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Beauprez Staffer(s) to Frog-March?

by: Colorado Pols

Sat Oct 14, 2006 at 08:48:02 AM MDT


( - promoted by Colorado Pols)

Republican gubernatorial candidate Bob Beauprez has, by most estimates, successfully narrowed Democrat Bill Ritter's lead in the polls in the last few weeks through a hard-hitting series of attacks on Ritter's record as Denver District Attorney. These attacks have been carried out through Beauprez's own campaign as well as supporting 527s.

Beauprez's campaign has put out a constant stream of "Cold Case Archive" press releases (after a bit of a late start) that have contained lots of information about the various defendants Ritter is alleged to have been "soft" on. Detailed arrest records, information about subsequent convictions in other jurisdictions—also interesting about most of them is that they made sure to include an "A.K.A." name below the person's real name. Like the one you see here. No doubt there's a focus group somewhere who discovered that people come off scarier with an alias.

In any event, according to this morning's Rocky Mountain News there's so much information in these press releases—and especially the "Carlos Estrada Medina" TV spot—that the Ritter camp believes it came from protected law enforcement databases. Unauthorized use of which (to smear a political opponent, for example) is against the law:

At the heart of the controversy is the question of how the Republican congressman's campaign obtained information that his opponent says is highly restricted and only available to law enforcement.

"Your campaign broke the law," an angry Bill Ritter told Beauprez during a debate taped at Fox 31 News in Denver on Friday.

Ritter accused the congressman of getting someone to improperly obtain information from the FBI's National Crime Information Center database for use in an ad criticizing his handling of a plea-bargain for an illegal immigrant offender while Ritter was Denver's district attorney.

At Ritter's urging, CBI spokesman Lance Clem said the agency will investigate whether Beauprez's campaign violated state and federal law.

Beauprez denied any wrong-doing and accused Democrat Ritter of trying to switch the subject from his record of granting plea-bargains that the congressman contends allowed immigrants - both legal and illegal - to avoid deportation...
Colorado Pols :: Beauprez Staffer(s) to Frog-March?
Once again, the one guy Beauprez should be able to count on to keep his mouth shut...didn't.

So, how did the Beauprez campaign know that offenders with three different names and the same birthday - Nov. 2, 1979 - were really the same guy?

Beauprez campaign manager John Marshall told a 9News reporter Wednesday that "in federal criminal databases, the guy's information matches up."

But Marshall seemed to back off from that statement Friday...

Maybe because he was copping, right there, to something that could send somebody he knows to federal prison for 10 years? We know you're sick of us blaming Marshall for Beauprez's general train wreck of a campaign. But this guy, far from the "boy wonder" he was touted to be, is a colossal moron: and he may have just green-lighted the Beauprez campaign for a criminal investigation singlehandedly. Heckuva job, Johnnie.

The allegation here, according to people we've talked to, is potentially quite serious—but it's going to take more time to sort this out than we have before Election Day. And it remains a fact that no matter what happens regarding the sources of the attacks in question, they have been effective to at least a few percentage points' extent.

Bottom line: People have done worse to get elected and still kept their jobs, often by throwing underlings like John Marshall under the bus when the time came. Visit Illinois sometime and see for yourself.
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Beauprez Staffer(s) to Frog-March? | 130 comments
Ok, but respond to these
Ok, someone broke the law getting in to these databases and that person, or several people, should have the full weight of the law come down on them - and no plea bargin for them.

But Ritter needs to respond to this stuff. Don't pull an Angie and lose an election you have won. Talk about all the people you've put behind bars and how plea bargins are a necessary part of that process.


Tom Tancredo Interview

That's tough in a campaign
You can't teach people how the DA's office works in a 30 second sound bite.
[ Parent ]
If it's key to the race you can
I think one of the big problems with us Democrats is we see something like that and then want to present a 2 hour lecture on how the criminal justice system works - with extra credit work on it's origins back to the Magna Carta.

It's not that hard. We have what, maybe 2% of all cases go to trial. With no plea bargins that would jump to what, say 60% at least.

It's very simple. No plea bargins means a 30-fold increase in people, expenses, jury duty (must mention that one), etc. That is additional taxes and effort going in to that instead of into productive parts of society.

And that you can sell in 30 seconds - BWB wants a 30-fold increase in taxes, Ritter whats to keep it reasonable.

- dave

Tom Tancredo Interview

[ Parent ]
Can plea bargaining be reformed? How?
Where's Tom Tancredo and a bill that would outlaw plea bargaining that protects immigrants from deportation?

Where's BWB or BR (or an ambitious legislator) with a proposal to reform plea bargaining in Colorado and to give prosecutors the resources they need to put the baddies away?

Where's an editorial that calls for plea bargain reforms and the requirement that DA's publish and distribute press releases related to all plea bargains?

Where's the editorial or column that says that just because Bill Ritter helped illegal immigrants by giving them plea bargains doesn't make being a Slick Willie acceptable?

Where's a bill that would establish rules for plea bargains and limit their use?

Where's the boldness and creativity?

[ Parent ]
And while we're asking these questions...
... let's not forget the biggest two: How much would such reforms cost, and are the taxpayers willing to pay that cost?

I'm far from a legal or law enforcement expert, but I suspect that such an overhaul will cost big bucks, especially if it means more people behind bars. Of course we could go about decriminalizing victimless crimes but the social cons will have none of that.

"The fact that we Dems can't rebuild the house does not mean you bring back the [Republicans] who burned it down." - DavidThi808

[ Parent ]
more
It sounds like another part of the problem is a lack of judges and courts to handle the cases, and maybe there's a corresponding lack of attorneys working for the DA offices statewide (maybe not). But expanding the courts to try more accused criminals will certainly cost us, too.

"The fact that we Dems can't rebuild the house does not mean you bring back the [Republicans] who burned it down." - DavidThi808
[ Parent ]
And what of the other costs?
Plea bargaining isn't always ideal, but neither are the other extremes.  Trying someone you would otherwise plea bargain, and then having the trial return an innocent verdict due to insufficient evidence, wastes time and money while not punishing the wrongdoer.  Reducing the standards of evidence is removing our liberty and our security for the perception of security.

The United States already has the highest incarceration rate in the world.  And Colorado has one of the highest incarceration rates in the country.  How much would it cost to house and feed all of these additional people once we hire the judges and DAs to convict them all?  When do we open "Aspen Penal Colony" or "NYC Federal Detention Center" to curb the ever-increasing perception that we're not tough enough on crime?

The farce that is the fake furor surrounding plea bargaining in order to elect one more morally bankrupt GOP politician to a position of power needs to stop.  Now.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result."  -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

[ Parent ]
look here
the beauprez campaign has been pushing the ethical boundries for over a year.  most insiders knew, and it was only a matter of time before the public would find out, too.  but let's not just put marshall under scrutiny.  likely we will need to add to the list every consultant on that team as well as every active participant that would have access to blackwell and cbi databases.  I can think of two folks right now that should probably start thinking about responses and hiring council.
I think this is indicitave
of the mindset BB brings to the table from DC.  He's been in the party with absolute power since his arrival in the Capital city and he just doesn't understand (nor conveys that to his staff) that the law is something to be obeyed.  I'm guessing BB will use the same defense on this issue as he did on his question about whether he ever had an illegal alien milking his cows:  he just simply can't be held accountable for all of those people who work for him.

This mindset scares the crap out of me.  Do we really want this guy as the CEO of Colorado?

What???
But golly gee whillikers, his campaign ad SAYS "hold me accountable." Can't we trust him?
[ Parent ]
I think this is indicitave
of the mindset BB brings to the table from DC.  He's been in the party with absolute power since his arrival in the Capital city and he just doesn't understand (nor conveys that to his staff) that the law is something to be obeyed.  I'm guessing BB will use the same defense on this issue as he did on his question about whether he ever had an illegal alien milking his cows:  he just simply can't be held accountable for all of those who work for him.

This mindset scares the crap out of me.  Do we really want this guy as the CEO of Colorado?

Could you repeat that?
I didn't hear it the first time.
[ Parent ]
Should I write it in capitals so you can hear it?
Tell Sybil to put the batteries back in the hearing aid
[ Parent ]
ruthie, you're a rito....

[ Parent ]
I think you're a bit dyslexic
so I'm sure you'll understand that rito is "riot"
[ Parent ]
Ritter's mad that his mismanagement is exposed
Bill Ritter ought to be a defense attorney. He's so good at changing the subject, which is, he's soft on illegal immigration and can't be trusted to enforce the state's laws that are designed to reduce illegal immigration and the employment of illegals in Colorado.

Ritter probably will win, but the pressure on him to come clean and to enforce  state and federal laws will only increase. He is positioning himself to be Tom Tancredo's favorite Democrat.

As a result, Republicans will retake the General Assembly in 2008.

That's a bunch of hooey
Provide FACTS, please, that Ritter is in any way, shape or form "soft on illegal immigration." Plea-bargaining a case - without any analysis of the evidence that may have led prosecutors to believe that a plea-bargain was advisable - is not a fact.

Ritter hasn't done anything less than Tom Tancredo in combating illegal immigration. Because the truth is that Tancredo has accomplished a big fat ZERO.

[ Parent ]
Actions speak louder than words
Bill Ritter gave passes to alleged criminals who were immigrants, allowing them to stay in the country when they should have been deported.

This was a major integrity failure. If integrity and border security are not important to you, I'm sorry.

Tancredo's a national leader. His campaigning led to the enactment of legislation that supposedly will build walls and other enforcement devices along the Mexican border. No DA could match such a record, and no Colorado governor will make as great a contribution to our country.

[ Parent ]
BEAUPREZ IS A FAILURE
And Bob Beauprez is and has been in Congress.  He is in the very position to have the most effect in securing the borders and immigration laws.  But he says he wants to "pressure" Congress in the future.  Why hasn't he done anything up to this point as a member of Congress? 

Does he even know where he stands on immigration, since he has flipped and flopped on that in just two years. 

He failed in Congress.  He would fail as governor of Colorado.  Bob Beauprez = a-typical D.C. politician looking out for himself at the expense to the rest of us.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
You know as well as I
Your attack is completely bogus.  You know - because you read here - that Ritter enacted policies which gave the Feds every chance he could offer to pick up and deport the illegals Ritter caught.

Tancredo's wall is a joke.  It's a billion-dollar boondoggle who's major effect will be to create a nation reminiscent of those behind the Iron Curtain.  There are better ways to protect our border than to rely on brick and mortar.  Tancredo's leadership would have us nuke Mecca (and if that didn't work, Medina and Jerusalem in the mix...) to "neutralize" Islamic terrorists.  I know of no single act that would call down upon our country more retribution than that.

"I have come to the conclusion that the making of laws is like the making of sausages-the less you know about the process the more you respect the result."  -- Anonymous IL State Rep. circa 1878

[ Parent ]
Correct me if I'm wrong
I've been told the bill that passed Congress regarding the fence has been "authorized" but not "funded"...and in addition to that the bill contains provisions to let the White House re-direct the $1.2 billion to other projects as it deems necessary for national security.  For now Tom appears to be "all hat and no cattle" in regards to his fence -- but it does make for great re-election soundbites
[ Parent ]
I believe that's correc t, FarmBoy....
.....it's authorized but not fully-funded, and to the extent that it is funded, the administration has discretion in where and how this barrier is erected (i.e., fence, video cameras, minefield, moat and draw bridge, whatever).
  Not only does it help Tancredo in C.D. 6 this year, but it may be the gift that will keep giving to him in years to come. 
  It should guarantee him somewhere between 10% and 15% of the vote in the N. H. primary in '08 (more if he's the only xenophobe on the ballot running against a couple of multi-cultural RINO's like McCain and Giuliani).
  More importantly, in a three-way split with Bill Owens and another GOP candidate (maybe Scott McGinnis), it could actually win him the Republican nomination for Wayne Allard's seat in '08.
[ Parent ]
Ritter probably gave info to Beauprez
First of all, I have no idea how the Beauprez campaign got their research for the ad.

Nonetheless, anyone who has looked up PUBLICLY available case files can often find all sorts of personal and what should otherwise be 'confidential' information.  That's because Bill Ritter's prosecutors usually pull those reports and leave them in the file.

For any of the multitude of self-proclaimed legal experts on this site, you would know this.

It is more than reasonable that this may be the case here.  Either way, BILL RITTER'S OFFICE HAS BROKEN ANY LAWS that restrict the release of such information to the public.  THOUSANDS OF TIMES.

Dont' take my word for it, go down and pull cases yourself.  Serious cases, not jaywalking cases that you could then come back and tell me I'm wrong.

Ironically, it was probably Bill Ritter's office who provided the "confidential" information to Beauprez.

ahh, there you are......
you snuck in just as I was posting......glad to see you're still with us!
[ Parent ]
As hard as it is...
someone's got to instill some reason and legitimacy to this site. 
[ Parent ]
What does that have to do with your posts though?
[ Parent ]
I forget
are you one of the 85% Democrats on here or one of the 15% disillusioned Republicans who's voting Democrat this year?
[ Parent ]
Moonraker
You really think there are 15% Republicans in here?
[ Parent ]
Again you don't know what your talking about
NCIC database information isn't left on the table in either the Denver DA's office or any other prosecutors office for public consumption.

The way this works in reality may help you understand why your candidate or his staff are in trouble.  Only authorized individuals in law enforcement with a password are allowed to use the database and only for law enforcement purposes.  Political TV ads certainly do not fit into the definition of law enforcement.

The only way the Beauprez campaign could have put his latest attack ad together is from information accessed through the NCIC database.  That means that someone on Beauprez's behalf who has a password accessed the database illegally and it won't be hard to find out who.  The NCIC system retains records of who accessed the database and what files they reviewed.  All the Colorado Bureau of Investigation need do is run the name of the convict used in the commercial and the system will immediately tell them who has been looking at that file.

By the way, you should advise the Beauprez campaign that if they use any more criminal cases for additional attack ads, I'm sure someone will be checking to see if the same or some other individual accessed the NCIC database to obtain information on those individuals.  I'm betting they already have because Beauprez planned to use a whole series of "Cold Case Files." 

Bottom line:  Someone is in serious legal trouble.

[ Parent ]
Unfortunately, they are left in the case files
for all to see.  In thousands and thousands of cases, prosecutors have placed the entire NCIC print out in the jacket for the general public to see and to copy.  The DP terminal number is there, the date, the time of access, the FBI number, SID number, SSN, alias, and so on.

What I am fascinated by is just how seriously some are taking this breach.  I note with what relish the Rocky Mountain News listed the penalty of "10 years imprisonment" for accessing data that is thrown around willy nilly.  I'm a bit sad when I recall how they defended Bill Ritter's plea bargain that saw a hit-and-run driver get just 15 months for killing a very small girl.

15 months for the death of a little girl is fine, but do something against a politician we support and you've gone too far. 

It's just a bit sad.  The partisanship about such things.  And from a newspaper.

[ Parent ]
Cry me a freaking river
Your side inflates what happens in every overburdened criminal justice system in America into this giant-ass crisis because your candidate is losing his clueless ass, and have the balls to cry "partisanship" when things start looking bad for you?

The Beauprez campaign for governor is so fundamentally stupid, so contrived, so baseless at the end of it that all they can do is invent this worthless smear that smears thousands of good people in addition to Bill Ritter. And it gets worse:

Do you think voters haven't noticed that practically every one of these exposes is about a person with a Hispanic surname, legal or not? Not only have you inpugned that good name of prosecutors everywhere who have to make the EXACT SAME CALLS, you're openly exploiting Hispanics while you do it. Oo, scary invader Mexicans. Look at all their different names. You make me sick.

And now we learn that you have violated these people's fucking right to privacy, accessing secure law enforcement databases for privileged information about these people? If it's all right there as you claim, why can't the news media find it?

Enjoy that temporary five-point bump in the polls, jerkoff. You're going to pay dearly for it.

[ Parent ]
Calm down young man
First off, it is not my side.  Let's just say that I am not so enamoured with right-of-center Democrats as are you.  And we would probably disagree about sexual identity or ethnicity as being the ultimate divides in, what I still call, the class war.

All your cursing aside, I have not violated anyone's privacy.  That distinction goes to the DA's office and to the Courts.  But please don't take my word for it, or the media's, or your candidate's.  Perhaps for the first time in your life, find out for yourself.  Go to the record room and discover, see for yourself.

You know, you have quite a mouth in a place like this.  Why don't you take your mouth and go down to an average working class bar and walk up to the barman and call him a "jerkoff".  I suspect that you would be the one paying dearly.

Goodnight sonny boy.

[ Parent ]
If that were true, wouldn't Ritter be playing this a little differently?
This morning's AP story doesn't indicate that he's worried about such a backfire. And it doesn't look like the CBI is pooh-poohing this like you are, either.

http://hosted.ap.org...

The Colorado Bureau of Investigation has launched an inquiry into whether a federal database was illegally used for details in a Rep. Bob Beauprez television ad against gubernatorial candidate Bill Ritter, officials confirmed Saturday.

Ritter campaign spokesman, Evan Dreyer, said Ritter has turned over a complete list of 152 cases to determine if one person accessed other cases on the list.

Department of Public Safety spokesman Lance Clem said they started the investigation after Ritter's attorney sent a letter to state officials Friday.

"There are a number of potential statute violations," Clem said.

[ Parent ]
I think Ritter is thinking in the very short term,
say three weeks, and not looking at the long term ramifications.  Kind of like George Bush and Iraq.  Typical politician stuff.

It's interesting that Ritter asked the CBI to investigate the source of the ID number but doesn't dispute the facts.

The Post disputes the facts by doing a bad job of looking for the cases.

Why doesn't the Post ask the CBI to investigate the case, in the public interest, and determine if it is the same person?

Oh, wait . . . it's the Post.  Never mind.

Finally, read the case law provided by Bill Ritter's lawyer, United States v. Jordan, and you will see just how big a deal this is.

[ Parent ]
Guillermo Horton
  Ustedes se recuerdan quien era Willie Horton? 
  I think the racist bastards running the Both Ways' campaign are now channeling Lee Atwater....
  I wonder if Bob Martinez, chair of the state GOP, is at all troubled by the color of the defendants in these ads.  Probably not!
[ Parent ]
Which one is it?
Are we to believe John Marshall, who told us EXACTLY where they got the information from -- "in federal criminal databases" -- or this anonymous blog shill nervously casting dispersions?

I don't know about you, but Moonraker has gone from simply working for a candidate (respectable by itself) to full-on insulting my intelligence. Marshall opened his chump mouth and blew this criminal act wide open. No amount of misdirection is going to change that.

[ Parent ]
And another thing
How could Denver DA case files possibly have information on subsequent convictions that happened years after the defendants were done with Denver, convictions from other counties and states? Are you trying to tell us Denver was all meticulous about putting that stuff into dusty manila folders years after the fact for no goddamn reason? Complete with aliases and corroboration of vital stats?

Say it with me, Moonraker...you...are full...of shit. This one is pathetic even for you.

Thanks for playing, though.

[ Parent ]
OK then
Guess we'll just have to see...
[ Parent ]
Now there's a real man
Gotta love you Moon.
You're willing to go down with the ship.

You're either the most honorable guy who posts here, or dumb as a post (pun not intended, just a consequence of mixing metaphors.)

Best to kill them early instead of letting them possibly need food stamps.
--marilou, 2010

[ Parent ]
Moonraker is to Both Ways.....
what Gordon Liddy was to Nixon.  I believe Moon would throw himself onto a live grenade if it would give Beauprez a five point bump in the polls.
[ Parent ]
You are right there
They certainly wouldn't have subsequent information.  But they usually would have all the aliases, vitals, scars, tattoos, the whole bit from everything up to and including that case.
[ Parent ]
cowboy up, stop lying, and do your time
The information was *not* publicly available - Chan. 4 couldn't find it, Chan 9 couldn't find it, and the Denver Post couldn't find it.  If you bothered to watch the Fox31 database, you'd hear Ritter say he couldn't find it, even as a former law enforcement officer himself.

The only way they could have the case number Marshall talks about is by illegally accessing a law enforcement database.  And releasing that information to the public via a political slime ad is also illegal.

Can you say Plea Bargain, Moonshill?

[ Parent ]
Now I wouldn't be so fast to accuse someone of an illegal act
Someone could get sued.  And I wouldn't take much note of what reporters (especially TV reporters) can or cannot find.  It's a good day if they come up with their hairbrush and makeup.  As for Bill Ritter, do you think he wants to find it?  This is as good as it gets for him.  You don't think he really wanted to find it?

You bring up an interesting dilemma.  While releasing government information is certainly illegal, it can constitute a moral act.  Are you old enough to remember the Pentagon Papers?  A brave soul stood up and took the heat for releasing information that made President Nixon look bad politically.

Another question.  Why shouldn't the public have access to information that could protect us from a violent criminal using several different names?  How many lives are lost because there is no such thing as a publicly or commercially available national criminal records database.

And no spin please when you answer these questions.  They are beyond mere elections, mere candidates or parties.  These are serious questions.

[ Parent ]
huh?
As usual, you're spouting nonsense  and speaking in non sequiturs. And could you be any more patronizing?

The fact that reporters, whose job it is to fact check, couldn't find the information publicly is directly relevant. It's the crux of the problem - the Beauprez campaign couldn't provide public sources for the information that reporters - or anyone else - could verify. 

Try reading the letter from the attorney to CBI before you blather again.
 

[ Parent ]
Nonsense?
Reporters write stories for corporate newspapers.  Their stories are designed to attract readers in their own right, but more importantly in so far as revenue is concerned, to attract readers to the advertisements therein. 

The laws in this country are such that reporters really don't have to fact check all that much.  It is nice when they do, but they really don't have to.

I'm sorry that you are so annoyed and reduced to name calling.  It isn't the sign of someone with a confident argument.

A word of advice.  Rather than just read the letter Bill Ritter's attorney wrote to the CBI, you should read the details of the case he cites.  When you do you will know what a nonsense this is.

[ Parent ]
The case is United States v. Jordan, a good read if you have the time

[ Parent ]
Is that what you're going to testify to...
... when they subpoena you? That Ritter's camp gave you the info? I thought you said you got it from FEDERAL databases.
[ Parent ]
ALAN PHILIP works for the Governor!
Have you been working with John Marshall and his contact at the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, to do illegal background checks?

Looks like this is just more Illegal (maybe even federal prison illegal) coordination on the part of Republicans.

"Suddenly, it may be cool to be American again" - William J. Kole

[ Parent ]
where Moonraker?
Has our resident Both Ways' shill weighed in yet on this issue?
This is a serious issue
Don't try to spin away from this crisis.  And yes, this is a crisis for the Beauprez campaign.

No one likes a congressman who abuses his office.  No one likes a congressman who favors every nth degree of 'sneak and peek' and who supports the notion of suspending privacy acts in the name of 'national security'.

Beauprez suffers from the same affliction all Potomac fevered politicians share: an entitlement complex.

It's not that he's a bad guy - it's just that he can't even consider the possibility that he shouldn't get everything he wants in the world.  To include open access to the federal crime database.  Because, ya know, he's a congressman for Pete's sake.

As for John, he made the colossal mistake of accepting the sealed manila envelop that was dropped off by an anonymous source.  And no - I'm not saying that literally.  It's a metaphor.

But everyone who's been involved in campaigns long enough eventually gets some version of this sealed envelope and suffers a crisis on conscience.  To use it or not? Was is gotten by ill means? Can I verify it? Substantiate it? Enrich it?

Marshall rolled the dice - was obviously backed up by his candidate and media advisers - and opened the friggin envelope. 

And the outcome of all this?

1.  the ads get pulled
2.  the campaign loses even more credibility
3.  journalists scrutinize everything released from John
4.  the campaign spend at least a week spinning it's wheels, trying to back-fact-check their own work
5.  John starts to second-guess himself while dealing with that ache in his stomach
6.  anyone associated with the campaign that might have access to such information is also scrutinized (including Owens?)
7.  and more time will be spent with litigation issues instead of actual, hard campaigning. 

I thought it was unusually quiet yesterday afternoon.  Now I know why... 
 

Or...
The confidential information was in the casefile compiled by Ritter's office - who is now frantically trying to pull as many case files as possible to rid them of all the confidential info they have in them, improperly.

Ritter's gonna have that sick feeling, not Marshall.

[ Parent ]
Here's a quarter, use it to call from jail
This is serious, and no amount of spinning from the Trailhead trolls can save it. If they didn't do anything wrong, why isn't the Beauprez camp opening up their folders and inviting the media over to see it?  If it was legal and aboveboard, they'd have done it by now.

  They got too cute by half following their usual playbook, and it came back to bite them. Now they may be the ones calling their lawyers.

I love how Republicans get all worked up over leaks unless they're used to slime an undercover CIA agent or go after a good man.

Goodbye and good riddance.

[ Parent ]
Perhaps they will invite the media to another press conference....
to see their investigators' work product only to cancel at the last minute without explanation........yet again!
[ Parent ]
To be sure, these guys are fools
Can you imagine showing such a harsh ad without any documentation to hand?  This is why people stop voting.
[ Parent ]
You're right
This is why people stop voting.
[ Parent ]
Moonshill,
we're talking about a conviction in California AFTER the creepo was convicted in Colorado. 

So let me make this simple... guy pleads guilty here, serves time, goes to California, is arrested again, uses an alias, and his prints trigger a match in Colorado for the previous conviction though a different name comes up.  But California has their man, thank you very much, and they have his file of previous arrests (very nice) as well as his conviction report and information on time served (nice and neat.)

So tell me - when did the Denver DA call the California DA to upend that info into the nice tan folder that's been siting in records division for over two years?

Go have a beer.  You're done here tonight.

[ Parent ]
Well explained
The Colorado case file would have stopped with the Colorado case.  And no DA would have added information to a closed case.  Now if he committed a crime after California, it would be a different matter.  Are we sure he didn't?

Are we sure the media has all the names this guy has used and all the DOBs?  It is very difficult for a member of the public to conduct an accurate national search of criminal records.  This is a shame and a disgrace, but there it is.

It is also important to remember that the public criminal records databases in some states do list the FBI number.  That's the number you would need to link all these cases together.  It isn't in the public CBI database, but is probably available from the case file in Colorado.  I don't know about California, except to note that a newspaper story stating that court records there were not public records is complete nonsense.  Of course they are.  How could they not be under an American legal system?

[ Parent ]
I'm starting to understand your moniker
If the California DA was as negligent as Bill Ritter in his recrod-keeping, than it would have been extremely easy to get that information.
[ Parent ]
That's a really good analysis, BUT...
Ritter needs to keep pounding right back on the specific attacks against him and not just raise the new issue of misuse of confidential information. I think the average public won't get as riled up about the confidentiality issue as you think.

It'll be interesting to see whether the percentages of votes in early voting differs at all from the votes on Nov. 7 - i.e., whether these last desperate efforts by Beauprez will have any effect.

[ Parent ]
Sorry, I haven't been doing too well,
but this subject interests me.  Maybe we should all have a little field trip down to the records room (the reporters who read this certainly should).

Go in, fill out the little slip of paper, and ask for a few cases.  What you'll typically find is a Denver PD Arrest Record with all those confidential numbers on it.  Very often there's a federal/multi-state offender search with all those confidential numbers again, inserted into the file by the prosecutor.  Almost always, you will find a CBI offender search, not the public one, but the one law enforcement uses (again, with all those little numbers).

This is a really good parry on Bill Ritter's part.  He completely bent Beauprez's thrust.  But the big issue of where the confidential numbers came from could be resolved in an afternoon, if someone chose to do so.

Which brings up a different point.  If all these numbers are so confidential and so available (even on innocent people who have been arrested, booked, case dismissed or found innocent) what is going on with Denver's courts and the DA's office that so much of it is available?

Maybe some enterprising young attorney (Toodles, are you reading?) should organize a class action suit against the city/county/state for improperly releasing the confidential data of what must be thousands and thousands of individuals who have been arrested but have been found to have committed no crime.

That would earn some brass.

But if that's how BWB's camp got the info, why didn't they just SAY so?
Why did Marshall see the need to back away from his initial claim that the federal database information matched up? Why hasn't the Beauprez camp simply responded, "Hey, we got the info from the files - look at the file yourself!"

I doubt the courts and prosecutors have the resources to pull and shred all the FBI, etc. information from defendants' files - and why would they? Instead isn't it simply the law that you can't use that info for improper purposes? (Non-law-enforcement purposes.)

[ Parent ]
You are right
Marshall's comments make me wonder too.  Very poorly handled to put out such an ad without the documentation at hand.

But I haven't seen a complete recitation of the research processes carried out by any of the other principals in this drama.  It is not enough for Bill Ritter to say he can't find it, that's political spin.  It's not enough for the press to say they can't find it, that doesn't surprise me.  These principals should lay out publicly exactly what they did to find it.  Then we would be able to comment more intelligently on where or how they went wrong.

If Denver prosecutors were properly trained they would know to remove this information.  Other jurisdictions regularly do.  There are also indications that they know they should.  Sometimes Denver prosecutors take the trouble to draw an X through such documents.  Of course, an X the width of a pencil point really doesn't cover anything up, but it is enough to establish wanton misfeasance.

The Courts currently provide such discretion with case files involving victims of sexual assaults.

Regarding the law.  I'm a great believer in the People's right to know when there is a potential danger.  For years corporations, the military and government argued that people didn't have the right to know when there were hazards in their communities.  Those laws and regulations were gradually challenged, breached, and overcome and today we are all better for it. 

I hold that we need a public national database of convicted offenders in order to protect ourselves and our families.  We live in a highly mobile country.  We should be able to access a government system to see if the babysitter, using a different name in another state, was once arrested for theft or violent assault.  I think it is the next mountain in the right-to-know climb.

[ Parent ]
Toddles, here's your breakthrough case...
"Wanton misfeasance".  Put an advertisement in the newspapers (some revenue would be nice for them) and get anyone exonerated in the last 15 years to go down to the record room and request their files.  Write a descriptor of which documents and numbers to look for.  Tell them to get back to you and sign on as a party.  Get on this.
[ Parent ]
Toodles, sorry for getting your handle wrong.

[ Parent ]
andy bradshaw,
your writing style is very similar to a good guy that used to write here. The only difference I can see is that you hold your tongue and don't explode when dealing with blind one sided arrogance.
Your old pen name isn't "Voyageur" by any chance is it?

NoBama .... NoBamaCare either
[ Parent ]
No, I read the site for a while before
dipping my toe in.  This Internet stuff is very foreign to us old guys.
[ Parent ]
Ah Voyaguer
I miss him...
[ Parent ]
I miss him on this site
but I get to read him with some regularity in the Denver Post.

It also looks like he lost the battle on a number of congressional endorsements in the Post yesterday.

[ Parent ]
Okay, gotta ask
Who is Voyageur? He dropped out before I started blogging here, although I have read some of the old diaries (it's fascinating to see how far off some people's predictions were) and he was a good conservative voice. You say he's a Post columnist? Which one?

"The fact that we Dems can't rebuild the house does not mean you bring back the [Republicans] who burned it down." - DavidThi808
[ Parent ]
Voyageur
I'll let someone else tell you who he is/was - but I can tell you it was great reading the exchanges between him, Iron Mike, Go Raiders, Phoenix, Bad Moon...
[ Parent ]
Iron Mike
He was rumored to be some bigwig in the GOP wasn't he?

"The fact that we Dems can't rebuild the house does not mean you bring back the [Republicans] who burned it down." - DavidThi808
[ Parent ]
Demetrius
Bill Owens was supposed to be "Demetrius" or some Russian name like that.
[ Parent ]
Im just trying to survive Torts
Which for me is hard enough in itself. This is interesting though, and while I am sure that there is a class i can take that describes everything that is going on I have yet to take it. Us 1Ls, get a pretty bland first year. I am eagerly awaiting the conclusion of this.
[ Parent ]
Go find yourself a good trial lawyer
and strike a deal.  You do the leg work.  Let him or her be the lead.  Back in the day, lawyers learned by clerking.  It would be a good experience.
[ Parent ]
That would be a good internship
Unfeasible right now, but come summertime that wouldnt be a bad idea.
[ Parent ]
why waste your time and money on law school.....
just look at all the torts being committed on this blog.......
[ Parent ]
Well...
Nobody has committed trespass on the chattels on this blog that I am aware of.
[ Parent ]
I should pay closer attention
but what was Ritter's explanation for the 'trespassing on farmland' plea bargains?
My understanding
(1) The DA's office didn't feel they had enough evidence to be confident of conviction

(2) Therefore, they wanted to plea bargain

(3) The legal aliens wouldn't agree to plead guilty to anything that would get them deported.  They'd go to trial and take their chances.

(4) The agricultural land charge was one of the few that would not trigger deportation, so there would be some punishment (DA is happy) but no deportation (defendant is willing to plead).

Whether you think this is acceptable or not really turns on whether you think plea bargains are acceptable or not.  If not, the legal system will have to change substantially - currently we do not have the capacity to try more than a small fraction of the cases that come through the DA's office.  So the DA's try the case they will probably win and plead out the marginal cases.

[ Parent ]
Good recap

[ Parent ]
800 lbs Gorilla
Yeah, that's a good recap if you ignore the mountain of evidence.  Everyone here is a regular Johnny Cochran.  "What proof your honor?"

The fact is, Ritter did have enough evidence.  His excuse for not prosecuting isn't the mountain of evidence.  It is what he calls the lack of resources.

Again, either jam the criminals in there (who's going to compain outside of the criminals) or hold a press conference everytime you decide to let go a very dangerous criminal.  Bill Ritter did neither.  He just let them go and gave a muddled answer when asked (if ever).

[ Parent ]
That's crap
I have yet to hear any PROOF that there was adequate evidence to take any of these cases to trial - that a plea bargain shouldn't have been offered. The only one trying to act like a second-guessing trial lawyer is you, Moonraker.

"Who's going to complain outside of the criminals"? It's that attitude that invites lawsuits by ACLU, etc. that end up being extremely costly to the taxpayers who are suddenly forced by the courts to build new jails, etc. But you don't care, because your short-term attitude gets your man elected.

[ Parent ]
Please.
This from the same Moonraker who once said we should deport all kinds of criminals, citizens or not. Now he says we should overcrowd the prisons even more because 'nobody will complain except the criminals?' Is there a prosecutor anywhere in this country that wouldn't laugh you out of their office over this?

You think this can't get any thinner, any more stilted and ridiculous, any more offensive to those who actually work in our overburdened criminal justice system...and out come the Beauprez shills with something even worse.

[ Parent ]
You seem
to be an expert at everything.  And just in case we didn't know, you're sure to tell us!  Your parents must be proud. 

I never said to deport people out of the country.  I was making a point about my thoughts on the general public's attitude and you took it out of context.  Typical.

Bill Ritter did little for someone in his position to really shine a spotlight on his budget problems.  He bitched about it on occassion, like any bureaucrat, but never really did anything about it.  He could have.

Meanwhile, there are DA's out there who have the right intentions and don't find excuses not to do the right thing.  http://articles.news... 
You're just an enabler. 

[ Parent ]
Good for this rookie DA!
Cracking down on drunk drivers. That's commendable. And it's a good thing Pete Coors wasn't tooling his partied-out ass around her jurisdiction, isn't it? Do you think she's deporting every illegal alien in Nassau County, New York? Bahahaha! You make me laugh like a clown.

Your thinking that average Americans would really want to deport native-born citizens, criminals or not, is a pretty big window into the screwed-up psychology that winds your clock, pal. And once again, you're pissing on thousands of hardworking prosecutors around the county just to get your weak-minded Beltway farm implement into the Governor's Mansion.

I'm no "expert," you're just not a very good shill...

[ Parent ]
Turns out
we have 85% Dems, 14% 'reformed' Republicans and 1 defense attorney now.  Just once it would be nice for your kind to think of the victim before the criminal.

It's disgusting that killers, major drug dealers and the like get off with incredibly light sentences.  It's even more disgusting that you promote it.

You happily defend some of the most disgusting people just to stick it to 'the man.'  Then you piss & moan that someone criticizes your bread 'n' butter - plea bargains.

Little girl gets run over & killed.  You say "that sucks, but 15 mos. is more than enough for the killer."  Grandma & baby get beat, "that sucks too.  But two wrongs don't make a right so why would we want to punish that guy either?"  Girl gets decapitated by a drunk driver in NY and the DA wants to prosecute for murder "that's outrageous!  I am outraged!  The killer should be given hope!"

If Bill Ritter successfully prosecutes a criminal to a prison sentence, who is physically going to tell him no?  And, if the National Guard were called out to do it - why wouldn't Bill Ritter hold a press conference as he lets the guy go because he has been FORCED to do so?

Bill Ritter had a choice.  He could have prosecuted criminals to appropriate sentences.  He could have actually done more than tell a sub-committee on something that he had budget problems.  Or he could plea-bargain the shit out of everyone like an assembly line to get his "successful prosecution" rate up so he could run on it for governor.

Bill Ritter ended his tenure as Denver had one of the highest crime rates in the country.  Higher than LA or NYC!!  You have little to no personal or professional standards and that explains a lot.

[ Parent ]
where was Moonraker when Ritter was running for re-election as D.A.?
  Why did the Denver GOP not highlight all of these abominations committed by Bill Ritter when he sought re-election? 
  I don't remember hearing any criticism of Ritter's plea bargains from the GOP nominee for D.A.?  Oh wait a minute, there WAS no GOP nominee for D.A. when Ritter ran for re-election. 
  Enough said! 
[ Parent ]
P.S. And wasn't Both Ways the state GOP chair....
.....the last time Ritter ran for re-election?  And was not candidate recruitment a responsibility of the party chair?
  By failing to recruit and run an opponent against Ritter, Beauprez was tacitly endorsing the job Ritter did!
[ Parent ]
From 2001
"But the GOP's Beauprez said he'd like to see Ritter on the  Republican bench. He called Ritter a 'standup guy' whom he'd like  to recruit, explaining: 'He has some opinions that are consistent  with our party.'"

Denver Post, August 29, 2001 "Ritter won't run for Senate DA's decision a boost for Strickland camp" By Howard Pankratz and Mike Soraghan, Denver Post Staff Writers

[ Parent ]
That's not entirely how it works
In most cases like this, the trespass charge isn't one of the original charges.  The DA adds the charge and drops the original charges.  This is a mockery to say the least, because the individual is punished for something he or she didn't do, while getting off for those things he or she did do.

It is a corruption of the system, pure and simple.  Laws have been passed by our elected representatives in Congress that mandate deportation when a crime is committed at a certain level.  These laws are very popular and represent the will of the People of the United States of America.

Who is any prosecutor to thwart the will of the People in this way?  What prosecutor is above the law?  It is arrogance and malfeasance.

No wonder people don’t vote.

[ Parent ]
Oh Andy...
Haven't you ever heard of people pleading down a moving violation to a broken mirror or the like to avoid getting points for a traffic ticket? Is that "corruption, arrogance and malfeasance"?
[ Parent ]
It's absurd, that's why
Andy is showing you just how far they'll go -- they'll attack DA across the country to get at Bill Ritter. They'll attack plea bargains when without them the criminal justice system would collapse. They know this, just like Pete Coors knows it -- they're counting on the average citizen not knowing it.

There's no absurd grandstand, no patent violation of a person's civil liberties, no sleazy lie these people won't embrace to get Bob Beauprez elected governor.

[ Parent ]
Sir, you are playing the radical here
and the object of your radicalism is a quite conventional, grey moderate. 

The record of the plea bargain system and many prosecutors across the country does deserve to be addressed.  Each day in this country 15 or more murders are committed by convicted criminals released under supervision onto the streets on probation or work release or community detention or some other such program.  Up to 150,000 violent crimes are committed each year by offenders under supervision.

This is the difference between you and me.  For you, the fact that 15 human beings meet violent deaths each day is business as usual.  For me, it means the criminal justice system HAS collapsed.

[ Parent ]
A traffic violation is not the same as the sale of heroin
and yes, to plead guilty to a broken mirror if there wasn't a broken mirror in the first place is a corruption of the system.  It is a lie.  It makes the law we live under a dealer in lies and a corruption.

Why worry about speeding through a residential area with children if you can plead it down to a broken mirror?  The law will lie for you and you'll go on speeding and speeding and speeding until one day you hit a small child and smash his brains to bits.

I'm a little surprised at your cynicism about this.

[ Parent ]
That's wonderful but
Whatever larger philosophical objections you have about plea bargains or American justice in the broader sense are not why we're here today.

If Bob Beauprez wasn't running against a former DA, would he be decrying plea bargains right now, three weeks before the election? For that matter, would you?

Don't BS me. Holding Bill Ritter up to a standard that no prosecuting authority could be expected to live up to -- and who would laugh at you for the very suggestion -- reveals exactly why we're having this stupid discussion.

It's because Bob Beauprez is set up to lose his ass on Election Day, and this hyperbolic load of uninformed smear is all you people have got to muddy the waters with.

It's sad, really, but it's only symptomatic of the real problem. Someday you'll realize that you should have run Holtzman or Hank Brown or anybody other than this sorry cheese-dick PE major with absolutely nothing to offer the people of Colorado.

[ Parent ]
Brokeback Bob
You spend too much time dancing around the issue.  Tell us what you really think!

But seriously, don't you think if the R's had picked Holtzman, Brown, or any other R, he'd be just as big a "cheese-dick" to the supporters of the other guy?

[ Parent ]
things would be different without Both Ways
  Hank Brown could, and probably would, have beaten Ritter if he had been the GOP nominee. 
  Holtzman probably would be running an exciting, aggressive but ultimately losing campaign against Ritter.
  Holtzman would be talking about the radical surgery he would do on state govt. (and probably frightening some people with it while thrilling others), instead of ranting about ten-year plea bargains. 
  IMHO, neither Hank Brown nor Marc Holtzman is a cheese dick.
[ Parent ]
Hank is Colorado's Giuliani
And he's one of several reasonable Republicans in Colorado that could have united the voters instead of making them hate Republicans.

Holtzman would have gotten destroyed, but at least he's kind of witty. Beauprez is just a humorless, tiresome person to listen to. With no substantive values or platform. That's why he has to smear his opponents instead of running on his merits.

It's a good thing for the Democrats that the Owens Faction is way too corrupt to ever let a decent Republican be governor.

[ Parent ]
You are genuinely nasty, aren't you?
Well, sometimes it can't be helped.  But I ask you, "Why have an enemy when a friend will do?"

As anyone on this blog will tell you, most of what I talk about concerns the criminal justice system and most of that has been about plea bargains. 

Some people see everything as political (I hope you see yourself in that comment) so I'm going to wait until after these elections are over with to start a diary here that centers on criminal justice issues and yes, a lot of that will be about reforming the plea bargain system to keep violent criminals off the streets so they don't hurt people like you and me and everyone else who posts here. 

Now maybe you think that's a bad thing, so I guess we disagree.

Finally, what do you know about the "standards" of "prosecuting authorities"?  I know a great deal, but I invite you to join in the discussion on my diary.  I'm going to kick it off the week after Remembrance Sunday.

[ Parent ]
Can someone remind me please....
Just what were the details of Pete Coor's plea bargain on his DUI? 
[ Parent ]
It's in the newspapers
I suspect no plea bargain has been more written about in the history of man.  A boring little case about another rather grey man.
[ Parent ]
Doubtful
I have in-laws whose daughter was killed by a drunk driver.  They don't take any DUI case lightly, even one by another grey old man -- who just happens to put a lot of money into the Trailhead coffers, thus directly funding the attacks on Ritter's plea-bargain record.
[ Parent ]
Agreed
Coors' case shouldn't be taken lightly.  I was merely noting that it had been written about to distraction.

The Coors' case is one more indication of the corruption of the system.  Big shots very often get a break from prosecutors, because prosecutors often put politics before the law.  Remember some years ago when Bill Ritter let off the Republican Speaker on a charge of domestic violence?

And do you remember the time that rich kid (I think his dad owned a department store or something) walked into a coffee shop and stuck a gun in a poor clerk's face and robbed him?  Ritter's office said it wasn't a gun crime because the gun's safety was on.  The rich kid walked.

These cases indicate a systemic corruption.  I've long held that the police get far more scrutiny and oversight than do prosecutors, and yet the latter hold far more power.  We need to address this, although I doubt a former prosecutor will.  I hope he proves me wrong.

[ Parent ]
thanks for the reminder.......what is Doug Dean doing these days?
  I remember that case, and Ritter DID decline to prosecute.  That might have had something to do with the fact that the "victim" was going ahead her plans to marry the "suspect" of the allegd crime.  A pretrial witness sequstration order would have really put a dampener on their honeymoon...
  Oh well, I'm sure Moonraker will let us know how troubled he is over Ritter's lax treatment of Doug Dean.  Politicians protecting other politicians.......
[ Parent ]
I agree with Andy
No criticism of Ritter here, but the practice of people pleading to crimes they did not commit is flawed.  I have no problem with plea bargains, they are necessary to move the cases along, but there should be a way to be honest in the process.
[ Parent ]
So we could do better
That is a valid point and I agree.  Although our system of justice in the US is better than most countries, we can do better.

But I haven't seen anyone refute that these cases Beauprez brought out include subsequent convictions.  That is a damning piece of information, is it not?

[ Parent ]
Thanks Emma

[ Parent ]
The Rocky Mtn News reported more

about the cases in its article on September 30 than the Denver Post's article:

Rocky Mtn News Article: "Fresh attack in race for guv"

First item:

"Ritter said there were circumstances in each of the cases that led to the plea bargains, including the involvement of one police detective who was under investigation for criminal wrongdoing."

Second item:

"A Republican immigration attorney said it's unclear whether any of the legal immigrants cited in documents provided by the Beauprez campaign to support the ad would have been at risk of deportation by federal immigration authorities."

I find it interesting that the Medina-Ramo case is the first case after the handful raised by the Beauprez campaign and Trailhead/etc where the Ritter campaign has questioned the source of the records rather than relying on the fact checking/truth testing/ad watching reporters. Perhaps this case was one where the Ritter campaign could not find anything in the Denver courthouse records to link to the California case, and then having John Marshall bragging about using federal records just helped connect the dots. Unable to research all aspects of the cases, they hit back with the issue that galled them. One of the press reports I watched or read said these cases with supposedly the same guy had different dates of birth.

Using federal resources for political advantage isn't unprecedented. Was it Congressman Tom DeLay who used the Department of Homeland Security to track flights of the Texas Democratic state legislators during the 2003 or 2004 gerrymander efforts?


[ Parent ]
Justice "DeLayed"
Well, yes, Tom DeLay apparently abused the power of his federal office in a number of ways, and though justice has been "DeLayed" in his case, at least some of his crimes will catch up with him. 

The average voter is (more than) tired of attack ads, election advantage gained illegally, and "emergency" election rules adopted for the advantage of one party over another.  Clean it up.

Yes, and open up the process to third parties and independents
over time they have been a key engine for progressive reform.
[ Parent ]
Owens "speeds (CBI) campaign probe"?
Has Bill suddenly gotten honest election fever?

Or, is the rat swimming from a sinking ship?

Or,

Or.

Someone, quick, fill in the blanks!

My observation is that this, if the Bow-prey campagin broke the law, is yet another Republican arrogance.  People who believe in a class system of superiors and inferiors believe that they are above the law. "Taxes are for little people." Remember who said that?

Did you see John Temple's piece yesterday about a Republican - natch - candidate using that beautiful, almost sacred photo by Todd Heisman for his campaign without permission? 

Yes, Democrats occasionally suffer from the same defect from time to time, but they are far fewer, and I don't think that it derives from Federalist-Hamiltoniam-Monarchial philosophies.  Just plain "too big for his/her britches." 

I think that one reason Hickenlooper got elected is that he refused, and still refuses to take himself too seriously.  What a blast of fresh air in the political swamp.

PR

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd." -Bertrand Russell

parsingreality
Your broad brush comments about Republicans aside, I agree with you about Hick.  He doesn't take himself too seriously.  That and his business background make him a very attractive D.
Hick is awesome
I met him on the street one night. He was just out traipsing around, and stopped to talk for about 15 minutes. Nice guy, vey down to earth.
[ Parent ]
Just Amazin
how much the far-right is doing a heavy amount of flop-sweat right now.  Just because beauprez was caught doing the usual repub stuff, they are going bezerky trying to cover it with all sorts of horsepatooie.  The same thing is going on with the gay repubs being outed as the despicable beings they are. All sorts of screaming squealing and just plain crying going on there too (http://blogactive.co...)
  They really do have problems accepting legal ramifications of breaking the law, sort of like everybody has to accept. Only they are not used to be accountable.

Blue Bronc
All authority quickly becomes the law
Our Congress, Republicans and Democrats alike, busy themselves each year to hole the law for the benefit of their supporters and financiers.  I do not see the purity you do in one team over the other, and the strange caucuses and alliances created in Congress to write these loop holes bears me out.  Party often means very, very little.

And what do we get when the basic text is so riddled that the common man needs a lawyer and the lawyer a specialist to decipher it?  We get a text that ceases to be moral.

[ Parent ]
As for me
I am sitting here drinking a nice tumbler of a single-malt scotch and wondering how long it takes a campaign these days to cut and run an ad.

Because I'd love to see some enterprising 527 tear a new one into the BB campaign.  Something like: accused of violating our nations privacy laws for political purposes.  They could even do some pull-quotes from the stories that have run for the last three days, and add in the Marshall quote of Federal numbers matching up. 

Priceless, really.

Which Scots whiskey?
I hope it's Oban or Talisker.  My favourites.  And there are also some good blended session whiskeys like The Famous Grouse and Ballantine's.  I wish I was joining you but the stomach has not been so good these days and the quack has put me on steroids.
[ Parent ]
Too bad - brother in law taught in Scotland and
though I don't drink them he brought me single malts (the one I remember is Ardbeg) and the Bushmills single malts. Sort of the old pork chop trick - amkazing how many friends my scots whiskey collection has.
[ Parent ]
Bushmills is Irish whiskey
You could argue that it is an Ulster whiskey and so, Scots-Irish.
[ Parent ]
Agreed, but most people don't realize they make
a single malt version. Got it as a going away present from an Irish firm I worked for (based out of Dublin, no less).
[ Parent ]
An orange whiskey from a green town...
how ecumenical.
[ Parent ]
As for me
I'm a Dahlwhinnie man, myself.
[ Parent ]
If it were me...
I would use the Plea Bargain Issue to take out two birds with one stone. How you ask???

Simple. Compare your plea bargain record with Jon Suthers Republican AG candidate.  As I have said before, Ritter's record was no worse than Suther's.

Suther's is from the conservative bastion of El Paso County.  Ritter from the more liberal bastion of Denver.  If Ritter's record is stronger, then why not use it?

I cautioned the Repubs that this strategy may come into play and that they (BWB) might be opening themselves up for more trouble than they expected.  Contrary to popular beliefe, I can't for the life of me figure out why the AG's race is as flat as it is.  Suther's (as most DA's Offices) use the Plea Bargain to streamline costs and reduce court time.  Common fact.

If I were in a debate, I would respond to BWB with something along the lines of..."Your Right Bob.  I did Plea Bargain numerous cases.  However, my record was no worse than those of other DA's throughout the state.  To include the current Republican AG Candidate himself."

There's just one problem and it is why Ritter hasn't.
Ritter doesn't know what he pled those cases down to, because his office didn't keep adequate records.  Every other DA's office in the state can tell you, for instance, how many F1 cases were pled down to F2.  The Denver office can't, because it didn't participate in the system, and from what I understand, doesn't maintain an independent, parallel system.

Now this is unique and remarkable amongst major DA's offices, but there it is.

So while Suther's could tell you exactly how many Attempted Murder cases he pled down to assault, Ritter cannot.  So we cannot make a comparison, because we don't know how far down Ritter pled his cases.  If the agricultural trespass scandal is anything to go on (and making up a charge that didn't happen and adding it so you can drop all the charges that did is a scandal, and if you don't believe me I'll write to the top ten DAs in the country and post their responses on my diary in November) Ritter pled down pretty far.

But the People will never know, will they, because record keeping was so God awful under old Bill.  Hope he does better as Governor.  The Right to Know, the Right to Know, my friends is nothing to dismiss lightly.

[ Parent ]
And????
Man, the perfection we expect from our politicians would be well placed if we demanded it from ourselves. In the big picture, if this allegation is true, SO WHAT?

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd." -Bertrand Russell

[ Parent ]
I'm not talking perfection here, although we, each of us,
should strive in our daily lives to do better, day by day, and so grow in a higher direction (because we grow never-the-less, and if we are not directing that growth to the better it will grow in other directions).  Sorry, I digress.

What I'm looking for here is adherence to a uniform standard.  Bill Ritter's office chose to go their own way.  That is their business, but their decision leaves us unable to make a real comparison.  That's all.

In other, more personal ways, I'm sure Bill is still working at doing better.  I'm sure he still consults his Thomas A Kempis, and has perhaps gone deeply into the Saint Teresa's Book of Foundations. 

I'm not talking about him personally, just his office and the way it maintained records, which can be established as fact.

[ Parent ]
initiative and referenda
I get concerned when I see seemingly well informed people struggling with the ballot initiatives and referenda.  Here is the scoop on some of the big ones - 39 sucks, (the so-called 65% solution) it takes away local control, is an attempt to undermine public education, is a huge disadvantage to rural school districts with large transportation budgets since that is not included in the 65% and poor districts who perhaps pay more for heat or other things because their buildings are less energy efficient and energy costs are outside the 65%, as is safety and security. No correlation has been shown in the states that have imposed something similar in improved class room performance. This is a sham.

40 (Term limits for judges) Sucks big time as well.  Do we really want our judges to be the most inexperienced persons in the courtroom?  If you think there is a court backlog now, see what happens with wholesale judicial turnover.  And don't we have separation of powers so the courts will not be political and unduly influenced by politicians?  We recently had an attempt to impeach a judge because conservatives didn't like the fact that the judge awarded joint custody to a gay parent.  If one governor gets to appoint 5 of 7 judges at one time the  judiciary becomes completely politicized.

41 - Ethics in Government.  This one makes my skin crawl.  Do the proponents really think that every state employee, county employee, municipal employee and government contractors, their spouses and their children must be limited to gifts from only relatives and close friends on special occasions or to $50 per year from anyone else. Hey am I a close enough friend and is this a special enough occasion that I can give you a $52 Christmas present? This would prohibit the county janitor's child from accepting a scholarship, and if the uniform costs more than $50 would require that they be the only kid on the little league team to pay for their own uniform.  Yes, Amendment 41 prohibits lobbyist gifts to legislators, but it also prohibits a lobbyist from having a friend over for dinner, unless the friend pays, if the friend works for government in any capacity, even if it is an entity that is not policy making. Then it sets up a commission with subpoena powers that will investigate complaints.  Can you say Big Brother?  Can you say campaign fodder?  Amendment 41 is an idea that should be scaled back to be reasonable. It goes way to far. 

Term Limits for judges can be a very good thing because
many simply lose their edge, some their interest, after a few years.  The law shouldn't be so distant from the People, it should be such that any reasonably competent person should be able to argue his or her own case.  When we get to the point where only members of a jumped up trade guild get to deal with the law the People have lost the law and the system can no longer be called democratic.

This is my trouble with concerns about "experience".  It creates an elect, an elite, and over time takes the law from the People.

[ Parent ]
That's the whole point;...
Of having a judiciary that is NOT responsive to the people. I don't want them elected, I don't want them term limited.  I want them distant from the popular passions that come and go with time.

John Andrews, the perp behind this ballot item is a spoiled child.  Sadly, the average voter doesn't know an executive from a judicial from a corn flake.  John is also a hypocrite, kissing MLK's historical ass while he positions himself in every case against the things MLK fought and died for. 

I also question your allegation about jurists "losing their edge." Examples?  What is an edge, come to think of it? 

You want a popularly responsive judiciary?  Try the French Revolution, or the Red Brigages in China.

PR

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd." -Bertrand Russell

[ Parent ]
Falling asleep at trial...
You expect human judges to become gods.  They cannot be.  If we make these men the final arbiters in an era when laws are made from the bench we invite authoritarian rule, the very French and Chinese examples you cite.

Please look for my diary in November.  We will have a good discussion, you and me.

[ Parent ]
Beauprez Staffer(s) to Frog-March? | 130 comments
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