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August 23, 2023 12:25 AM UTC

Wednesday Open Thread

  • 16 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

“All great truths begin as blasphemies.”

–George Bernard Shaw

Comments

16 thoughts on “Wednesday Open Thread

  1. Interesting read from Heather Cox-Richardson.

    Law professor Bruce Mann’s 2002 book on the early history of American debt, Republic of Debtors, explained how early Americans redefined bankruptcy to excuse defaulting on commercial debt as a result of the volatility of market forces, while retaining the old idea that defaulting on personal debt was a moral failing. Their argument was that commercial debtors could not avoid economic risk because they engaged in market activity, while farmers, tradesmen—ordinary people—should order their affairs so that they did not take on debt they could not repay.

    Mann pointed out that this new understanding was “an oddly narrow understanding of economic risk, excluding as it did the hazards and chance that could rain economic ruin on farmers, tradesmen, and other nonmerchants. Moreover, it treated noncommercial debt as somehow avoidable and hence nonpayment” as a moral failing. 

    The difference between the willingness of right-wing lawmakers to afford debt relief to business owners—often including themselves—through the Paycheck Protection Program and their staunch opposition to the Biden administration’s student loan relief programs suggest that a perceived difference between commercial debt and personal debt in the United States is alive and well.

    Rising costs of college and cuts to government support for education mean that more than 45 million people across the country owe more than $1.6 trillion in federal loans, an amount equal to the size of the Australian economy. That debt absorbs money people at the lower end of the economic scale would otherwise invest in homes, consumer goods, and so on, and the Biden administration has made it a priority to relieve some of that debt.

    1. HC-R strikes again. A seldom discussed truth about the way shit is done. 

      “Of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations”. Isn’t that what ol’ Honest Abe said at Gettysburg? The influence of money streams in government can’t be overstated. Corporations have always had the money…well, ever since they took it away from the King.

      1. HC-R also points out that 20million people have exited the voting population, mostly old people (i.e. they died), while 36million people have entered, mostly young people.

    1. But have you seen the footage of the "crash"? It augered in. No big explosion or anything. There's more to this story, and there's no certainty that Prigozhin was actually on the plane, though his name was on the passenger manifest. 

      1. Actually, looking at the video, if this really is the plane (or what was left of it after whatever event happened to cause it to fall out of the sky), it does not appear to be under power since there seemed to be no forward momentum, as it literally was spinning slowly (sometimes in a flat spin) as it dropped essentially straight down.  It did not appear to be intact (ie. missing major part of wings, possibly even the cockpit) as it wafted down.

        The person taking the video likely heard something like an explosion which prompted them to record the aftermath.  Usually, augering-in implies a high speed straight shot into the ground, leaving a smoking hole and little that can be recovered.  Reportedly, they were able to retrieve 8 bodies so far, so the impact was gravity-fed, not a powered crash. 

        It will be interesting to learn if Prigozhin was aboard and he received a “Putin Farewell”, or if he staged it himself for health reasons. 

        BTW — it could just as easily be a helicopter falling, and not at all related to the reported small business jet crash.

      2. Wagner, TASS, and the Russian equivalent of the FAA have all confirmed he had boarded the plane. Still could be a cover-up, but…

        It is also reported ghat Wagner's head of operations, a Nazi-loving jerk by the name of Dmitri Utkin, was also on board; no loss there. There was also a report that the plane was struck by a SAM, which could account for the video flat spin if it took out a control surface. (Catastrophic engine failure could have done the same, though – or a small explosive, or…)

  2. I for one will sleep better tonight knowing the Russian Federal Air Transport Agency is launching a full investigation of the crash of this aircraft. They'll get to the bottom of it.

  3. Our dingbat can’t help herself.  If she’d go to any hotel app she’d find nice rooms for $249 or less / night (rooms that probably rent for $1k/night in high season).  Good on Uncle Sam for housing these FEMA employees, whatever the cost, so those hotel workers can keep their jobs. 
     

    Why do you hate working class people, BoBo? 

  4. “The climate change agenda is a hoax,” says Vivek Ramaswamy.

    Chris Christie’s response, “The last skinny guy [of color] with a funny last name on a debate stage was Barack Obama and we don’t want to go there again.”

  5. Republican Debate needs its own thread. It’s pretty entertaining watching them be rude, talk over each other, and disregard the moderator’s instructions.

    Moderator: Raise your hand if you believe climate change is caused by humans.

    DeSantis: what are we, school children? Blah blah blah blah blah for five minutes about how climate change is a hoax and he’s really a tough guy.

    This was in response to a question by a young republican about climate change.

    Then people went off on a tangent about what DeSantis said. so , bottom line,  we didn’t get to see a show of hands for who believes climate change is caused by humans. 
     

    Chris Christie said a borderline racist thing about how Vivek R is “ another skinny guy with a funny name” just like Obama. No, he didn’t call out Vivek’s skin color or ethnicity explicitly, but it was implied. 

    I really do wish TFG had stopped in. The entertainment value wouldhave skyrocketed. 
     

    1. If Trump had appeared, the other 8 wouldn't have been able to get a word in.

      Asa Hutchinson, 50 minutes into the debate, was the first to go THERE and attack Trump.

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