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August 11, 2010 03:49 PM UTC

Wednesday Open Thread

  • by: Colorado Pols

“Confront them with annihilation, and they will then survive;

Plunge them into a deadly situation, and they will then live.

When people fall into danger, they are then able to strive for victory.”

–Sun Tzu


158 thoughts on “Wednesday Open Thread

  1. At least I think they’re final.  Haven’t spoken to the Elections Department yet this AM; don’t know what time they got out of there.  They had a slug of ballots delivered to Service Centers late and they all had to go through the verification process before they could be counted.


    Andrew Romanoff 2747 35.8%

    Michael F. Bennet 4645 60.6%


    Ken Buck 7201 37.5%

    Jane Norton 11531 60.0%


    Scott R. Tipton 10421 54.2%

    Bob McConnell 8162 42.5%


    Dan Maes 5242 27.3%

    Scott McInnis 13391 69.7%


    J. J. Ament 6240 32.5%

    Walker Stapleton 9306 48.4%


    Robert “Bob” Hislop 3966 43.1%

    Ray Scott 4604 50.0%

    HD54 includes several precincts in Delta County; these numbers are Mesa County only.

    Mesa County supported its “homies” Norton and McInnis over the Tea Party favorites, making those races closer than they would have been otherwise.

    I don’t know how McInnis did in Garfield County.

  2.  – VERY impressive turnout figures statewide, that’s the way primary elections should be. Way to go Colorado!

    – Hick ought to win fairly easily over Maes. Maes is just toooo ripe for parody: bicycles, anyone? Expect some more Hick missteps along the way, but the outcome should never be in doubt – with or without Tanc in the race.  

    – Bennet vs. Buck should be a GREAT race: a real bellwether (Obama-supported Dem incumbent vs. teaparty-supported Republican) for 2010’s national election narrative. We can look forward to a visit or two from Sarah Palin. Given Colorado’s relatively moderate electorate however, Bennet ought to prevail – though by a lesser margin than Hick.    

    – After he gets over his headache this morning, Scott McInnis may well end up being thankful he came up short last night. Unlike Andrew Romanoff, Scott’s not exactly broke, but he’s hardly capital W wealthy. If he did in fact write a $300,000 check last week to the Hasans, that would have put a serious ding in his personal net worth. He’s far better off keeping his lawyer/lobbyist day job for another four years than moving into the Guv’s mansion for peanuts.

        1. Recall that swing district CD-6 encompasses a lot of suburban Denver metro.

          Tom Tancredo has sound principles for job creation and fiscal management.

          Creating Jobs:

           1. Restore the business sales tax exemptions that were eliminated by the Ritter “Dirty Dozen” Tax hikes, the Senior Homestead Exemption, and roll back the mill levy freeze.

           2. Repeal the job-killing Business Personal Property Tax

           3. Revisit and revise harmful Ritter-era regulations, including the restrictive new oil and gas regulations

           4. Protect American workers (and help honest employers ensure that their employees are legally in the country) through the use of a mandatory workplace verification system such as E-Verify

          Fiscal Responsibility:

           1. Build a “zero- based” budget.

           2. Restore the limit on state spending.

           3. Achieve cost savings by contracting with the private sector, where appropriate, to carry out certain state services.

           4. Refuse federal dollars that come with unsustainable, long-term state spending commitments or harmful federal mandates.

          Secure Colorado:

           1. Implement tough new Arizona-style interior and employer enforcement laws.

           2. Withhold state funds from local governments that enact so-called “sanctuary policies”

           3. Oppose providing taxpayer subsidized in-state tuition benefits to illegal immigrants.

           4. Audit state and local government compliance with state immigration laws.

              1. Who’d ever argue with such a solid plan from such a solid man?

                Why not post that a couple of dozen more times today, because it looks better and better every time we see it.

                1. 1) Bullshitting that TT is from a “swing district,” implying that more than 2-3 especially racist dems ever voted for him. Way to peddle the obviously transparent bullshit, L-tard!

                  2) The creepy picture of TT. Do you have that poster-size in the basement of your mom’s house where you live with BJ as your roommate, L?

              2. You’re taking a real leap if you think that no one arguing with your inanities means that you won, or that you’ve got us now, or you’re right and we just can’t dispute your airtight case, or whatever is going on inside your fevered skull.

      1. That said, Hick’ll have to address the immigration issue, given its salience to Colorado voters.

        Having Joe Garcia on the ticket allows Hick to move to the middle on this one, not just pander to the Hispanic vote. That helps Hick with anglo independents.  

              1. I just think implying someone is a Klansman is beyond offensive.  

                Associating an idiot like Tancredo with the Klan burning a cross to me minimizes how evil the Klan was.

                    1. Tacredo is a loon.

                      His positions sometimes echo Klan sentiment.

                      But he is not a part of the Klan. And this kind of thing trivializes the Klan.

                    1. Don’t make the same mistake as froward and write them off as anything less. “Shitheads” is a being a bit kind as well as overly nonchalant, if you look at what they have been doing with their time and dime.

                      And let’s be clear, I’m not big on froward’s latest attempt at cleverness in photoshopping101.

                      Not with groups like the ones I wrote about that are deeply ingrained in our political system.  You’re absolutely right–it just ends up trivializing what they are doing and that’s a fool’s errand to make light of their brand of hate.

                      Plus, there’s so much material from Tancredo himself. Who really needs to make shit up?

                    2. .

                      What you insinuated was a racist rant clearly was not.  The guy included all groups of human beings he could think of, including Caucasians.  He was saying there should be less people of ALL categories, to make more room for wildlife.  

                      I don’t agree with the guy, but if you have to misrepresent what he said to make your case, maybe you don’t have a case.


                1. that the Klan didn’t consider Italian-Americans to be “white.”

                  Personally, I’m not that offended by the image, as I believe Tanc in his heart is a Hispanic-hating racist in this mold, and it’s also such an obvious fake that it’s hard to take even a bit seriously. But I see why you don’t like it.

                  1. I agree with you.  I think he is anti-hispanic.  But I don’t think it’s fair to infer someone’s in the Klan if they’re not.

                    Unfortunately I think there are a lot of Republicans that aren’t anti-hispanic but really want to see illegal immigration fixed, and they’re stuck being lumped in with Tancredo.

                    1. Unfortunately I think there are a lot of Republicans that aren’t anti-hispanic but really want to see illegal immigration fixed, and they’re stuck being lumped in with Tancredo.

                      My opinion is that few (if any) ‘pubs took the opportunity to rein him in when they could have. I think that GOP success in the first have of the previous decade had a lot to do with exploiting divisive social issues, and when Tanc came along reviving illegal immigration, the Party got behind it as another wedge issue. It’s why I tend to view the whole issue as more of a dog whistle than an issue anyone seriously wishes to address.

                    2. if one listens to what Tancredo says. then listen to what a Klansman says…

                      indistinguishable. other than the phrase “white power”.

                      seriously Tancredo’s  ramble at the tea bagger rally about “American culture”  is literally word for word off of the Ayrian nation website.

                      I did not mean to diminish the evil the Klan is, I do not think I did. I was merely pointing out how that evil is hand in hand with Tancredo’s belief system.

                    3. Have been since day one.  I don’t like Tancredo.

                      But I think it’s bad form to photoshop someone into a Klan picture.  

                      Did you run out of Nazi photos?

                      PS, I will never get back the 20 minutes I’ve spent with you on this.  I’m off to mourn.

          1. An obvious photoshopped image.

            Compared to an silly climate denier signature line.

            In either case, I draw similar conclusions about the intelligence of the poster.

            1. The Tancredo image is totally offensive, and photoshopped = false.

              My sig line is a reflection on one asshole scientist trying to eliminate scientific opposition to his theory.  It doesn’t mean that AGW isn’t happening (which I’ve said before). It’s a reflection on one asshole scientist politicizing scientific theory, and he deserves to be made fun of.

              Do you wake up in the morning ad grit your teeth about my sig line?  I’m starting to think you do, as much as you seem to obsess about it.

              Would it make you happy if I changed it?  

              I thought we actually had a fantastic discussion the last time about it and that you understood where I was coming from a little more.

              1. that your sig line says something about you. And it diminishes you in my mind.

                If that’s your intention, go nuts. If, on the other hand, you want to come off as sane (indeed, you come off as nearly brilliant when we have extended conversations) you might consider something else. Your choice (and I’m pro-choice).

                Frankly, I really don’t understand your intentions with this sig line. It does suggest you don’t understand how science is really done. For example, the current renaming of species as molecular data provides new information is a hugely passionate argument. Some pretty nasty things get said. Anytime you get people (and really smart people with egos) you will get vitriol at some point. (Read up on the explanations Linnaeus used to name species – he ripped on people that he didn’t respect!)

                But, I’m sure all other scientists are as pure as the driven snow.

                1. I think it just offended me that they’d be so arrogant.  Criticism of scientific theory is supposed to be sacrosanct, isn’t it?  Especially in a journal.  I just think a couple of the guys at the front of the AGW movement are shady assholes.  I don’t like the fact that Al Gore is now worth $98 million more than he was at the end of his term, lives in a huge mansion, flies all over and is lecturing me on how to live my life.

                  And I told you I’m pretty sure the science is sound.

                  Ah, It’s time for a new one, anyway.

                  1. Not in a democracy. Not in science.

                    Criticism is always an option. Saying outrageous things is always an option. It is AFTER the criticism or outrageousness that peer-review comes into play to weed out the ridiculous.

                    (I refuse to call some species by their currently accepted scientific names because, well, I am petty. I like the name I learned 20 years ago. It’s been just fine for over one hundred years. The new name is correct. I am a petty asshole and stick with the old names!)

                    Happy Day-After-Primary!

                    1. I guess I’m just an old dinosaur–a Brontosaurus in my case!

                        And what doofus decided to change the name of the straightforward Centigrade scale to Celsius?  

  3. It’s a tough thing to put it all out there on the line, get beat up every day. Thank you for putting yourself forward and entering the arena.

    I also want to say that Andrew Romanoff should be very proud of his vote total. Another 5% and he would have won – against an incumbent with 5 million dollars, active support from Obama, support from most of the major Democratic players in this state, etc. Amazing accomplishment by Speaker Romanoff and his team.

    1. because I know you’re being sincere. But when I saw the word “Condolences,” it reminded me of The Big Lebowski, when the Big Lebowski was yelling at the Dude, “Your revolution is over, sir! The bums lost! Condolences!” at their first meeting.

  4. Good job all. Now you get to go through 3 more months of having everyone call you every name in the book 🙂

    Senator Bennet – good luck.

    Ken Buck & Dan Maes – can’t say good luck so I’ll leave it at enjoy the good feelings today.

  5. I was trying to figure out what the key factor to winning was last night. And then it hit me – interviews with me!!!

    Dan Maes did interview, Scott McInnis did not – Dan Maes won.

    Ken Buck did interview (twice), Jane Norton did not – Ken Buck won (by more because it was 2 interviews).

    Michael Bennet did interview (twice for an hour each), Andrew Romanoff only did a single ½ hour interview – Michael Bennet won.

    Hey, it’s as good a theory as any.

    On a more sane note, I’m sending out interview requests to both Senate candidates and Maes & Tanc on the gov side (Hick has already accepted). So over the next month I should have interviews with each.

    1. Maes & Tanc . . . ?  

      (You’re in awfully fine humor this AM)

      Seriously, if you really want an interview with these either of these guys, I think you’re going to have to lose the appeal to “sane.”

      My suggestion would be to start your appeal by offering them both a fresh roll of Reynolds Wrap . . . extra heavy duty might be just the ticket.

      1. But at present I figure the three others are going to be easy Dem wins.

        If I were running the state GOP, I would put minimal effort in the state executive races, but keep an eye on them in case the polls show one of them competitive.

        I would focus on Buck, Gardner, and depending on the poll numbers, CD-6 & CD-7. And I would have them hammer repeatedly that unlike the Dems, the Repubs would address the job situation.

        Fortunately you guys have Dick Wadhams in charge so that’s the last thing he would be willing to do – and we appreciate that.

            1. The R’s get the gift of a reeeeeeeaaaally ugly Rangel ethics trial probably a month out from the election.  He is not going to go quietly into the night, judging from his 27 minute ‘I am not a crook!’ speech on the House Floor yesterday.

              The voters are already pissed at Congress, and Rangel’s (and Waters’) trials are going to be front and center in every R’s campaigning this fall.

              Mwah ah ah ah….

            2. There were a lot of Dems very surprised in ’94. If Congress continues to not address the jobs situation and the Republicans come up with a sellable argument that they will – we could see a lot of seats flip.

              1. – in the face of 100% GOP obstructionism.

                So you tell me: exactly what IS the ‘sellable GOP argument’ that they’re better re Jobs?

                I fully expect a largescale loss of Dem House (and some Senate) seats in November.

                But Colorado’s 3rd and 7th CDs won’t be among them.

                1. No. So that means they aren’t getting it done.

                  For some reason lots of Dems figure we get an A for effort and so we’ll get re-elected. I think the voters are concerned about results and will punish ineffective effort.

                  1. Am still waiting to hear your suggestion for the GOP’s job growth agenda.

                    Anyway, your headline argument is a classic counterfactual: we don’t/can’t know what the unemployment rate would be in the absence of the jobs programs the GOP has opposed in lockstep.

                    Fairly reasonable to assume however that without the Obama stimulus programs it would be well north of 9.5%  

                    1. Keep campaigning on this.

                      Fairly reasonable to assume however that without the Obama stimulus programs it would be well north of 9.5%

                      If they said it wouldn’t get above 8% with the stimulus, and it’s likely at 15%-16%, then people aren’t going to buy that the folks who duped us into the stimulus have any idea of what they’re doing or that they know where we’d be without Porkulus.

                      Dems have run Congress for four years and the White House for two.  The voting public isn’t going to buy the ‘blame Bush’ thing anymore.

                    2. Not only did the GOP blame Clinton for 9/11 well into W’s second term, but I remember Reagan blaming Carter for problems he hadn’t solved for so long that Carter eventually had to come out and tell him to knock it off. I believe that was after Ronnie’s reelection.

                      Is this another instance of IOKIYAR?

                    3. A lot of stuff actually IS Carter’s fault, still.

                      Just like my kids’ generation will be rightfully blaming Obama for scuttling our economy for decades.

                    4. then that means that the ‘pubs failed to fix things when they had the chance, so there’s little reason to think they’ll fix things now.

                      Besides, your kids are also going to spend their lives paying for weapons that haven’t done us even the tiniest bit of good.

                    5. No need to reach back to W to highlight GOP fecklessness. Plenty of that in the current House and Senate.

  6. Wonder if Maes will pick Penry as his Lt Gov. He almost has to in order to become half-assed viable.

    McInnis’ role in the 2010 elections will be directing all his oil-and-gas PAC $ to local county and state legislative races now that he couldn’t get elected to dog catcher. He could be particularly deadly in the GasLands of Western Colorado where oil-and-gas interests weigh heavily in county elections.

    1. I’d have him put Ali Hasan on the short list. Why?

      1. Dan has gotten this far by speaking to those who want someone other than the usual suspects. Putting someone approved by the Republican establishment kills his appeal.

      2. They can’t run two white guys. Especially the Republican party. They will get framed as the party of old white men.

      3. Ali speaks honestly. That fits perfectly with Maes who also speaks directly. There’s a lot of groaning here about the political mistakes of giving honest answers, but voters appear to like it.

      4. Ali can self fund if he’s on the ticket.

      I think Dan is in this to win it. We’ll all say he can’t, but we also said back in the Spring that he didn’t stand a prayer in the primary. He’s going to try to win.

      He can’t win if he plays it safe. A standard by the book campaign means an easy Hick win. Whoever he picks, it’s got to be someone who plays to Maes’ strengths.

        1. It is true that I’m spending considerable time in California with my film career – I am keeping my address and home in Colorado (and I still spend great amounts of time in our good State) for now, but that could also change as we move forward

          My last film, RABIA, won around 36 awards and was screened at around 85 film festivals – I’m very Blessed as that put me on the map in the indie film circles – the current movie were developing ‘BENAZIR,’ a biopic on Benazir Bhutto, has already won three awards for the screenplay and as of now, I’m working with some terrific people in putting a financing plan together – of note, RABIA was my thesis project when I was getting my Masters in Film Directing from Chapman University

          Jumping into the State Treasurers race was always a very difficult decision (and I reason why I jumped in so late), because Hollywood opportunities hardly ever come for young filmmakers, but between loving Colorado, loving my family, and believing strongly in the idea that the State Investments shouldn’t be with bailout companies, I jumped in – in the long term, I was hoping that one State Treasurer, aggressively announcing his intention to divest from bailout companies, would start a fiscal conservative chain reaction around the country of ending government bailouts, or at least being part of the fire that would help get us to that point – that was worth it to delay, if not sacrifice, a potential film directing career

          At the Assembly, JJ Ament advocated for keeping the funds in bailout companies and we negatively attacked his pro-Ref C & D past, as well as financial statements showing income from CitiGroup subsidiaries, despite his quotes of wanting to maintain massive amounts of Colorado monies with CitiGroup – we promised to be anti-bailout – he didn’t, and if anything, basically promised to keep the status quo

          We held Doug Bruce’s endorsement up high – he held Bill Owens’s endorsement up high

          The result? We didn’t make the ballot…

          As I was leaving the parking lot of the Budweiser Events Center in Loveland that night, contemplating… and mind you, I like to think that I’m not a dumb person… to me, the Convention was a small window of where a political career would lie, should I continue investing my time with the Colorado GOP – I won’t say much more than that

          At that point, I went home, called my agent, asked if a film deal was still in the talks – she excitedly said “yes” and she’d love to have me back in LA… drove my suv out to Los Angeles and haven’t looked back

          I severely doubt that Maes would ask (and thank you so much to David for mentioning me as a suggestion, as I take that as a strong compliment) – I would still love to help the Party, but if I say “no” a second time to the people out here who are helping with BENAZIR, then that could be the end of any future film directing career…. I ran, got my message out and made a contribution… I can sleep well at least knowing that

  7. Check your ego at the door. In private conversations I saw two cases (one Democratic, one Republican; one winning team, one losing) where decisions were made because the individual was pissed, not because the decision was what was best for the candidate. And I’m sure there were many other cases.

    When you work for a candidate, especially when you’re one of the top people on the campaign, emotional reactions are an unaffordable luxury. Suck it up and do your job.

  8. Gee, I wonder why

    U.S. District Court Judge William Alsup of Northern California, in his 90-page ruling Tuesday, said Wells Fargo used “a bookkeeping device” that turned one instance of overdrawing an account into as many as 10, allowing the bank to multiply the number of fees it could collect from a single mistake.

  9. From CNN

    Stocks slid Wednesday after a wider U.S. trade gap and downbeat foreign data cast doubt on overseas demand for American goods.

    The Dow Jones industrial average (INDU) tumbled 222 points, or 2.1%, and the Nasdaq (COMP) sank 64 points, or 2.8%. The S&P 500 (SPX) fell 28 points, or 2.5%.

    You don’t have to like it but the economy and unemployment will determine who wins in November.

          1. Generally in a situation like this people are voting “the present team isn’t solving it, the others might.” And that actually is a logical response.

            My guess is we’ll get generic platitudes on jobs from the Republicans, and that will be enough. Remember Clinton didn’t win with a 10 point plan for the economy, he won with “it’s the economy stupid.”

            1. But I think that the meltdown occurring on Bush’s watch is still a recent enough memory that people aren’t just going to hand them the ball for that reason alone. The GOP have some serious spinning and lying to do to get people to blame the Dems that much.

              But it depends on how smart the Dems play this. I believe the GOP has given them more than enough material to work with, from obstructionism to no plan of their own to overestimating how many people don’t like health care reform or misinterpreting the reasons why many do.

              The GOP is going to have to tell people what they offer instead. I’ve already voiced suspicion that they do have one but are waiting to make an October surprise of it, cynical bastards that they are. But if they don’t, just being “the other team” won’t garner them that many votes.

              1. I have a different view, Ari – think that if the R’s were going to proffer a comprehensive “we’re not Obama” platform, a la 1994’s Contract With America, the roll-out would have to happen circa Labor Day.

                To your broader point, I think that a whole lot of people out there are in a world of hurt due to the sucky economy. They’re P.O.’ed bigtime.

                Given Americans’ short-term memories, and a penchant for wanting quick & easy solutions, I think the Dems will pay a heavy price.

                Even if a lot of the past 18 months has been about cleaning up W’s doo-doo.

                Question for you: As things now stand, do you think the Dems lose:

                a) House

                b) Senate

                c) neither

                d) both

                My guess is, in order: c,a,d.

                1. was introduced six weeks prior to the election, per what I found online, so make that late September. I think that counts as an October Surprise, although that’s usually a term reserved for springing some scandal on a candidate.

                  We’ll see what the ‘pubs have and have not. I can’t quite answer your challenge because, besides whether the GOP has a plan to sell or not, another unknown is whether the Dems can play this right. I think they should hammer the ‘pubs for their obstruction and their own lack of ideas, and if the ‘pubs produce a plan, the Dems should hammer them for not coming up with it sooner. That would really be playing politics with people’s lives.

            2. “It’s the economy stupid” was not a campaign slogan; it was a purely internal thing that got out. Clinton DID lay out an economic plan, and it was a centerpiece of his campaign.

    1. The economy stinks – and will continue to stink for at least 6-12 months, maybe 3-5 years, as we go through a necessary deleveraging cycle.

      True, the stench would be far worse were it not for the various Obama stimulus packages. But Dems nationally will get hammered in 12 weeks’ time. Just not in Colorado, apparently.

      Anyone who ‘investing’ long term in this market is loopy. At these lofty levels, it’s only good for trading: buying VIX on Monday would have yielded a ~15% gain though today.

  10. Seems a bit silly becuase I do not think there is anyway they can get Maes to drop out. So not sure what they drafted him for. I guess just to keep the Republican efforts even less focussed.

  11. PDS is a very real and terrifying disease.

    A New Hampshire candidate for the state house is taking heat from the state Republican Party after he wrote on a Facebook thread  that he wishes former Alaska governor Sarah Palin and the father of her grandson were in the plane crash that killed former Sen. Ted Stevens in Alaska on Monday.

    “Just wish Sarah and Levy (sic) were on board,” wrote Keith Halloran, a Democratic candidate for Cheshire County House District 7, referencing Palin and Levi Johnston, the on-again, off-again boyfriend of her daughter.

    (Link to story in Daily Caller).

        1. If LB thinks this is anything more than run-of-the-mill assholery (like people don’t express sentiments like this about politicians all the time), well, I don’t know what to say.

                1. “run-of-the-mill” assholery. All kinds of options with that.  Mediocre assholery. Exceptional assholery. Tea Party assholery.  I love it.

        2. If LB thinks this is anything more than run-of-the-mill assholery (like people don’t express sentiments like this about politicians all the time), well, I don’t know what to say.

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