Friday Open Thread

18
  by: Colorado Pols May 19, 2023 at 8:06 AM MDT

“Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to recognize a mistake when you make it again.”

–Franklin P. Jones

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18 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. ParkHill says:
    May 19, 2023 at 8:22 AM MDT

    Republicans Since Reagan. Heather Cox-Richardson.

    The fight between DeSantis and Disney illustrates the dramatic ideological change in the Republican Party in the last two years. No longer committed to keeping the government weak to stay out of the way of business development, the party is now committed to creating a strong government that enforces Christian nationalism. 

    This is a major and crucially important political shift.

    From the earliest days of the Reagan Revolution, those leaders who wanted to slash the federal government to end business regulation and cut the social safety net recognized that they did not have the votes to put their program in place. To find those votes, they courted racists and traditionalists who hated the federal government’s protection of civil rights. Over time, that base became more and more powerful until Trump openly embraced it in August 2017, when he said there were “very fine people on both sides.” 

    As he moved toward the techniques of authoritarians, his followers began to champion the system that Hungarian prime minister Viktor Orbán called “illiberal democracy” or “Christian democracy” in his own country. Orbán argued that the principle of equality in liberal democracy undermines countries by attacking the national culture. Instead, he called for an end to multiculturalism—including immigration—and any lifestyle that is not based on the “Christian family model.” He seized control of universities to make them preach his values. 

    Today’s Republican leaders openly admire Orbán and appear to see themselves as the vanguard of a “post-liberal order.” They believe that the central tenets of democracy—free speech, religious liberty, academic freedom, equality before the law, and the ability of corporations to make decisions based on markets rather than religious values—have destroyed national virtue.

    • ParkHill says:
      May 19, 2023 at 8:27 AM MDT

      From the same letter:

      Also today, the far-right House Freedom Caucus has called for an end to any discussions of raising the debt ceiling until the Senate passes its bill calling for extreme budget cuts. Forcing the nation into default will cause a global economic panic and, asked if they should compromise with the White House, Representative Bob Good (R-VA) said: “Why would we? We have a winning hand.”

      • kwtree says:
        May 19, 2023 at 8:48 AM MDT

        So f the premise of HCR’s first letter is true, i.e. that Republicans no longer want to drown government in the bathtub, but want a strong Christian autocracy instead, then how would GQPers justify that autocracy not paying its bills? 
         

        If the US government becomes uncreditworthy through defaulting on debt, would this not undercut the Fascist long term goal? Is there a plan B? 

         

        • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
          May 19, 2023 at 9:18 AM MDT

          "…then how would GQPers justify that autocracy not paying its bills?"

          Good question. Let me theorize how MTG, Bobo or Gosar might answer the question:

          Since it is a fundamental tenet of MAGA theology that Jews control most, if not all, of the world's financial institutions, and since those financial institutions hold much of the debt, it doesn't hurt to stiff those creditors in the eyes of the Christian God a/k/a Prosperity Jesus.

           

        • JohnInDenver says:
          May 19, 2023 at 9:50 AM MDT

          As best I can tell, the House Republicans are now in an unenviable position of public statements saying

          • we won't pass a debt ceiling increase without budget cuts
          • we won't pass a BIG debt ceiling increase, so we will be back next year for more.
          • we won't even negotiate on a debt ceiling until the Senate acts to cut the budget
          • we are negotiating in good faith and making progress
          • debt default is not an option.

          That combination is among the least coherent set of positions I've ever seen on a matter of importance.

          Meanwhile, Senate Minority leader McConnell has stuck his neck out of a shell to say that the Senate cannot act to save the situation, but that McCarthy & Biden need to have a deal. Majority leader Schumer and 48 others in the conference say they will not support budget cuts, and there are not the conditions for a "majority is enough" budget reconciliation.

          President Biden continues to say "clean debt ceiling bill" and this ought to be the last time the "debt ceiling" is a thing. And by the way, the G7 meeting is more important for the US than the debt ceiling negotiations and the South Pacific alliance talks aren't as important. 

          I'm naive enough to hope that a group of Republican House members is willing to sign on to the discharge petition if nothing else works.  That between listening to people talking through the financial Armageddon of a default, recognizing the cohesion of lobbyists for interest groups and corporations opposing the cuts, contemplating their personal portfolios, and preparing statements on "what's right for America," they will sign and vote for a clean increase. 

          Consequences of such a move rapidly go beyond my imagination.

          • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
            May 19, 2023 at 3:51 PM MDT

            What they have said is irrelevant. It is what they say at one particular moment that is all that matters.

            Remember, most of their followers have the attention span of a sack full of rats trapped in a burning meth lab.

            And if someone points out what they have said in the past, they simple yell, ‘FAKE NEWS! HOAX!”

            As for the discharge petition idea, I think it is quite possible that they can find a half dozen Republicans who will do the correct thing (Don Bacon of NE is supposedly the leader of this small group). But if it does materialize all hell will break loose and those Republicans who sign on to such a petition will be subjected to the full Liz Cheney treatment.

            • JohnInDenver says:
              May 20, 2023 at 1:59 PM MDT

              Except … if those who sign a discharge petition get pushed out of Republican committee slots and the conference as a whole … McCarthy will no longer have a "Republican" majority.  If a group of 5 objects to their treatment, they could negotiate with Democrats, vacate the Speaker's chair, put someone else in, and support rules changes which could change every committee's make-up, too.

              • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
                May 20, 2023 at 2:31 PM MDT

                Touche!

                I've thought that the non-crazy six House Republicans should form an independent caucus and hold the balance of power.

                But I don't know if they have the cojones to do it.

    • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
      May 19, 2023 at 9:13 AM MDT

      “Christian democracy”

      I'm old enough to remember the late Reverend Doctor Jerry Fallwell (father of the cuckold with the Pool Boy) in the '80's trying out the term "Christian Republic."

      Apparently, it went over like a fart in a church, so they shied away from using it then. (It probably sounded a little too much like the then newly minted Islamic Republic of Iran.)

      "To everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose." If you wait 40 years, a variation on the term can become fashionable, or at least acceptable.

    • spaceman2021 says:
      May 19, 2023 at 9:51 AM MDT

      They not only courted racists, many of them, including Reagan, were or are racists.  

      • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
        May 19, 2023 at 9:59 AM MDT

        I remember the press coverage of an incident at a political event in 1980 where Nancy Reagan was giving a campaign speech and she thought the microphone was off – but it picked her up – saying something about seeing all those wonderful, white faces in the crowd.

        Yeah, Trump wasn’t the first GOP presidential candidate who was a racist. He was just the first one to proudly embrace it.

  2. coloradosane says:
    May 19, 2023 at 9:31 AM MDT

    You can't win if you are a persistent minority of voters. But with our wonderful electoral system you can leverage our "good faith" system to play.  You win every once in a while then you grab more tricked the frick system power until you force policies on the majority that they don't agree with.  Then you blame the majority. Rinse repeat ever since fugitive slave act……

  3. NOV GOP meltdown says:
    May 19, 2023 at 9:50 AM MDT

    Meatball Ron loses $ 1 bil in investment from Disney; Fled Cruz wants another bullshit "investigation", this time Anheuser Busch. It's all about jerbs, and we're pro-business, until we're not! 

    It appears "free market capitalism" is getting in the way of authoritarian hardons. Can't ever blame them for being consistent!

    • Lauren Boebert is a Worthless POS says:
      May 19, 2023 at 9:56 AM MDT

      But Melt Down, remember, it's not Ron's fault. It's those nasty, woke folk who forced Ron to do what he did. 

      • NOV GOP meltdown says:
        May 19, 2023 at 10:22 AM MDT

        Yes, I guess this is a natural response when the feelings of those who claim "fuck your feelings" get hurt. I hope the non-mouth breathing part of America understands how unamerican and dangerous this authoritarian crap is. Thank you Orange Shitgibbon for laying the groundwork. 

  4. MichaelBowman says:
    May 19, 2023 at 10:18 AM MDT

    What could possibly go wrong?!?  Taking the grift global. 

    Did he mention he was super excited??

  5. Pam Bennett says:
    May 19, 2023 at 10:48 AM MDT

    The one billion was for the first step of Disney move of the imagineers.  The total planned was about seventeen billion over several years.  But, there is more to it.  The "campus" was a major city with other companies moving in.  Some to support the Disney operations, some for other areas than Disney.  And, it was being financed by gambling companies looking to expand operations in Florida.  This is just being researched so the links have been changed from earlier this morning.  If the reporters finish I will get the final links.  Disney pulling out means the major city project just got kicked in the golden globes and may change direction, such as casinos, or may fail.  Excitement in stodgy old hate state of Florida, where it is illegal for me to use a restroom.  Yeah, smell the stink of greedy old perverts dream world.

  6. ParkHill says:
    May 19, 2023 at 11:04 AM MDT

    For World Economics Nerds.

    Really cool website with interesting graphical presentations.

    https://oec.world/en/profile/country/nld

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