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"Schaffer Family Values" On Facebook Display?

by: Colorado Pols

Mon Aug 04, 2008 at 13:47:33 PM MDT


Some of you may remember that back in May, photos of Governor Bill Ritter's son August hosting a party for friends at the Governor's Mansion (with beer prominently featured) made their way from the online social networking site Facebook into the pages of the Denver Post, as well as local TV news. Republican-leaning blogs and pundits enjoyed poking fun at the various 'unseemly' angles of the story for a few days, before it blew over since apparently no persons were harmed during the taking of said photos.

The incident revisited something that most people know these days: the "private" material on these social networking sites really isn't private at all, and indiscrete bits of information posted in these forums can come back to haunt the person doing the posting--especially when that person (or in August Ritter's case, his dad) is in the public eye.

With that in mind, you may have heard something in the last few days about one of GOP Senate candidate Bob Schaffer's kid's Facebook pages. We're aware the scoop is making its way around, and we were anonymously forwarded this link over the weekend:

http://schafferfamilyvalues.com/

It appears to be a mirror of Bob Schaffer's son Justin Schaffer's (age 20) Facebook profile, and it appears to host a few questionable images of its own. Some, it turns out, with a much more obvious political implication than August Ritter's kegger.

Colorado Pols :: "Schaffer Family Values" On Facebook Display?

We should note that this isn't the "live" Facebook page for Justin Schaffer, since you have to have "friended" him to see his profile. But it looks like one of a couple of versions of it that we've seen, both with these same images posted to his profile--meaning one of his "friends" mirrored the page and started sending it around. Some of the illustrations on the page are garden-variety freerepublic.com jokes. Others, such as the Barack Obama/Count Chocula collage you see above, might be a little harder to explain away benignly. Some noteworthy images displayed by Schaffer include:

  

A couple of points to consider while you evaluate this: Justin Schaffer has written a letter or two in support of his father's campaign we were able to find, and all of Bob Schaffer's children are featured prominently on his campaign website and TV spots (Justin was one of the smiling kids seen popping out of Mt. McKinley). However, we haven't heard it alleged that Justin is working for his father's election campaign in any meaningful capacity.

But neither was Bill Ritter's kid, and yet reporters found his kegger surprisingly newsworthy. Is turnabout fair play? And what does this sort of distasteful political stuff say about, as this site's name baits you to ask, Schaffer family values?
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"Schaffer Family Values" On Facebook Display? | 125 comments
it looks like the apple doesn't rot far from the tree
   Maybe Bob will have to send the kids off the Marianas Islands til after the election. He's able to generate enough embarrassing remarks on his own without his peanut gallery chiming in with their two cents.  
Gotta make one point here
90% of why kids do this sort of thing is to get a rise out others, especially "adults". The fact that everyone here is so indignant shows that it's an effective tool. We've all played into his hand, as it were.

What portion of this board's sermonizing is heartfelt, and how much of it is political opportunism is hard to say.

The argument could be made that he's shown himself to be insensitive to other's feelings and to PC-ness in general, but I have a very hard time believing that this kid is a serious proponent of slavery, or Count Chocula, or of Jesus shooting off an uzi.

But that's just my two cents.

[ Parent ]
"What portion of this board's sermonizing is heartfelt, and how much of it is political opportunism is hard to say. "
...sounds like both portions add up to something alarming.  Neither is all that good, is it.
[ Parent ]
Nope
Not really.  
[ Parent ]
Slavery gets shit done?
explains Bob's Marianas policy.

Reality is the kid is just your typical Young Republican.

Misyoginist, racist, homophobic, classist just waiting for an opportunity to violate the constitution in a job they are unqualified to do or to steal tax payer money as a corporate lobbyist.

No surprise, not really news.

Someone should ask Bob whether he and his grownup supporter son talked about that
in the context of the Marianas... Fair game!
[ Parent ]
No he's not.
That crap is over the top. It's as representative of young R's as much as the BushHitlerMcChimpyHalliburton shit is of young D's.

Maybe not even as much, right, Go Blue?

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
You're right
That shit Schaffer's son put on his website is way over the top, just like his extremist father.

And don't drag me into this as your straw-man since you have no other real argument to make here.  

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
Except that
You're every bit the hateful silly person that apparently Scheaffer's son is, just from the other side.  

Yin to Yang.  

Shmoke to pancake.

Just as irrelevant, thankfully.

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
This perfectly exemplifies your stupidity.
Comparing ANYTHING that our friend Go Blue writes on this site to what was found associated with Schaefer's son is completely assinine. You're a hopeless case.
I'm not being snide. You are hopeless.

"I can tolerate chaos, I'm just not sure chaos can tolerate me" Dylan
[ Parent ]
I'll second that, Sir R

[ Parent ]
More smoke
What's the Yang to advocating for slavery? You're fucking craziness is showing and everyone on this blog can see it. To be an apologist for Schaffer's son who thinks "slavery" is funny, shows a lot about your own extremist views.

Sorry asshole, I won't be your scapegoat.  

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
Gee, what a shock
That the two least civil posters on the site are coming to each others' defense.

Yes, the slavery thing is idiotic, ignorant, and insensitive.

I'm not apologizing for him, I'mSo s condemning him, you tools.

His ignorance, however, is no larger than your own hateful, horrid rhetoric that you post daily.  So, see?  You guys and Scheaffer's son are peas in a pod.  Sophomoric, ignorant children.


"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
Pathetic
Stop using me in your pathetic attempts to inoculate Schaffer's bigortry. Why couldn't you simply leave me out it, if I'm as irrelevant as you claim, and simply said, "Schaffer's son is bigot like Ann Coulter and I think he gives other republicans a bad name."

Like I said, your straw-man argument is pathetic.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
so you're saying...
We should not elect either Bob Schaffer or Go Blue's father? I can get behind that. Who is Go Blue's father?
[ Parent ]
Schaffer's son who thinks "slavery" is funny
   Next month, he'll probably be sharing non-PC views on the Holocaust with the world.
  Bob, do us all a favor and focus on your damn family!
[ Parent ]
Fair game
This is a 20-year-old man who has written a letter of support for the candidate and who has appeared in his campaign video.

Now, the "WWRJD" with Lord and Savior hoisting a Kalashnikov does seem to be sarcastic - and presumably the "slavery" picture was meant to be sarcastic as well - giving Justin the benefit of the doubt. But as the New Yorker has demonstrated, irony and sarcasm gets lost in the blogosphere.

It's not a big deal, but I don't expect to see any more letters of support from grown son Justin!

Reminds me of a headline in The Onion
"Asshole father proud of his asshole son"

" Is there a way to delete your own comments? " bjwilson83
[ Parent ]
It is a big deal
If anything it shows a young man who was raised in a political family who has a callous and repugnent attitude toward slavery.  After four hundred years of slavery, Jim Crowe laws and racist attitudes you would think he would have the intelligence, and training at home, not to post something like this, especially when his father is running for a high profile public office. Apparently, he is proud of his attitudes, including the antithesis of the words in the Declaration of Independence that states "all men are created equal."

We should not deceive ourselves because this man is only 20 years old. This is another example of the dark underbelly of the Republican-religious right and their drive to make ugly, racist values part of the mainstream again.      

[ Parent ]
You said it so well, Republican 36
I was wondering what it says about a candidate, the candidate's adult child (a 20 year old is an adult, unless the 20 year old wants to buy a beer ... and considering the alcohol related graphics/comments on young Schaffer's page, one is also compelled to make the assumption that he engages in underage drinking, but I digress) and the candidate's campaign manager that they did not realize that FaceBook and MySpace pages are so easily found and shared?

Why does the word "stupid" keep coming to mind when the Schaffer campaign is the topic?

[ Parent ]
Stupid is
as stupid does. Is that the Schaffer family motto?

Normally I would suggest leaving the kids out of it, but since young Big Oil here decided to inject himself into the world of politics with his radical views like his fathers, he's really brought this on himself.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
how many kids dos B.S. and his wife have?
   Wadhams is gonna have his hands full this election cycle keeping tabs on everything the candidate, his wife, and their offspring might happen to say.
  Multiple possible "Macaca Moments" coming this fall to Colorado!  
[ Parent ]
Five offspring total
The rest are girls, older twins and two younger girls.
[ Parent ]
I'll bet Ann Coulter is the Godmother to the girls!

[ Parent ]
I know I would be deeply ashamed
if our adult child were to think slavery and racism are a hoot.   Our adult child, however, wasn't exposed to that kind of attitude in our home or among the people we choose to associate with.  

When the stray relative made racist or ethnic "jokes" or derogatory remarks we  said it was ignorant and wrong, that it's great that we live in a country with many different kinds of people, that it would be so boring if we all came from exactly the same background and that different is interesting and fun, not threatening.  

Ours also has always had too many friends from too many different backgrounds who wouldn't be amused. If there's a connection there, then it's one of the things we managed to do right.  

[ Parent ]
Bravo
That's the goal with your kids, isn't it? Enough diversity that they are confused by prejudice?

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  
[ Parent ]
I think your Rosetta Stone is a bt off...
...your translation of what BlueCat wrote bears little resemblance to the original.  Perhaps there's a conversation you're having with BlueCat that the rest of us can't observe?  Sneaky Boy!
[ Parent ]
Who said anything about "confused", LB?
Lumping whole groups of people together in categories with "us" being the only good category and all of the "thems"  being inferior and threatening is truly stupid and limiting and keeps you from experiencing lots of wonderful people and cultures. Knowing how stupid  and limiting that is doesn't make you "confused by prejudice".  It does the opposite.  It allows you to know how NOT to be confused by prejudice. It allows you to be free to have a much richer life.  
[ Parent ]
What's your example
of my use of "us" and "them"?

I agreed wholeheartedly and without sarcasm with your post.  As I do with this one.

My point may be misunderstood.  I always made a point of exposing my oldest daughter to many, many different kinds of people and never needed to discuss any differences between any of all of us.  My friend isn't a "black guy", he's a "bass player".  Anyone that would bring up the differences between us might confuse my kid - after all, he's a "bass player".  What's different?

Does that make more sense?

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
In a Colbert "I don't see race" sort of way.

[ Parent ]
And I was using "you"
where it would actually be proper to use "one' but that always sounds so pretentious.
[ Parent ]
I understood, I think.
If you knew me, you'd probably have more context.

Thanks for the civil conversation.

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
You persuaded me
After reading your response, I have to admit I think you're right. It IS a bigger thing than Ritter's son having a beer party.

Thanks.

[ Parent ]
Just the fact
that his dad is getting his ass whipped over slave labor protectionism in the Mariana Islands, that he's so tone deaf that a button like this would be amusing or in any way appropriate:




[ Parent ]
Ironically,
most Egytologists now think the pyramids were built by civilians during the non-farming months.  Sort of a WPA...

"Fair wages get things done."

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd." -Bertrand Russell

[ Parent ]
Kalashnikov ?
.
That's a Colt product depicted in the poster, my friend.  
.
[ Parent ]
Absolutely Fair Game.
Schaffer is running as a "family values" candidate, so it seems only natural to see just how well his version of "family values" has transferred to his own family.

Looks like he has raised a clean cut, white supremicist little thug.  In otherwords, a prototypical young republican!

"But when I see a 9-11 victim family on television, or whatever, I'm just like, 'Oh, shut up!' I'm so sick of them because they're always complaining."  Glenn Beck  

Anal fixation much?
First Wadhams with his "shove it up his ass" comment and now this? Are we supposed to believe that everyone Schaffer surrounds himself with is a thug but Schaffer is not?

Non impediti ratione cogitationis.

"Some of the people that wanted to engage me in conversation appeared to have been the losers in the 'Are you smarter than Michele Bachmann contest?'." --Rep. Barney Frank

Gee, 349 photo's of himself?
Nothing egocentric about this jerk.  I do like the one of him with the halos though.
Hmmm
I'd be careful going after the little twerp too much. That worked so well when Edwards called out Cheney's lesbian daughter in the 2004 VP debate. Or, rather, Republican strategists hammered Edwards' "attack" relentlessly, turning the debate story into a referendum on "picking on" a candidate's adult child. It wouldn't surprise me if Wadhams has been distributing the mirror site, just to provoke that attack and response.
Someone advocating slavery
is a completely different issue, especially since it's something his father agrees with.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole
[ Parent ]
I agree
the kid is a smart-ass thug, and his bigotry is fair game. Just saying, don't be surprised if it's a set-up, or at the very least, if Wadhams doesn't have an impressive response ready once one of the dailies runs with it.
[ Parent ]
nobody thought it unfair to criticize Neil Bush when his daddy was running for office in '88
   IIRC, the problem with John Edwards' comment about Mary Cheney was that the GOP, as is its tradition, wanted to have it both ways.  
  Mary Cheney was already "out of the closet" (she brought her lover to the 2000 GOP convention, and I distinctly recall seeing Alan Simpson interviewed on CNN as to whether Mary's same sex partner would be sitting with the Cheney family at the convention), but Dick and Lynne objected to someone else commenting about their daughter's no-longer-secret sexual orientation when it was brought up in a political campaign by an opposition candidate in '04.
  It wasn't really an invasion of privacy since Mary had already "outed" herself.  
[ Parent ]
Edwards' mere mention of Mary Cheney's existence
was well within bounds and made a valid point. But that didn't stop the echo chamber from manufacturing unction and hijacking the post-debate analysis based on the comment.

Will attacks on Cap'n Bootyplunder (as one of his friends calls Justin) meet the same fate? We'll see if Wadhams is earning his hefty salary.

[ Parent ]
Edwards brought it up in a classy way
and no one onjected to that. The objections were to how John Kerrey handled it which was to repeat it over and over and over - and that's what lead to the blow-back.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?
[ Parent ]
Blow-back
That was calculated and directed, David. Hannity, O'Reilly and Limbaugh were hammering Edwards for it before the ink was dry (I know because I was writing about it that night and the next morning). They created such an uproar that Kerry was called upon to address it, and then they pounced.

It's an odd comparison, because the wingers will be, ostensibly, condemning both Mary Cheney for loving women (or a woman) and Justin Schaffer for his sophomoric take on serious issues. Of course, they had to bend over backwards to insincerely defend Mary's honor, while they'll be winking and nudging over young Schaffer's indiscretions (mainly, getting caught).

The point is, there's everything wrong with Justin Schaffer's bigoted bravado. The wingers will make the same hay, though, defending the children from attack.

[ Parent ]
You're right
I don't even remember anyone mentioning Edwards. All I remember was Kerry's tone-deaf handling of it: his sanctimonious salute to Mary Cheney. I was a strong Kerry supporter, but even I winced at that.
[ Parent ]
Mary Cheney was *way* "out of the closet"...
Before [Mary Cheney] became a public enigma, she used to earn a nice living as a corporate liaison for Coors Brewing Co., going into gay bars (sometimes with Mr. International Leather 1999, who would wear his chaps and straps, according to the Advocate) to convince everyone that Coors had changed. For a long time, gay people were implored by activists to boycott Coors, based on its funding of anti-gay causes. Mary got in there, talked about Coors's new domestic-partner benefits for employees. Mary said, here, try a Coors. She was good at that, and the boycott wafted away, and you didn't see as much Bud Light in gay bars.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/...

[ Parent ]
Sad
Schaffer should have told his son that what a child does reflects on his parents.

If this site is really by Schaffer's son, his son showed his father and mother great disrespect.

Sad when you do not teach your children that the public is very judgmental when you live a public life.  The parents pay the price.

Schaffer and Ritter, Jeb Bush, Joseph Kennedy (Teddy you know), and the list goes on and they all know what paying the price is.


Friends Encourage Friends To Vote Republican

When you have a child...
who seems to be advocating slavery, it does call into question the parenting skills (or lack thereof) of the alleged parents.

It also points to the irony of these same parents advocating "family values".  One could argue that this child might have been better off had he been raised by a nice lesbian couple.

"But when I see a 9-11 victim family on television, or whatever, I'm just like, 'Oh, shut up!' I'm so sick of them because they're always complaining."  Glenn Beck  

[ Parent ]
I recently encountered
a social conservative who believes he has very high morals and strong family values but doesn't want to see a black person as president, not because he believes a black person can't be smart and accomplished but because he believes a black person will  take everything away from whites and give it to blacks. Honest.  He wasn't kidding.  

One can only imagine what values this guy is teaching his children about  people of different races, religions, ethnic groups and nationalities.  I'd guess  it's not  anything in the way of respect for families that don't look just like his own.  

[ Parent ]
Does he believe that Whites have taken everything away from other groups and given it to whites?
Things that make you go, "HMMMMM"
[ Parent ]
Actually, I think that's it
Several people I know have heard this very same thing from someone at work or in their extended family.  It's a type of racist who is very aware of how whites screwed blacks when they had the absolute power to do so and figures it must work both ways.

They know how they'd keep blacks in there place if they still could and expect to be treated the same way in return. Of course the fact that they think one member of a minority as President would have the power to take everything away from them or anybody else shows how ignorant and paranoid they are and that, on some level, they must believe they have it coming.  

[ Parent ]
Drug Addict
Do the parents of a drug addict advocate people taking drugs!  Bad analogy.  

How many kids have you raised Arvadonian?

May be you are perfect but I have seen families who a have raised 3 great kids and one that is a drug addict.

Try as you may you can not control a 19 yr old kid.  Like I said if the parents do not get it through their childrens heads that their actions affect how people look at his parents, the parents suffer.

Friends Encourage Friends To Vote Republican

[ Parent ]
I can think of lots of ways to control a 19 year-old college student
* Cut off college money
* Take away the car
* Stop paying cell phone bill
* No trip home for thanksgiving

Or what Bob will likely do--slap his hand in public and give him a pat on the back in private.

Non impediti ratione cogitationis.

"Some of the people that wanted to engage me in conversation appeared to have been the losers in the 'Are you smarter than Michele Bachmann contest?'." --Rep. Barney Frank

[ Parent ]
If you raise a child...
in an environment where racism is accepted (or encouraged), they are far more likely to be racist.

Do you honestly think that this spoiled brat just developed these racist attitudes once he left the house for college?

I seriously doubt it.

Look, Schaffer himself is advocating that he knows what is best what should be considered a family.  This whole situation calls into question how his own family unit functions.  If he has raised a son who is off producing a web site that could be mistaken for a white supremicist home page, then it does prove the bumper sticker "Focus on your own damned family" is appropriate.

"But when I see a 9-11 victim family on television, or whatever, I'm just like, 'Oh, shut up!' I'm so sick of them because they're always complaining."  Glenn Beck  

[ Parent ]
Focus on your own damned family is right...
The irony of irony is that Bob is the type of person that wants to proseletize to all of us and tell us how to run our families, and look at his family. It ain't pretty, and if by 20 years of life a kid somehow thinks slavery is funny he has his head fully up his posterior.

Bob threw the first stone a long time ago, and now his glass house is getting pummeled.

Schaffer is not afraid to make a litany of value judgements about other peoples' families and lifestyles, so I am not afraid to make judgements about his.  The Schaffers' are a bunch of losers.

" Is there a way to delete your own comments? " bjwilson83

[ Parent ]
Wholeheartedly agree.
I asked this in another diary, but why is this military-aged Republican man not in the military fighting the terrorists like one would assume he assumes that "Republican Jesus" would?

"But when I see a 9-11 victim family on television, or whatever, I'm just like, 'Oh, shut up!' I'm so sick of them because they're always complaining."  Glenn Beck  
[ Parent ]
Now we're talking
It's August and both parties will now relentlessly drag us through all the mud and muck of the gutter, Pols included.  

Bravo Pols, bravo . . .  Just like Jeb Bush is a crackhead because his daughter abuses drugs, or Hillary would be a sexual deviant because Bill diddled an intern, so too is Schaffer a racist like his son's Facebook proves!  Of course, it's so simple!

Next we'll get to hear from the Rs how Maggie Fox is a swinger, or starves and kicks dogs, or perhaps parks in handicap spots!  

That will surely help us select the right guy for Senate.

You're overreacting as usial
Parents can't be held accountable for a child once they reach 18 and move out. But, what they do reflects on the parents.
Jeb Bush can be criticized because his daughter is an addict, but there should also be sympathy because he has to endure his daughter being an addict.
I don't fault Hillary Clinton for Bill's promiscuity, but it's reflected on her as his spouse. Some sympathy should be had for her having to endure the shame of her husband violating the vows he made.
Schaffer may or may not be a racist, I don't know, but his son has shown a tolerant attitude toward racism with this Facebook page. They should deal with it as a father to a son, and both publicly denounce those beliefs and work to repair the damage that will be done to Scahffer's campaign.
I would give the same advice to D's and R's. It just hurts R's more because they run on the "family values" line.

"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." - Christopher Hitchens
[ Parent ]
Apologies, I mistyped
You're overreacting as usual

"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." - Christopher Hitchens
[ Parent ]
Jeb Bush can be criticized because his daughter is an addict
   Jeb Bush cannot be criticized because his daughter is an addict any more than he can criticized if his daughter had MS or epilepsy or diabetes since most modern medical science considers drug addiction to be a disease, not a moral failing.
  Jeb and his wife can and should be criticized for failing to stand by their daughter when she had to appear in court going through the criminal justice system while probably going through drug withdrawal at the same time.  I realize it was inconvenient for her case to occur during Jeb's '02 re-election campaign, but shit happens.
  Regardless of whether you agree with his politics or not, Howard Dean took time off from the '04 campaign trail to appear in court in Vermont with his son who was charged with breaking and entering a country club bar.
  Democratic family values...you stand by your children.  Republicans...not so much.
[ Parent ]
Yes
Dean showed that his family was more important than an election.
Family hardships often show us the priorities of elected officials.

"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." - Christopher Hitchens
[ Parent ]
I don't fault Hillary Clinton for Bill's promiscuity, but it's reflected on her as his spouse
   I know, the pro-marriage crowd thought that HRC should have filed for divorce immediately when the infamous stained blue dress came to light.
[ Parent ]
The Clintons are political animals
They understand the system better than anyone as far back as I can remember. They work better as a team than separate.
The Lewinsky scandal actually allowed Hillary to step out from behind Bill and show everyone she was strong without having to lean on Bill.
She came out looking the best out of everyone involved, and gained a lot of respect from doubters.

"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." - Christopher Hitchens
[ Parent ]
She came out looking the best out of everyone involved, and gained a lot of respect from doubters.
Absolutely!
[ Parent ]
I am so tired of this!
Honestly, it gets so very tiring to almost everyday feeling like I need to blog about people and their really fucked up attitudes towards race and more pointed towards Black people.

I listen to all of you republicans telling me that I am imagining racist statements and undertones in the actions of people in your party.  Please know that I want to believe that I am imagining things, because I want to believe we are all decent people, but unfortunately, shit like this keeps coming up.  

None of the kids in my family post crap like this.  We don't do it because it is not a part of our upbringing.  It is not something that my family thinks is funny or a schoolboy joke.

Was it is school boy joke to send threatening emails to the Tri Exec at CU threatening her "nigger" life if she ran for office again.  I guess the Schaffer family would find a terrified young, talented Black woman hilarious.

Honestly people, I am growing angry with stupidity, ignorance and republicans telling me, "That's not want was meant" when we all know exactly what is going here!

I AM REALLY SICK OF IT - TO MY VERY CORE - I AM SICK OF THE IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We should all be outraged
Something like this should outrage anyone with any sense of decency. Poltical affiliations are meaningless when attitudes like this come to light.
This current election cycle has brought out the worst feelings in people about sex and race, things people may not realize they felt, so you're not imagining things.
We as an allegedly moral society shouldn't have to stand for this. We should be able to move beyond this kind of ignorance.

"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." - Christopher Hitchens
[ Parent ]
You are so right, WLJ.
The widespread avoidance of comprehensive discussion and understanding about racism -- subtle or not -- is a huge part of the problem.  When people can exhibit racism in a blatant way ("Slavery Gets Shit Done" is just one of endless examples), then hide by pretending nothing was meant by it, the problem will go on another one or two hundred years.  
[ Parent ]
Well said
I completely agree. I too am sick and tired of this. It's sad that no one from the so-called party of personal responsibility, will take any responsibility for their own actions.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole
[ Parent ]
You're right
My initial reaction was "it's not that bad," maybe he was trying to be "funny." Or "ironical." (Especially the "What Would Republican Jesus Do" in front of a Confederate flag and holding a machine gun: that one seemed almost mocking against Republicans.)

But the more I look at it, the more sickening it becomes. Some things you just don't joke about.

[ Parent ]
Some things you just don't joke about
Or, if you joke about them, you accept the consequences. Wanna bet "family values" Bob gives his son a pass on that one?
[ Parent ]
Looks recent. His 'feed' refers to this comment...
Justin wrote at 10:59am on July 28th, 2008
I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the REPUBLIC (not democracy) for which it stands; one nation, under GOD (not under nothing), invisible (okay, that one is actually indivisible, but I like invisible) with liberty and justice for all.

Daddy must be so proud
So, will father denounce son soon?

more importantly, has Wadhams put out a statement yet defending the lad?

[ Parent ]
is this news?
I'm a die hard Dem, but don't think this or any kids are newsworthy, no matter what their web pages say.  Same with other family members. Campaigns should be about the candidate only.  Everyone else is their own person and should be held accountable as such.  Don't judge a candidate based on their father, son, mother, daughter, etc.  
He is a college kid
College kids say outrageous things. Deal with it.

Leave Schaffer's family alone. This article is over the line.  

Bwaaahaaahaaa
Call the waaaambulence! Leave Schaffer's family alone, indeed. Get him out of public life, and we'll all happily forget him.

"I can tolerate chaos, I'm just not sure chaos can tolerate me" Dylan
[ Parent ]
It's an interesting question
Speaking as a parent, I know I don't control what my kids do and say. And there are times I disagree strongly with them. And college is the time when you need the safety to say and do really stupid things so you learn from them without it runing your life.

At the same time, all of what is shown above paints a disturbing picture. This is not a dumb thing, this is an ongoing list of numerous dumb things that all follow a common theme. We've all said or done something that in hindsight we find bad. But if you do it 50 times, then it's part of what you are.

And children are a reflection of how the environment they are brought up in. It's not 100% that. And things like this can even be a child rebelling against the constraints of the parent so it's the inverse of the home environment - but that then speaks to issues raising the kid.

I think it's fair to ask Bob Schaffer to speak about this. And I think that answer will tell us a lot more than the MySpace page shots above. Because that answer will tell us a lot about, if not the actual home environment in the Schaffer household, at least what he is pretending it is.

And if someone finds casual racism acceptable at home - I don't want him representing me in Congress.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?

[ Parent ]
Bravo, David

[ Parent ]
Pretty much my view
However, I am not shocked by the kid's beliefs.
[ Parent ]
The thing is...
...I don't know many people when I was in College (including myself) that would ever advocate that kind of attitude.  Yeah.  All of us (myself included) said some pretty stupid things.  Never anything on that level.  Not even as a joke.  
[ Parent ]
Well said
As always.
[ Parent ]
Hah!
What about Ritter's kid, eh? And that was just a beer party, not Osamabama and the Count Chocula thing. Jesus -- slavery gets shit done? Did he learn that in LaPorte?

If you don't think this is politically relevant to his dad's Senate race, then probably nothing is.

Sorry, but as much as you try, I just can't buy in to the idea that every Democrat is evil except for Andrew Romanoff.

[ Parent ]
Would you vote for the parent(s) of David Duke? How about the Son of Sam's parents, should they be in Congress?
I know, that is extreme.  However, parents do influence their kids.  I would be amazed if Shaffer came out and said he was going to volunteer with his son in Louisiana working with families that have been devastated by poverty and lack of government support in the face of a national disaster.  Or ask if his son could volunteer at the NAACP for the remainder of the summer - but he won't. That's what my Dad would have done.  He would make sure that we understood the power of our thoughts and words.

My guess is in this family the kid will be in trouble for making his thoughts public, not for the content of the ideas put forth. You know wink, wink...

In 2006, I had a Lamborn staff member tell me that slavery was good for Blacks because our lives are so much better as Americans. I turned and walked away from the person because I was representing Jay Fawcett at the time and had I stayed my words would have been a verbal ass kicking.

How many more incidents of racial "misunderstand" is the party of Lincoln going to throw at us.  And how many more times can they say we are just overreacting. And how many more times are we just being overly sensitive. After so many the argument itself is riduculous.

There is a battle happening.  A battle for equality. Those who can come to terms with the concept that all (wo)men are created equally, will become the people no one wants to be associated with.  Kind of like members of the KKK.  I am really impressed with most of you on this blog, calling ugly what it is.

Three years in Colorado and I am now officially the angry Black woman.  Damn, I hate when that happens. I was so happy in my little mixed race world!

[ Parent ]
those who can not come to terms with the concept...

[ Parent ]
thanks
as a white man from another place, one of the things I miss about the west--and I've lived out there a while--is the lack of diversity.  I really noticed it at first, and now i notice it whenever I travel outside the region. It can be a pretty insular world, and I think there is a lot of ignorance of the world beyond, outside the West and outside the U.S. But kids are a product of their upbringing, and this is another sour note on a terrible choice for senate.  It is repugnant and it reflects poorly on Bob.  With Dick's 'shove it up his ass' remark, and now the wayward child, one must wonder who Shaffer does have control over: not his eldest son and not his campaign manager seems the explanation B.O.Bob will probably take.  
[ Parent ]
Lamborn staffer comment to you
In 2006, I had a Lamborn staff member tell me that slavery was good for Blacks because our lives are so much better as Americans.

Are you f***ing serious? That's about the most reprehensible thing I've ever heard.

(Don't you mean those who CAN'T come to terms? At least I hope that'll be the case!)

[ Parent ]
Governor's Mansion
Remember the Governor's Mansion is a tax payer funded residence that he was using to party in.  That has some relevance to whether it should have been reported or not.
[ Parent ]
that's a fair point

[ Parent ]
Disagree
Hey kids of political figures need to know what they do reflects on their parents.

Sorry Schaffer and his family are fair game.

Should have taught their son better!

Friends Encourage Friends To Vote Republican

[ Parent ]
Oh pity
He just left the group "Pole Dancers for Jesus."

I'd forgotten how charming college students were. Was it not what he expected?

Sorry, but as much as you try, I just can't buy in to the idea that every Democrat is evil except for Andrew Romanoff.

I do have to add
thank God I have daughters, not sons!!!!!

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?
[ Parent ]
Don't get too comfortable in your world of daughters, David
I'm sure you realize girls are quite capable of something as obnoxious as this.
[ Parent ]
Not my angels - they're perfect :)
[ Parent ]
I am not sharp enough to understand...
..all of the Facebook speak. Is this truly the page of Bob's or not, dinosaurs like me wanna know.
Bob's son n/t

[ Parent ]
oh yeah I meant to mention the "son" part....
...Freudian slip and all that.  Many thanks!
[ Parent ]
Typical internet b.s.
Unfortunately, the sort of stuff you see on this 20-year-old "kid"'s page can be found all over the net posted by people whom you hope would know better.  The alleged humor comes from the assumption that the poster doesn't REALLY believe that "slavery gets shit done", or that Jesus would carry a Kalishinkov.  It's all "ironic", supposedly.  But I think there's more to it than that.  However, I haven't received my diploma yet, so I am not licensed to play the role of Internet psychologist. ;)

Many were increasingly of the opinion that they'd all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place.  And some said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans. - Douglas Adams
Thinking about this some more
Every once in a while when growing up one of my daughters would say something that I would think was derogatory towards some group. And the fact that they said it, while at that moment was surprising I also realized was to be expected - kids are learning as they grow up and they are trying to figure things out. They will say and do things that are wrong, often not realizing it.

But every time it happened, I would stop and talk to them about what they said and why it was hurtful or wrong. And I would ask them for why they did it and would answer their questions.

And as they got older, there would be times they would do the same to me - and I would answer their questions and sometimes I would realize that they had a point and I would apologize.

The key point here was that I saw this as important and talked to them when things like this came up. So my daughters have acted out, pushed back, and done things for effect. But when they have done those things they were never anything like what is at the top here. The two categories they are comfortable poking fun at is dad's (we truly get no respect) and nerds (yes I am one). But in both cases that is pointed at groups I am a member of - not others.

If one of my daughters had crap like the above on their MySpace page (and yes I have checked occasionally) - I would have hit the fucking ceiling. And there would have been a major discussion which would have ended up with the garbage being removed, an apology posted, and them volunteering with a Latino group here in Boulder this summer.

The son is what he is and he does deserve the same privacy as any other 20 year old who is still in college and is making a lot of mistakes and will hopefully learn from his before graduating.

But Bob Schaffer should be measured by this. Primarily by how he handles it and the question of how he raised his children if his kids see this as in the realm of the acceptable. Because make no mistake, kids rebel within the bounds of what they think is (barely) acceptable.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?

And a humorous postscript...
About a year ago one of my daughters asked me if I would treat them any different if any of them were a lesbian. She was expecting an "of course not" so I said "absolutely."

She was totally shocked. And she started to get upset and asked me what I would do different.

And I said...

"Well then we could go to lunch together at Hooters."

She didn't find it funny.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?

[ Parent ]
I recall my earlier comment after your post about daughters, David.
To comment on this post: it's one thing for kids to jokingly tease their dad about his "dadness" or his "nerdiness," which is what it sounds like your daughters do. I don't get the same feeling from what I've seen of the MySpace page attributed to young Mr. Shaffer.
[ Parent ]
Wait, does this mean you no longer rejoice in not having sons?
...recognize that children of both sexes are imperfect?  
[ Parent ]
I will always rejoice in having just daughters
Because I was blessed with 3 wonderful daughters and nothing could be better than what I have.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?
[ Parent ]
Sorry But.
"But Bob Schaffer should be measured by this."????

Sorry but Schaffer's parenting skills should be in question but you are saying EVERYTHING should be measured by this kid incident.  

How many kids do you have David?  

Kids at 19 do a lot of stupid things testing their right to have their own say.  Kids are always pushing limits.  If Schaffer's kid  put up Left wing stuff on Facebook you still would have crucified Schaffer over that.

Now you are really going overboard over this story...find another chink in Schaffer's armor.

Friends Encourage Friends To Vote Republican

[ Parent ]
I have 3 daughters
Trust me, I know the incredibly stupid things kids do, especially in High School and College. But going back over everything said by my 3, their friends, their sports teams, theater groups, lunch crowd, etc - I can't recall anything every that made me recoil in disgust. Not one.

Now brain-dead stupid - yep. Too much drinking - yep. Way too much drama over everything - every day (they're girls).

But never the kind of crap you see up there at the top.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?

[ Parent ]
Bob Schaffer has a facebook page
Bob's facebook page

He also has a MySpace page here but it's very sad - he only has 1 friend.

He also is apparently single. I wonder if his wife knows...

Oh, and also on MySpace a campaign page. On this one he has 38 friends and is married.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?

God, that's pathetic.
I have more friends than Bob Schaffer and I'm a total nobody.

Mark Udall has 58 friends on his MySpace page - still pretty damn low!

And "somebody" (initials D.W., obviously) has created a MySpace page ragging on "Boulder Liberal" Udall - with exactly ZERO friends. (What - not even Schaffer himself, or his son, wanted to be friends?)

[ Parent ]
When I was 18
In college, my roommates and I were on an intramural basketball team and thought it would be hilarious to name ourselves "Jerry's Friends" (i.e., Jerry Lewis - think muscular dystrophy). The first time we came out to play, we were practically spit upon by the opposing team and most of our friends.

We learned something. We changed the name of our team immediately.

Maybe Justin Schaffer will learn something as well.

Son issues apology, father promises "firm punishment"
The Denver Post is on the story.

Schaffer said he was prepared to talk about his campaign, not his children, but he did say that he and his wife had set out "firm punishment" for their son, Justin, over the issue....

Justin Schaffer issued a written apology late Monday:
"The offensive materials directly contradict the values that my parents taught me and are forbidden in my parents' home. My Facebook page is my sole responsibility . . ."

"It is clear that my actions were juvenile, disrespectful, and a mistake on my part," the statement said.


Let's see... How to figure out a firm punishment...
WWRJD?

Non impediti ratione cogitationis.

"Some of the people that wanted to engage me in conversation appeared to have been the losers in the 'Are you smarter than Michele Bachmann contest?'." --Rep. Barney Frank

[ Parent ]
Yeah ... what would the Bible call for in this case?
An eye for an eye?
A tooth for a tooth?
40 lashes?

I've never read it, but I'm sure somebody here can quote an appropriate punishment from the Bible.

[ Parent ]
didn't Lil' Schaffer violate the commandment re: honor thy mother and thy father by embarrassing daddy in the middle of his political campaign?

[ Parent ]
It's an ok response
But it lets Bob avoid the question of what kind of home environment he has. He can avoid specifically discussing one of his children - but still be asked the hypothetical "as a father what would you do if one of your children..."

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?
[ Parent ]
shameless
Now you're attacking his kids....why don't you stick to the candidate and leave the family alone...you are PATHETIC....and yes by the way, I gave the same advice to Channel 9 and the DPost.
...
when they went after the governor's son.
[ Parent ]
because...
the family of a "family values" candidate is fair game.

Yes, it would be better if these things were off limits, but the GOP made this bed. Don't complain when they have to lie in it.

What are you talking about?...I don't get it." - bjwilson83

[ Parent ]
Oh please
we are talking about an adult.

If Bob's son were saying the things he posted on his page in a bar he'd be lucky to leave with his teeth.

His conduct reflects poorly on himself and his father.

Its not much of an issue, but spare me the false indignation.

[ Parent ]
Agreed.
Something like that in my house would be a bigger problem and punishment than any kind of public embarrassment.  

No excuse for it, but let's also watch the umbrage on the anti-Schaffer side.  Daily calling people Nazis and fascists is nearly equally as ignorant as what "Mini-B" did.

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
Let's watch the Straw Man
The only "calling people Nazis" comes from your compatriot, sjinthedark, who routinely compares Obama to Hitler. Glass houses, LB. No one from the anti-Schaffer side is making that comparison, much less "daily."
[ Parent ]
It's an idiotic thing to call people
But you're right, to be fair it doesn't happen on this blog as much as another I post on.

Mea Culpa.

"Kevin and I will keep them out somehow -- even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!"  

[ Parent ]
I seem to recall that Schaffer's kid
is in an Army ROTC program in college.  Thinking about it that way, it is quite possible that this issue will go far beyond any punishment that his parents could hand down to him.

I would almost expect that he will be reprimanded for his behavior by his ROTC command and could quite possibly be discharged from the corps of cadets.

Not sure, but I would imagine that some aspects of the UCMJ could apply here.

If he's in ROTC
his career in the military is over. He may not be kicked out, but no one will ever promote someone with that on their record. It shows very poor judgement and in the military poor judgement gets people killed.

My recommendations in the 2010 primary?
[ Parent ]
Depends on if Daddy..
can pull of a Senate win.

"But when I see a 9-11 victim family on television, or whatever, I'm just like, 'Oh, shut up!' I'm so sick of them because they're always complaining."  Glenn Beck  
[ Parent ]
"Schaffer Family Values" On Facebook Display? | 125 comments
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