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January 30, 2020 06:43 AM UTC

Thursday Open Thread

  • 41 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

“Sometimes the scandal is not what law was broken, but what the law allows.”

–Edward Snowden

Comments

41 thoughts on “Thursday Open Thread

  1. ‘Impeachment’ is not even among the list of topics on Liein’ Cory’s contact-by-email firewall.

    he doesn’t want to talk about it

    he doesn’t want to hear about it

    but he has a front row seat so he’s seeing it

    1. Optimistically, whoever wins will be able to take advantage of these.

      If he and the campaign were being strategic, he would have put up some with more explicit policy ties and implications for key Iowa and New Hampshire concerns. 

    2. Terrific Pseudo, For three years we’ve bitched about The Screaming Yam ruling by fiat. Now you want a guy to do more of the same as long as you like his policies? That’s not how our government is designed to work. Left or right a dictator’s a dictator.

      1. I posted it because I thought it was interesting.  I haven’t decided yet how I feel about it.  My ties to the roles of “norms” in political behavior are still there, albeit weaker, from my days as a liberal, and that makes me shy away from shifting approaches to the exercise of power.

        But I would disagree that it’s not how our government is designed to work.  I think it largely is.  We’ve been moving closer and closer to an imperial presidency, aided by the actions of both parties and their servitude to moneyed interests.  Our system of selecting leaders is fundamentally undemocratic.  The founders desperately wanted to avoid the demos running the country, and this is what, ultimately, that leads to– a group of elites, able to effectively mobilize a minority of the population to achieve and exercise power, while their nominal opposition tries to fight back with accusations of hypocrisy and unfair dealing, and pleas to “just act right.”

        As someone noted recently on Twitter:

        And those 34 votes might represent only 7% of the US population. https://t.co/Fbwjby4r8n https://t.co/h1to4hOC4F

        — southpaw (@nycsouthpaw) January 29, 2020

        I’m forced to confront the reality of the country we’ve engendered, not the one we imagine the founders to have dreamed of.  Just as I was forced to confront the reality that the Democratic Party is unwilling to do much, if anything, about it, which was why I left it.

        In any case, at this point, I’m having a hard time holding onto the idea that my fantasies about how a country “should” be run can withstand the raging storm of the forces who are arrayed against me and those I love.

        1. well said. 
          Reasonable anyway. 

          I would prefer to hear a presidential candidate to promise to review every EO ever passed and not specifically repealed, thus including those superceded by legislation, judicial decision and circumstance.
           

    3. And, the funding for his $50 Trillion in new programs will be found where?  (He only expects to raise about $4 Trillion from a wealth tax.)  BTW – His program costs are more than twice Elizabeth Warren's plans per charts provided by Steve Rattner on Wed. Morning Joe.

          1. Except you neither know, nor can know, who's electable.  I certainly don't.  "Electability" is a sophistry which people lay over their ideology as a pseudorational justification for their personal beliefs.  Nobody knows who's electable, which is why I don't engage with the notion.

            Vote for who you think can win.  I will.

          2. Almost any of the top Dem candidates can beat Trump. It’s more a matter of who has the best ground and GOTV game. And who helps. If Sanders is the nominee, will you help or will you complain? 
             

            Same thing with Warren… will you help Trump by undermining and spreading distortions, or will you work for the nominee?

            1. Of course I will vigorously help elect the Dem nominee.  However, I will need a lot of help from you to explain how Warren's $20 Trillion or Sanders' $50 Trillion plans are going to be supported by independents and moderate Democrats when they learn their taxes will be raised.  We will be looking at a Dukakis-style shellacking if either of them are the Dem nominee. 

              1. This Vox article gets into the weeds of how the payroll tax contribution works. It’s the familiar proposed mix of about 3% employee and 7% employer contribution. Since employees and employers then don’t pay premiums or copays, and administrative costs are lowered, consumers save money and everyone gets covered with portable insurance. 
                 

                Both candidates also have other revenue streams- wealth and corporate taxes, fees on stock trades, etc. to pay for proposals like free tuition at public colleges. Both eventually want to get to  a public option /Medicare for All health plan, although Warren has a transition plan to get there gradually. 
                 

                As far as support from independents, they both enjoy pretty robust support, especially from the younger crowd. I can tell you that the up and coming teen voters -to -be are pretty excited about free college- they want to get a degree, don’t know how to pay for it, don’t want to be in debt for their whole lives.

                Whichever Dem gets elected ( I choose to be an optimist) will have a long battle on their hands. If Hick is Senator, he will be a Manchin /Lieberman spoiler, weighing in against any plan that cuts down insurance industry profits. It’s why the DSCC got $1.5M to crown him as Senator-to-be. And Hick won’t be the only Democratic voice against a “socialist” public option. So fear not, or rather, fear realistically, and plan on a) defeating Trump and b) pressuring a new administration to implement progressive policies. 

  2. The best political (not best for the country – political) outcome on the witness vote is it loses 50:50.

    Why?

    Because then as more stuff keeps dribbling out, every Republican Senate candidate aside from Collins will have to defend their choice to not learn about all the additional sleazy & illegal stuff that keeps hitting the news.

    Handled right, it should give the Dems control of the Senate.

    1. Hope you're right, David. It's stunning to watch the GOP Senators demonstrate their loyalty to Trump above loyalty to the country, the Constitution, and our laws. They will long be remembered for what they're doing. I'm talking to you @SenCoryGardner. 

      1. Look (HT Cory). They have no choice.

        If you are participating in the corruption, going up against the Capo will just get you fitted for a pair of cement boots. For Republicans to vote against Trump means their political career is over. 

        Given the reality that Trump has taken over the Republican Party, it is very weird to read articles about 4 pretend-moderates who might be persuaded to vote for witnesses. They are precisely the ones who have the least choice. The moment they vote for witnesses, they will be pilloried in right-wing circles, and they'll get a primary challenger who is pure Trump.

  3. 3 years in the history books, and Trump's economic forecast of GDP growth at "4, 5 or even 6%" is looking more and more doubtful.   Washington Post says:

    The Commerce Department reported Thursday that the fourth-quarter increase in the gross domestic product, the economy’s total output of goods and services, matched the 2.1% gain of the third quarter. Both quarters were well below the 3.1% surge seen in the first quarter….

    For the whole year, GDP increased 2.3%, the weakest performance in three years and a slowdown from a 2.9% gain in 2018 when the economy got a boost from President Donald Trump’s tax cuts and billions of dollars in increased government spending….

    Trade actually contributed to growth in the fourth quarter as imports, which subtract from U.S. growth, fell much faster than exports. The change added 1.5 percentage-points to growth in the fourth quarter. However, economists do not expect that positive impact to last as they look for America’s demand for imports to start growing again.

    Continued $1 trillion deficits.  The Fed pumping in additional money "to prevent flubs" in money markets and buying Treasury bills that help prop up stock purchases.

    Yep, going to be an interesting part of the overall campaign when Trump claims "best ever" economy.

    1. "….when Trump claims 'best ever' economy…."

      Yep, and the unemployed coal miners in Appalachia and Wyoming will go ape-shit bonkers over Trump's pronouncements. Of course, in their eyes, the fall of coal is the fault of the radical, left wing, environmentalists who are anti-worker and anti-America. If one mentions the "free market" to them, they will think "more of that g-damn Bernie Sanders socialism again."

      1. Actually, Trump promised to eliminate the federal DEBT in 8 years. 

        In a March 31, 2016, interview with the Washington Post, Donald Trump promised to eliminate the United States' $19 trillion in debt in eight years.

        Trump later softened his promise by pledging to reduce a chunk, rather than the totality of debt, in an April 2016 interview with Fortune. Asked by how much, Trump failed to provide a figure.

        1. He brags about being the king of debt. I fully expect that if he is re-elected, he will try to do Chapter 11 debt reorganization for the federal government before 2024.

          1. Exactly.  He might even try to dissolve Congress if Dems hold either the House or the Senate.  Since he has declared impeachment as unconstitutional, it's not a great leap to say the same for Congress.

            After the Vichy GOP acquits Trump in a day or two, he'll probably start selling tickets to his self-coronation (no one else has sufficient stature to do the honors other than himself).  I can only imagine the title he will choose for himself – perhaps His Perfect Majesty, Emperor Donald.

  4. Well I’ve done it now. After losing my bet to kwtree on impeachment I made the obligatory donation to Native American Liz Warren. 

    So now I get a text message from Bernie to join a canvassing effort in Arvada. I politely replied that Bernie is a Communist.

     The response was to explain that Bernie is a Democratic Socialist and bla, bla, bla, I responded politely that Bernie is a Communist.

    The next response was to understand and thank me, and by the way who would I be supporting. Well of course the answer is Tulsi!!!

    Funny how the Act Blue PAC shares information with competing campaigns.

     

    1. So now I get a text message from Bernie to join a canvassing effort in Arvada. I politely replied that Bernie is a Communist.

       The response was to explain that Bernie is a Democratic Socialist and bla, bla, bla, I responded politely that Bernie is a Communist.

       

      And Trump's a fascist.

    2. I've started getting fundraising mailings from the fascist in chief which shows how stupid Trump is.  My response is to put a bunch of rocks in the postage paid envelope and send it back.  Dumbasses.

      1. Trump is not smart enough to be a "fascist." Trump can be only as much as Vladimir Putin wants him to be.

        Remember Eric Trump's public statement in 2013: "we get all the money we need from Russia." Got to protect all those Russian loans to the Trump Organization.

      2. I, too, receive begging mailers from Trump, though a Republican in my household does not. I particularly liked today's version: The letter begins: " I put THREE LIVE POSTAGE STAMPS on the enclosed Rush Return Envelope because I had to get your immediate attention…"

        And sure enough there are three 1 cent stamps stuck to the "no postage necessary if mailed in the United States" envelope. 

        I just want to know what a "live" postage stamp is vs. a "dead" one. 

         

    3. Funny how ActBlue shares information with competing campaigns.

      Funny how Republicans just can’t understand cooperation for mutual benefit, instead of survival of the greediest and most ruthless,

       

      1. Oh, I understand "mutual cooperation" and also understand that kw/mj just can't resist more "digs" at Republicans.

        But, I don't complain about getting solicitations from other Dem candidates. Their stuff just goes, unopened, into the paper recycling bins at the post office.

  5. COLLINS: "I will vote in support of the motion to allow witnesses and documents to be subpoenaed."

    Wants "the House Managers and the President’s attorneys to attempt to agree on a limited and equal number of witnesses for each side."

    — Aaron Blake (@AaronBlake) January 31, 2020

    Almost certainly guarantees a 52-48 vote is coming. Maybe 51-49 with Romney getting some breathing room, too.

      1. There are rumors that Alexander was blackmailed. Kompromat is a useful tool. I just hope that we still have a society in which we can find out all the dirty details fifty years from now.

        1. What "rumors" are those, kwtree? Alexander is retiring at the end of the year and there has never been even a hint of scandal around his Senate tenure that I've heard.

          1. 2nd / 3rd hand info from folks with Washington, DC ties. No links. Rumors, as I wrote. Time will tell. Maybe all will be known when my granddaughter is old enough to vote. If we still have a constitutional democracy by then. If Washington, DC isn't seasonally flooded from climate change. If….

    1. Romney doesn't need the breathing room.

      If McConnell were really looking at the big picture, he's keep Romney in line and give the second "hall pass" to the vile Martha McSally or spineless Cory Gardner along with two minutes to give some hypocritical speech about the "importance of the process" or some other such nonsense.

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