fuck you, I'll do it without you.

      Now all the Republican caucus can say is…Waaahhhhhhh!

      1. Actually Dukie, he owned Congress for the first two years.  Then he got them to pass an ill-conceived, highly partisan health care law which was very unpopular. Then he lost the house. The Senate takes longer to turn over so that will have to wait until this year.  That is what he has been doing.

        1. A law which was passed with Big Insurance granted loads of seats at the table, no seat at all for a voice representing single payer, the possibility of a public option kicked to curb in nothing flat and which was ultimately pretty much a carbon copy of Romneycare, entirely the product of  your own conservative think tanks. 

          Your side should have loved it to pieces. But, once again, the bottom line is that all of your endlessly repeated nasty comments about it are futile since they're meant to defeat Udall. They won't. You will be stuck with two Dem Senators no matter how much of this garbage you spew. Just keep banging your head against that wall. 

  2. Forget Valentine's Day. I declare this “conservative appreciation day”. from "Go Left" website

     

      Let me count the ways conservatives:

    • Make us log in early in the morning in an increasingly nail-biting race to see who gets to put the first post on the Open Thread
    • Encourages us to research our points in an ultimately futile, yet oddly touching, attempt to crack the walls of talking-point demagoguery with facts
    • Keeps the posts from becoming boring, because of general agreement
    • Makes posters stretch for new and inventive,  insults and zingers
    • Keeps our fingers limber scrolling up and down to see who “started it”.
    • Maintains belief in the possibilities of civil discourse and rational argument in a polarized and dysfunctional political landscape
      1. …as are the approaching-500,000 souls that perished as a result of this lie.  Any unnecessary death is a tragic loss – including the 18,000 children that perish each and every day from hunger and malnutrition.  It's an imperfect world that we inhabit – all we can do is bend the moral needle one way or the other on a daily basis.  I'll take ACA over the alternative any day of the week.  If Boehner & Co. have a better plan, let's hear it.  So far all we have is 40+ failed voted to repeal with not a single proposal.

        1. I get it Michael.  She lost her life because Mark Udall is not perfect.  I aleady knew he was not perfect.  I wish she didn't have to die to make the point.

    1. No.
      She died because:
      1. She did not renew her insurance as of 01JAN2014 as she should have.
      2. And, she was too stubborn to go to the hospital even when "She couldn’t keep down solid food.  She should have gone to a doctor.  But she toughed it out"

    2. Read it again. The only people who think they are worse off with it than without it by that kind of margin are the young uninsured. They obviously would like to remain uninsured without paying a fine and aren't saying that they are worse off because they lost insurance they don't like because they don't have insurance to like or not.  They may like not having to pay for insurance or a fine but  they certainly won't expect to be left to die in the street if they get seriously ill or have a serious injury. Then we may not like having to foot their inflated uninsured bill but we won't have a choice.

  3. I was curious if AC/troll could go lower and prove that he (?-I assume 'yes') is an even more dispicable P.O.S. than he (?) had already been shown to be…and the answer is YES.  

  4. She had a healthcare plan she liked.  Udallcare caused her plan to be cancelled. Her family went to the website to purchase insurance.  They finally bought insurance effective February 1st.She got sick, in late January and tried to tough it out until her insurance kicked in.  She died.

    A real person is dead because Mark Udall knew what was better for her.  And then the incompetent Dem administration can't build a website so she is uninsured and she dies.

    Her husband and four kids are in my thoughts this Valentine's day.

     

        1. At least I am not a low-life troll so deserate to try and score a partisan political point that I would stoop to make a tangential connection to a sad tragedy for my own purposes.  But that's becaue I am an ethical human being.  Turd. 

      1. CT, This is how her brother concludes:

        The public debate about Obamacare will continue for a long time.  But for my family, the debate ended with the death of my sister.  For us, it’s not about “policy,” anymore.  It’s about the tragic consequences that can happen when the government decides to cancel the private economic decisions of individuals in favor of a huge policy experiment created in the back rooms of Washington by out-of-touch bureaucrats, statisticians and lobbyists.  As far as we are concerned, Obamacare killed my little sister and left a good man a widower, and four children without their mother.

        1. So, to recap–   ACA sets minimum standards that a policy must meet (no disqualification for pre-existing conditions, no $25,000 deductibles, that sort of thing):  Insurance company (not named, of course) cancels Lady's policy, rather than follow the law, and that's Obama's fault:  Lady doesn't get new insurance before she has a medical emergency, and that's Obama's fault; Lady refuses to go to the doctor, or to the ER, perhaps because she no longer has insurance, and that's Obama's fault: Lady tragically dies, and that's Obama's fault.  

          Then, "grieving" brother (GOP speechwriter and right-wing flack) holds up the corpse of his dead sister and howls, "This is OBAMA'S FAULT!!!"; not to be undone, AC picks up whatever pieces are left, waving them in the air, and yells, "and UDALL'S FAULT!!!"    

          And you folks wonder why reasonable people are sick of you. 

        1. Sorry.  Was watching Olympic hockey.  Did you say something?

          Oh–I see.  Nothing intelligent.

          The whole freakin' country knew when the signup/payment deadlines were for Jan 1 coverage.  Sorry this person missed it and it cost her her life.

    1. Anyone can find specific cases to support their position on anything. I can remember when people were still arguing that old uncle so and so was a smoker and lived to be 99 so that was supposed to prove cigarettes don't kill you.  Any case you care to use won't change the fact the old system left many people more people at risk because they couldn't get coverage at all just as somebody's uncle didn't change the fact that cigarettes have devastating health and longevity consequences. And Udall is still going to be your Senator.

      Oh, and while I'm not saying this particular story isn't true, so far your side has a really bad credibility record with this sort of thing. You know, people you claimed were unhappy about losing their crappy insurance coming forward to say they actually they like their new policy?

        1. You didn't provide a link and I can't find that but I did find this at the Kaiser site with lots of solid info, most of which you'd probably prefer to ignore. But here it is anyway. If you have something more recent that shows 2 to 1 unhappy feel free to provide link. Bet you never checked out my other links either.  Also haven't apologized for calling name a hypocrite over Hudak on the assumption that I hadn't criticized her. And, once again, Udall will still be your Senator when the year is over. Cheers. Looking forward to peace and quiet of your usual crickets. Or more head banging repetitions of the same talking point.

          http://kff.org/health-reform/poll-finding/kaiser-health-tracking-poll-june-2013/

            1. Sorry. Somehow this got posted way up the thread by mistake, mine or a glitch:

              BlueCat says:

              Fri February 14, 2014 at 2:30 PM MST

              Read it again. The only people who think they are worse off with it than without it by that kind of margin are the young uninsured. They obviously would like to remain uninsured without paying a fine and aren't saying that they are worse off because they lost insurance they don't like because they don't have insurance to like or not.  They may like not having to pay for insurance or a fine but  they certainly won't expect to be left to die in the street if they get seriously ill or have a serious injury. Then we may not like having to foot their inflated uninsured bill but we won't have a choice.

              Reply

              – See more at: http://coloradopols.com/diary/54332/friday-open-thread-18#comment-539030

      1. Here are a couple of links  you might find informative. Well, probably not but here they are anyway:

        Many of the plans on the individual market are so bad that people who have them might as well be uninsured. "The only people who like those plans are people who have never needed them," says Nancy Metcalf, a senior editor at Consumer Reports. "They haven't figured out yet how terrible they are. They think they have good coverage but they don't."

        A good example might be Dianne Barrette, 56, who appeared on CBS News with Jan Crawfordlast week for a segment about the wave of cancelations. Barrette, a realtor in Florida, was upset because her $54 a month insurance plan was being canceled. She believed a new one would cost her more than $500 a month due to Obamacare. "What I have right now is what I'm happy with," she said. "I just want to know why I can't keep what I have. Why do I have to be forced into something else?"

        But here’s the rub: Barrette's $54 plan wasn't even insurance. When I talked to her, she was unsure of what her plan covered. But she said it was what Blue Cross calls a "supplemental" or discount plan, which only pays $50 toward doctor's office visits and a few other out-patient services, including mammograms. What her plan doesn’t cover: hospitalization. Not at all. So if she gets hit by a car, the people ultimately picking up the tab will be the hospital and everyone else (by way of higher medical costs). If she gets cancer, she’s basically out of luck. "It's all I could afford," she told me.

        http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/11/obamacare-canceled-health-insurance

        More at http://prospect.org/article/another-phony-obamacare-victim-story

         

  5. Notr Dame attorney screws up oral argument in contraceptive mandate case:

    What many of the news reports missed, however, was the fact that the University’s attorney, Matthew Kairis of Jones Day, violated some of the most basic principles of any oral argument presented to a court. Kairis wouldn’t answer simple yes-or-no questions, leading Judge Posner to threaten at one point that he wouldn’t permit Kairis to continue his argument if he wouldn’t answer a simple question. Kairis repeatedly talked over the judges, leading Judge Posner to tell him to stop interrupting. Right out of the box, Kairis botched a simple question from the court: what relief do you want? At one point, Judge Posner said to Kairis, “Stop babbling.” Ouch. 

    Most lawyers know that Jones Day is a big (as in really big) law firm that hires only the brightest of the bright. Kairis’s credentials are impressive (Harvard Law), and he’s handled a lot of high profile cases. That’s why it is so surprising that Kairis didn’t conduct a better argument. Indeed, at one point Judge Posner was so frustrated with the interruptions that he made a remark suggesting that it was inconceivable that a lawyer who had done arguments in other courts didn’t know that it’s a cardinal sin to interrupt the judge. (Speaking of sins, Judge Posner stumped Kairis with the question, “Is use of contraceptives a mortal or venial sin?” After Kairis said he didn’t know, Posner said, “Well you should know. It’s a mortal sin,” and then went on to explain why Catholic theology labels it a mortal sin.)

    http://thethirdapple.wordpress.com/2014/02/13/how-not-to-conduct-an-oral-argument/

     

      1. CBO report and director confirm unemployment go down under ACA.  If you were a normal human being with a moral compass and integrity you would acknowledge that rather than just smear more of your feces around. Troll. Turd.  

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