Notable Links

Denver Internet Marketing by Parallel Path

Knowledge Messenger

Arvada Boutique Clothing Store Stella B's

El Paso County Bathtub Drowning Update

by: Colorado Pols

Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 10:03:37 AM MST

Yesterday was Budget Day along the Ronald Reagan Highway, as the Colorado Springs Gazette reports:

El Paso County commissioners approved a $232.3 million budget for 2009 Monday, holding the line on spending at about the same level as this year by laying off dozens of employees and cutting back office hours and services.
Residents will likely have to wait longer at the motor vehicle department, see animal control services curtailed and be able to do business only four days a week at most county offices.
"The citizens should see us maintain the reduced level of service unless revenue continues to come in at a less rate," Chairman Dennis Hisey said. If revenues drop, the county will cut further, he said.
"I would caution all department heads and elected officials you may be seeing budget cuts again as early as March," he said.
The cuts in service are largely the result of dozens of layoffs this year in two waves - last summer to meet budget shortfalls and in November after voters rejected the county's 1 percent sales tax increase...
Casting the sole dissenting vote on the budget, [El Paso County Commissioner Wayne] Williams called it "financially irresponsible," because it spends $3 million more than it takes in.

We've followed the fiscal crisis in El Paso County irregularly for some time now, since it's kind of a petri dish for what happens when ideologues bent on destroying government run one without opposition over a period of decades (won't it be cool when the government goes from being open four days a week to just on Wednesdays? That will be awesome!)

The results are increasingly speaking for themselves: in June, El Paso County was forced to cut its suicide prevention program--even though Colorado Springs has the second highest suicide rate in the nation. There aren't enough deputies to adequately patrol the county or staff the jail. The county has cut important child protection services, and has even resorted to selling off parkland to raise cash. The health department gave up on complying with the law on restaurant inspections a long time ago.

Meanwhile, beet-red El Paso County soundly rejected a 1% sales tax hike that would have addressed the problem--not completely, but would have given them some space to come into compliance with a slew of legal minimums. It's not like they would have spent it on "pork," right? Unless you call making sure the Chinese restaurant on the corner isn't serving poison chicken "pork."

That's the bottom line, and it parallels a problem the ardent, ideological left has: ideology doesn't tell them when to stop. It doesn't give them a flag for when they're done cutting fat and have started to cut bone. And at some point, even the most blindly partisan Briargate dittohead will realize that arguing about "big" or "small" government is meaningless if you don't have functioning government.

Colorado Pols :: El Paso County Bathtub Drowning Update

Tags: (All Tags)

Print Friendly View

Send As Email

El Paso County Bathtub Drowning Update | 25 comments

"The citizens should see us maintain the reduced level of service unless revenue continues to come in at a less rate," Chairman Dennis Hisey said. If revenues drop, the county will cut further, he said.

What's next? No more firemen and police officers? EPC is turning into Mad Max's Australia.

"Nice driveby spin" -- Libertad

by: redstateblues @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 11:26:35 AM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

all they need now is Tina Turner playing Auntie Entity

Break a deal, face the wheel

by: One Queer Dude @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 18:21:15 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Sweet and Sour

"Unless you call making sure the Chinese restaurant on the corner isn't serving poison chicken 'pork.'"

The Chinese restaurant might call it pork...

by: Jeff Bridges @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 11:34:29 AM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

What about Mesa and Weld Counties

Similar GOP strongholds exist there. What is their fiscal soundness?

by: Libertad @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 11:58:31 AM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Here you go

Mesa County's revenue is holding steady and/or increasing. They are in sound financial shape due to mineral royalties and property value increases. A PDF of their proposed 2009 budget can be found on the county website.

Similarly, Weld County is surviving on property taxes and doesn't suffer the same problems as El Paso.

Now that it's too late, the Vote Yes on 1a budget summary might be something enlightening to look at.

El Paso's problem is an unwillingness to collect taxes. It won't propose a property tax increase, and it can't pass a sales tax increase. If El Paso's property taxes were in line even with Mesa County's (and Mesa has one of the lower property tax rates due to their revenue from mineral leasing...), then it wouldn't be in the financial jam it's in. It still wouldn't be pretty compared to Weld or Mesa, but it would be a whole lot better off than it is.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result." -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

by: Phoenix Rising @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 14:36:26 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

We've said it

a hundred times........our tax rate is 7.4%
El Paso County tried to raise it a full percent, when all they needed, and they even admitted it, was less than 1/2 of one percent. So we told them to go back and try again. We aren't fuckin stupid.

Is 7.4% not enough? If not, how much IS enough in liberals eyes? 10%? 15%? 20%?

NoBama .... NoBamaCare either

by: Gecko @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 20:48:27 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

does the entire county run on sales tax?

..that seems to be the only tax you ever reference.

Also, does the 7.4% include the state sales tax applicable everywhere? (which is likely a huge chunk of the 7.4%).

by: Jambalaya @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 20:50:54 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

I'm guessing yes.

by: The realist @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 20:53:14 PM CST

[ Parent ]

You failed to mention (again) that property taxes in El Paso County

are much lower than in other large counties in Colorado. Information available on the El Paso County website, from a budget presentation in September. There may have been problems with the sales tax proposal, but you have to look at the entire tax and revenue picture for the county to understand the size of the problem.

by: The realist @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 20:52:22 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

"We aren't fucking stupid"

I agree. If your goal truly is to destroy the country and return to a state of "every man for himself," things are going exactly according to your plan.

Fucking heartless, yes.

by: Half Glass Full @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 04:31:08 AM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

What a stupid response

You did not read what I said.
The county asked for more than TWICE what it actually needed. They asked for it in a time where unemployment is at all time highs. When people can't even afford to pay their rent or buy food. And when we already have one of the highest sales tax rates in the state.

"Fucking heartless?"

When El Paso County gets their collective heads out of their collective asses and comes back with a realistic proposal, we will approve it. Until then, mind your own business.

NoBama .... NoBamaCare either

by: Gecko @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 08:43:11 AM CST

[ Parent ]

How much is enough in Mesa or Weld?

Libertad suggests these are both upstanding conservative counties...

The difference is, they're not so fscking self-centered as to believe they can get by without some form of revenue. In Weld it's property taxes; in Mesa it's property taxes and mineral lease monies.

El Paso county residents pay less than 1/3 per capita for property taxes compared to the next lowest county in the state, Mesa. And then you complain that your sales taxes are too high while watching your government shut itself down.

I have to agree with Half Glass - you're not stupid, it's willful. And considering the comments I saw before the election, I'm pretty sure El Paso would have voted down a 1/2% increase in sales tax just as readily as the fulll 1% increase.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result." -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

by: Phoenix Rising @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 13:44:00 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

You Got Me Gecko

Apparently it's 8.4%

by: Jersey Corn @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 14:10:34 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

But

It would be nice to hear you weigh in on the property tax issue that people have raised countless times. How much is too little in conservatives' eyes?

by: Jersey Corn @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 14:12:32 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

El Paso needs to look at more than just sales tax

And consider property tax as well.

It's not "liberals" asking you how much is enough. It's about how much is enough to actually have a functioning county government, which you don't really have anymore. Nobody is saying you should start ADDING programs, but it's probably not a good idea to be cutting so many vital services.

by: Colorado Pols @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 14:15:03 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Heck with vital

How about "legally required"?

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result." -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

by: Phoenix Rising @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 14:37:11 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I had no idea re: Colo. Springs suicide rate.

That's stunning.

And on another note, good diary.

--From a "real dick."
by: JO

by: Middle of the Road @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 12:13:43 PM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Obviously the suicide prevention program wasn't working

so why not just eliminate it?

[/Norquist]

by: sxp151 @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 12:30:39 PM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Da da da boom!

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd." -Bertrand Russell

by: parsingreality @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 12:52:51 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Not only does ideology not tell them when to stop . . .

. . . conditions on the ground are a little difficult to read, too. By the time a crisis becomes obvious, it will be very difficult to address it.

by: The realist @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 12:59:20 PM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

No really. The free hand of the marketplace addresses all

When people get sick eating at a restaurant, the don't go there anymore.
When a bridge falls down, you put up a couple of barricades and a detour.
When your house burns down and no firefighters respond, you rebuild elsewhere.
When your company doesn't get the same basic services and infrastructure it can elsewhere, you move.
See? It's easy.

by: ajb @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 13:10:11 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

El Paso County Bathtub Drowning Update

who gives a damn?

by: One Queer Dude @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 18:20:07 PM CST

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Not El Paso residents....

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result." -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

by: Phoenix Rising @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 18:20:58 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

I care

because Gecko, et al will be expecting the state taxpayers to take over some of the responsibilities. And, we probably will. After all they pay state sales tax also.

by: Gray in the mountains @ Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 20:54:31 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

Exactly

This is a statewide issue, whether anyone likes it or not. If El Paso falls apart, the state will have to help fix it. And the state doesn't have any money to do the things it needs to do already. El Paso is going to end up being on its own Welfare plan with the state or federal government, and we ALL pay for that.

by: Colorado Pols @ Wed Dec 17, 2008 at 14:16:28 PM CST

[ Parent ]

by: you @ soon

To post this comment click here:

Otherwise click cancel.

El Paso County Bathtub Drowning Update | 25 comments