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November 11, 2009 04:49 PM UTC

Veterans Day Open Thread

  • 87 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols



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87 thoughts on “Veterans Day Open Thread”

  1. Well, according to the Post article on the CCU Senate ‘debate’

    http://www.denverpost.com/ci_1…

    Buck disapproves of separation of church and state

    Wiens wants an arbeitrary limit on the length of a bill:

    Wiens vowed to advocate for changes in Congress that would make government more accessible and more trustworthy, such as limiting bills to 100 pages and one subject.

    Seriously?  Why not 75 pages, or 250?   Does this include appropriations?  

    Norton, predictably, attacked Washington money-grabbers.  I presume she meant the Dems on Capitol Hill rather than her buddies on K-Street.

    1. Buck doesn’t understand?   There will be no establishment of religion on the part of the government is pretty clear as is the ban on restricting religion.

      People can quibble that there is nothing directly demanding separation of church and state in those exact words but if the government isn’t allowed to establish an official state religion nor ban any religion, then you don’t need those exact words.  

      Those two prohibitions together mean that the government isn’t allowed to have any official role in our religious lives.  Period. They clearly prohibit any joining of any church, group of churches or body of religious teachings with the state.

      There is no clause that says the state is allowed to establish even general Judeo-Christian traditions so we already have less separation of church and state than the amendment calls for as a concession to the majority. What on earth are people like Buck complaining about? His religious views already enjoy a degree of government endorsement to which they aren’t really entitled.  Isn’t that enough for him?  

    2. limiting bills to one topic, our nation would be a lot better off. And only so many bills per session.

      Of course, that would destroy a lot of playing and power.

  2. From our neighbor to the north…

    http://www.jhnewsandguide.com/…

    Finally, the commissioners called on the Environmental Protection Agency to conduct a comprehensive study of the effects of hydraulic fracturing on underground drinking water sources.

    The county commissioners’ action prompted the president of the Petroleum Association of Wyoming to call commissioners “a bunch of environmental wackos” in the Casper Star-Tribune.

    Teton County Chairman Hank Phibbs said the board is simply asking for information so local health care professionals can better treat workers injured in Sublette’s gas industry.

    “We’re really asking, ‘Please, disclose what kinds of chemicals workers may have been involved with when he comes up here injured,'” Phibbs said. “We want to protect our emergency services people, protect our health care workers and provide more effective treatment.”

        1. for those that gave their lives, those that could have and those that supported both to defend freedom.

          The military function, the sole reason we established our federal government.

          1. ” The military function, the sole reason we established our federal government.”

            ?

            We the people of the United States, in Order to 1) form a more perfect union 2) establish justice 3) insure domestic tranquility 4) provide for the common defence, 5) promote the general welfare and 6) secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this constitution for the United States of America.

            If however, by sole reason you mean one of six I’m with ya.

              1. The Constitution was written precisely because your minimalist fantasy of the role of the Federal government failed.

                Grab a history book–it was called the Articles of Confederation.

                I like principled conservatives: I loathe uninformed idiots.

                  1. and so is Lib about “formed up well”, which obviously predated the constitution.

                    However, I noticed there are multiple reasons for the articles of confederation as well, not just the military function (which was his main point), including:

                    asserting the equality of each state within the confederation

                    establishing freedom of movement

                    allocates one vote to each state

                    etc, etc.

                    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A…

    1. Is offering free entree to Vets. You have to bring some proof. Out Back is offering free app. The last WWII Vet in the family recently passed away but we still have our Vietnam Vet and we’re going to take advantage of the freebie. It ain’t haute cuisine but it’s free.

      Thanks to all our Vets, those still with us and those now gone, and to all who gave their lives before they could become Vets.

      1. But Applebees just might be swamped today. From their website:

        “Due to the tremendous public response this Veterans Day, you may experience a delay in accessing applebees.com. We apologize for any inconvenience and invite you to visit your neighborhood Applebee’s to participate in this program.”

        1. is offering both vets and active military free movies today. (Just in case you get sick of waiting in line at Applebees–might as well drive up here and treat yourself to a free movie.)  

        3. Dan got me thinking so I called the Applebees nearest me.  It was lunch time and when I finally got someone to answer the phone, he said that they had been slammed all day and there was an hour to hour and a half wait!

            1. Called around 4:30 PM and was told the waiting lines were still out the door and waiting times estimated at an hour to an hour and a half, as had been the case all day!  My Vet is way too type A for that and shares your view on lines.  But it was very nice thing for Applebees to do.

  8. ….stop thanking Veterans for their service. Most of the OIF/OEF vets I know hate it when people say that.

    One has the best retort of all time – “Stop thanking me for my service – DO SOMETHING with it.”

      1. “As we express our gratitude, we must never forget that the highest appreciation is not to utter words, but to live by them.”  ~John Fitzgerald Kennedy

    2. One of the hardest things to resolve is being thanked for something that you did not do for fame, glory or money.

      When I was in most of us were either in to avoid the draft, avoid the recession, and for a good number of the others a sense of patriotism and sense of duty.  I was in the Air Force so we had no draftees, we were 100% volunteer.

      Are you wondering what you can do for vets?

      Donate games and puzzles to the VA long term care facility or the retirement facility.

      Volunteer at the VA hospital (which is something every politician should do).

       Contact a veterans organization and volunteer to help their members who need some help.

       Offer to drive for those who can’t drive anymore.

       Offer to take vets out to sport events or plays or whatever.

       Find jobs for vets.

      2. Help vets find jobs.  

        I’ve always believed in preferences for vets.  They still exist in civil service, but they don’t exist elsewhere (unless you include the DOD procurement cycle).

        If you are an employer and you get a resume from a vet, give it a second look.  Remember service personal have a skill that many don’t have: they are educable.  The military trains people to do incredibly complex things that the service member had no prior experience with.

        So even if their resume isn’t an exact match, they stand a good chance of adapting, learning and achieving.

      1. 1) They’re heard it too many times so far. We need a new line for that, so civilians have something to say.

        2) Most of them don’t think it’s sincere. In that, not that the person doesn’t mean it AT THAT MOMENT, but that no one gave a shit while they were in The Suck.

        Common phrase on that ‘The American Military is at War, America is at the Mall.”

          1. Then may I say in all sincerity, “much, much thanks” to you, PoliceSquad. I’ve been wanting to all day but after seeing Dan’s comment, I didn’t want to say something that would offend. I know I speak for a lot of folks when I tell you that most of us that express our gratitude absolutely mean it, from the bottom of our hearts.

  10. And (sometimes) God DAMN their asinine civilian leaders!

    Not advocating for military rule- just smarter civilians.  As I’ve said on this post many times- the BEST way to avoid war is to pass a law that says if the Congress approves the use of troops (peace-keeping, police action, war, etc.) then EVERY son or daughter of a certain age of those in Congress must MANDITORILY serve.

    Put a little skin in the game and then let’s see what decisions with life and death these civilians make in our name…  

    1. for congress just taking back their constitutional right to be the ones in charge of declaring wars instead of handing it off to the President and avoiding any responsibility for the consequences. I’d be happy with no troops going anywhere unless congress officially declares war.  

      Before Bush sent us to Iraq in the first place, 75% in polls were against it. If congress hadn’t had the option of just handing it off to Bush, if they had been faced with the responsibility of declaring war as they were meant to, that level of opposition might have made them stop and think

        1. (can’t remember which talking head) Lincoln never asked General McCLellan to write a report advising him on whether or not to pursue the Civil War.  No general is ever going to say a war is unwinnable or that more troops aren’t needed. Their whole job is to be winners of wars, they always want more troops and will never admit to any doubt that they can get the job done if given enough resources. Whether or not it’s a job anyone ought to be doing in the first place to advance our national interests is not their area of expertise.

          The military should only advise the civilian government on how they believe they can achieve the military goals set by that government once the choice has been made to use miltary means to achieve a foreign policy goal.  Period. Their skill set and career goals make them supremely unqualified and their judgement highly suspect for the purpose of making policy decisions.  

          Obama is on the right track in apparently now recognizing that just listening to the generals on the ground is no way to make decisions about our national interests.  

  11. Politico reported that Speaker Pelosi only obtained about 6-10 votes for the health care bill by including the abortion amendment.  Previously, it was noted that Rep. Betsy Markey was allowed a “pass” on the health care vote since the Dems already had the 218 votes needed for passage.  Now, it appears that the true cost of allowing Markey to vote “no” on the bill is the inclusion of the abortion amendment which may end up derailing the entire bill.

    When are we going to learn that playing politics by not voting your convictions always ends up biting you in the rear-end?  Markey’s “no” vote on the health care bill will not win her any Republicans or Independents, and will demoralize her Democratic base.  Standing up for your principles is the only way to be respected as a politician.

    1. Oh, this’ll be embarrassing. I always thought it had something to do with Iwo Jima, which I believe is in the Phillippines. The Fall of some kind of Hill I think.

      Googling tells me I’m wrong.

      2. This is a statute representing the famous flag raising on Mt. Sarabachi (sp?), but given the trees in the background it is not on the atoll.

        I’d guess DC and I’d guess the new WWII memorial.

        Now I’ll google it.

      3. .

        just outside the North gate of Fort Myer, in Rosslyn/ Arlington, VA.  

        The two times I ran the USMC Marathon it was the finish point, back in 81 & 82.  

        It’s a place where gays used to meet on Friday nights, and my soldiers would go down there to beat them up for fun.  

        It was also the turn-around point for the 5 km run on Organization Day for The Old Guard in the Spring, 1981.  Thanks to Major Mark Tiberi, the consummate parade field soldier (zero time in the field, zero knowledge of fieldcraft, zero integrity,) I won that race but was disqualified for going around that Monument in the wrong direction.  

        The race happened within a couple months of when I joined the unit.  I ran/ trained on my own, usually through ANC, down to Memorial Bridge, around the Lincoln Memorial and back.  I often would get up on the banister at the edge of the bridge and jog on that.  It was almost 24 inches wide.  To one side, 4 feet down, sidewalk.  To the other, 80 feet down, the Potomac.  

        Nobody in the unit knew that I was a competitive runner.  Several months earlier, in Korea, I placed 2nd in the 2nd Infantry Division  Organization Day 8-mile race (“Round the Horn,” for anyone who served at Camp Casey/ TDC.)  Only my Company Commander was faster.  That was in 1980, after Carter had decided that the US wouldn’t participate in the Moscow Olympics.  The Army Track Team was disbanded and the officers in the team became Infantry Officers.  My first Company Commander in Korea was Keith Cromartie, world class hurdler.  My second was Denny Trujillo, from Pueblo, who made the US Olympic Team as a marathoner, running for USMA.  

        The course map for the TOG 5K used in the pre-race briefing ended at the Gate, and the Monument was several hundred meters beyond the edge of he map.  Since I was pretty fat, the officer briefing the course never considered I might be the fastest runner in the Battalion, and told me to just follow whoever was in front of me, after I asked about how to navigate around the Monument.

        I’d suggested I might be so far back that I couldn’t see the next runner, and he said – in front of 30 witnesses – to just make a loop around the Monument, the one in the picture.

        When I got to the Gate, the guy in second place was several hundred yards back, so I just headed straight for the Monument and ran around it.  Tiberi had been hiding in the bushes to catch any “cheaters,” and came out running toward meand screaming that I had cheated, then jumped in a Jeep to race to the finish line.  When I got there, 5 minutes before the guy in second place, I learned just what The Old Guard was about, and it wasn’t integrity or fair play.  Not a single officer in the Battalion would stand up for me, not even my Company Commander.

        The Lieutenant who briefed the course route off the map that ended at the gate, and who told me to just follow the guy ahead, denied that he had said that.   He also denied telling me to just make a loop around the Monument any way I wanted.  

        I have a pretty bad memory, but I sure remember the Marine Corps Memorial.

        .  

        1. What I remember is how most officers had a few buddies and a hell of a lot of enemies in the corp……Military needs a war and w/o a war, they fall on each other and fight….

          Doesn’t lessen the sacrifice or the necessity, just means being trained to kill on command and then  being subject to that command coming from men you don’t like or respect is hell on the soul…….

  14. Apparently losing to him by 20+ points a few years ago didn’t dissuade him.  With Loony Tunes the heroic Tom Tancredo jumping into the Gov’s race and three GOPer slugging it out in the 3rd CD (with the new favorite already having been seriously spanked by the incumbent) 2010 could be fun.

    Thank you Mr. Tipton–I don’t really care for you as my Rep anyways–and Mr. Tancredo.

    http://www.denverpost.com/ci_1…  

    2.    It was actually closer to a two-to-one majority for Salazar.  

        I don’t understand why Tipton is throwing away a relatively safe state House seat.

      1. Salazar got 67% of the vote in 2006, and he got a little more than that in 2008–against Wayne ‘Who’ Wolf (who is challenging my Sen., Gail Schwartz, this time around).

        So in 2006 it was probably closer to 30 points.

        They read the GJ TeaBag Times and think that the comments blasting Salazar actually represent the majority of sentiment–they believe that Rio Blanco, Delta, Mesa counties reflect the 3rd CD as a whole, forgetting about San Miguel, Pitkin, Gunnison, La Plata, etc.  NOt to mention Pueblo.  

        Even places like the dark red counties mentioned above have a Dem base of around 30% that votes consistently.  

        Places like San Miguel and Pitkin have a Dem base nearly twice that, although the dependable turnout is probably closer to 55-60%.

        Pueblo has a strong Dem base,  Gunnison and La Plata are more mixed, but overall the 3rd CD is probably about 30-35/30/35-40 D/I/R.  Thus to win one needs to get about 2/3 of the independents, which have proven reliably that they are OK with JS.

        TeaBaggers–none of whom have ever voted for JS–claim that his vote for ‘ObamaCare’ has doomed him, even though JS office reports that the majority of constituent contact he got on the issue supported the House reform.

        I don’t see a Tipton path to victory here.  

  15. .

    El Paso County had a free H1N1 Clinic today, and ran out of …. customers.

    They had 3,000 doses, and only 1,800 people showed up.

    I saw this on the Gazette website, but then read that they will only give it to folks in the targeted groups, so I didn’t go.  

    Healthy adults and folks over 64 cannot get vaccinated at the free clinics until younger people get vaccinated first.

    .  

  17. …but Lavish, a downtown Denver nightclub at 15th & Market is having a Veterans Day Guest Night from 630-9pm. Turns out the owner is a vet, and wanted to do something.

    All vets of all eras welcome….but I suspect that the young punks/punkettes will be in force.

    EVERYTHING is 50% off – drinks, food whatever. Just bring something that shows your vet status – ID card, Service organization card, or a photo of you in uniform.

    Still wondering about the connection of military service and alcohol…but I’ll decide that after I have a few Old Fashioneds.

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